Need to learn about types of steel

B

Bluecanoe

Joined
Mar 30, 2016
Messages
5
Hey yall,

So, feel free to just point me at a different thread if it's in the forum (I'm 90% sure it is, but I'm awful at forum searching apparently).

It's finally time for me to learn about types of steel and what's what. Like "What's 420HC? Is it crappy Chinese steel?" I'd really like to know at a glance so save myself from the dreaded "Well, this knife LOOKS cool, but man, this edge is garbage" moment.

If someone's got an online guide or something bookmarked, can you post it for me?

Thanks
 
Bluecanoe said:
Hey yall,

So, feel free to just point me at a different thread if it's in the forum (I'm 90% sure it is, but I'm awful at forum searching apparently).

It's finally time for me to learn about types of steel and what's what. Like "What's 420HC? Is it crappy Chinese steel?" I'd really like to know at a glance so save myself from the dreaded "Well, this knife LOOKS cool, but man, this edge is garbage" moment.

If someone's got an online guide or something bookmarked, can you post it for me?

Thanks
Click to expand...
Hi . there is an free app you can down load in the app store . it's called knife Steel comparisons as far as I am aware it was created by member of this forum . I have found it very useful over the past year it has a lot of good information . I hope this will help you as much as it as me ;)
 
Great resources mentioned already. A lot of my knowledge comes from developing an interest in a certain knife or certain steel, and then exhausting this forum about that particular type. Do that enough and you'll build a solid knowledge base.

A lot of what you'll come to read here will also be about heat treat and geometry, which both count for a lot. A very poorly heat treated super steel can perform a lot worse then a "lower end" steel that's expertly treated.

Also, you'll probably read a lot that there's no perfect steel, and you'll find a lot of members who prefer certain steels for certain applications. Sometimes corrosion resistance is the most important factor, sometimes it's toughness, sometimes it's sharpenability, and other times it's edge retention. For me, part of the fun is considering all of these different elements together and determining what the "best" steel is for me and for my uses. Ultimately, it's always a balancing act between these elements.

It becomes a really personal kind of hunt if you look at it that way, and it's fun to research a steel and find that it might work really well for you.
 
If you have an I Phone there's a knife steel chart app you can download for free.
 
Welcome to BFC bluecanoe!!!!
There's a wealth of info/discussions about blade steels here on BF. Take the time to learn how to navigate through the different sub forums and you'll learn so much that your head will spin.
I find the in addition to all the charts and composition graphs, peoples experience with steel and the applications they use it for, gives me the best understanding of today's steels in the cutlery
industry.
Folks here are friendly and will help out, never be embarrassed to ask questions. We were all new here once.
 
R.c.s said:
Hi . there is an free app you can down load in the app store . it's called knife Steel comparisons as far as I am aware it was created by member of this forum . I have found it very useful over the past year it has a lot of good information . I hope this will help you as much as it as me ;)
Click to expand...

No luck on iTunes, must be a droid thing.
 
Keep in mind that there are many knives that the steel is listed as just "Inox, surgical stainless, 440", which aren't a particular steel.
 
Just to warn you, this is a rabbithole you can go down as far as you want to. If you're not a steel junky I honestly recommend reading up on a few of the more popular cutlery steels and other than that just researching the steel on the knife you're thinking about buying.
 
420HC is an American steel. Buck and Case both use it. However, it is generally agreed that Buck has a better heat treatment than Case.

MOST people "over think" the steel. "On paper" does not always translate to real world results in the field.

More important than the steel use is the heat treat. Also, of major importance is the intended use.
Condor (who makes an excellent knife) is fond of the 10xx series of steel for their bushcraft knives.
Cold Steel (and others) use 1055 for their machetes; a "softer" steel than 1095. "softer" in the case of a machete is a good thing, the edge is more likely to roll if you hit a knot or rock (or long buried/grown over nail or bullet) than chip.

The long time "standard" for pocket knives is a 1055 to 1095 high carbon steel, 420 HC, a high carbon stainless steel, and the 440A and 440C stainless steels. (I can't think of a knife made with 440B steel), and S30V. Some consider these to be "obsolete" steels, but most major manufacturers use one or more of them, as do some custom makers.

They work. For 99.997% of knife users, they do not need anything else.
The old adage. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" comes to mind.

More power to those who want the latest and greatest "super steel". I don't need it or want it, nor do I need or want the additional cost of a "super steel". Also, do I need or want a knife that can't be sharpened out in the field, should the need arise. My kit weighs enough without adding a specialized sharpening system.
 
chiral.grolim said:
Maintained by Gator:

http://...
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Watch out, that site totally killed my computer. Took me 5 minutes to get things restarted and back to here.


As for blade steels- some sites provide descriptions of the characteristics of various steels. Otherwise it is a hard subject to get information on. Some people will talk about grain size and this and that, but never give you information on how one steel compares to another. Except for Charpy tests or Catra tests, it is very hard to really get an accurate determination of how one steel compares to another. I've read comparison tests where someone cut up a pile of cardboard. In one test S110V stainless steel did better than M4 carbon steel. I did the same test, with identical knife styles and geometry (Spyderco Manix 2) and my results were completely opposite- the M4 did better than S110V.
 
Bluecanoe said:
Hey yall,

So, feel free to just point me at a different thread if it's in the forum (I'm 90% sure it is, but I'm awful at forum searching apparently).

It's finally time for me to learn about types of steel and what's what. Like "What's 420HC? Is it crappy Chinese steel?" I'd really like to know at a glance so save myself from the dreaded "Well, this knife LOOKS cool, but man, this edge is garbage" moment.

If someone's got an online guide or something bookmarked, can you post it for me?

Thanks
Click to expand...

Welcome. My two cents on the subject....

Along the way in your journey to steel junkie, you will, no doubt encounter references to Cliff Stamp.

In my opinion...he's a crackpot with a cult following. I'd avoid any "conclusions" drawn by him, or his adherents at all costs.
 
bdmicarta said:
Watch out, that site totally killed my computer. Took me 5 minutes to get things restarted and back to here.
Click to expand...
1) Don't use IE8 or older. MS Edge, Chrome, new FireFox and Opera, they all handle it w/o issues, but it's still slow due to sheer volume of data.
2) use shortcut url(s) to avoid loading full db, I'll disable that in the future, but for now you can do http://zknives.com/knives/steels/AISI (or substitute AISI with any steel standard supported by app), http://zknives.com/knives/steels/us (or substitue us with country code).
3) Once chart loads use settings button to set up default standard or country to speed up future access.
 
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Gator97 said:
1) Don't use IE8 or older. MS Edge, Chrome, new FireFox and Opera, they all handle it w/o issues, but it's still slow due to sheer volume of data.
2) use shortcut url(s) to avoid loading full db, I'll disable that in the future, but for now you can do http://zknives.com/knives/steels/AISI (or substitute AISI with any steel standard supported by app), http://zknives.com/knives/steels/us (or substitue us with country code).
3) Once chart loads use settings button to set up default standard or country to speed up future access.
Click to expand...

Awesome tips, thank you :thumbup:


to afishhunter, Randall uses 440B as a stainless alternative to O1 in their knives.
 
Bluecanoe said:
Hey yall,

So, feel free to just point me at a different thread if it's in the forum (I'm 90% sure it is, but I'm awful at forum searching apparently).

It's finally time for me to learn about types of steel and what's what. Like "What's 420HC? Is it crappy Chinese steel?" I'd really like to know at a glance so save myself from the dreaded "Well, this knife LOOKS cool, but man, this edge is garbage" moment.

If someone's got an online guide or something bookmarked, can you post it for me?

Thanks
Click to expand...

420HC is actually a pretty decent stainless steel, it's a hardened version of 420C.

420A can also be called 420J1 and 420B can also be called 420J2.

Steels to be avoided: AUS-4, AUS-6, AUS-8 and AUS-10, these are the poor mans versions of 420C, 440A, 440B, and 440C respectively and lacks some elements that the 420 and 440 series have.
 
Mikael Andersson said:
420HC is actually a pretty decent stainless steel, it's a hardened version of 420C.

420A can also be called 420J1 and 420B can also be called 420J2.

Steels to be avoided: AUS-4, AUS-6, AUS-8 and AUS-10, these are the poor mans versions of 420C, 440A, 440B, and 440C respectively and lacks some elements that the 420 and 440 series have.
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Like what?
 
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