New Commander Problems. Derek?

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Ed Jezz

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Dec 1, 2000
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Okay, here we go. After touting the wonders of my new Emerson Commander BTS for the past week or so, all over the internet and to friends and colleagues, I have a (minor?) beef. The phillips screws (9 total) are all rapidly losing their black finish. The single slotted screw is also showing signs of doing the same, although not at the obvious rate that the phillips screws are. So what gives?
I realize that this is first and foremost a working/battle blade and not a custom, but shouldn't we as consumers expect a little more for our hard earned dollars?
I have been carrying this Commander daily for...let's see....10 days now, and it's not like I live in humid/saltwater conditions that would make the screws fade so rapidly. Quite the contrary; I live in the cool mountains of Southern Cali and can think of no environmental conditions that would cause my Commander to lose the blackness. Make no mistake; this is an awesome blade, and I have retired my daily carry Cold Steel GunsiteII which resided inside my waistband for over a year now in favor of my new Commander, and I have no complaints about the quality of my Commander other than the above mentioned screw finish problem. But as Emerson fans we deserve for Emerson products to be absolutley correct straight out of the box and to stay that way for years to come. Correct me if I'm whining here, but I think that this posting is justified.
After checking various blade sites and forums all over the internet, I find that I'm not the only one who has the above mentioned problem with an Emerson blade. Has anyone else HERE in BladeForums experienced the same problem with their Emerson knives? I'd be interested in hearing from you.
Derek, and Ernie if you're listening,... you're company could very easily be the number one manufacturer of tactical knives IF you paid a little more attention to quality control, and listened to the advice and concerns of your hardcore fans a little more carefully. It is my most sincere wish that you do so in the future. I am extremely fond of my Commander , and will continue to carry it daily until Emerson Knives comes out with a model even more impressive than this, ...but what's the deal with the screws? What ARE these screws finished with that causes them to fade so rapidly? If you purchased a new car and the paint began to fade after a week or so, wouldn't you be asking the manufacturer for a reasonable explanation?

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Ed Jezz

"The best toys are the ones that you can put an eye out with."

[This message has been edited by Ed Jezz (edited 12-10-2000).]
 
I have the same 'problem.'

I've heard that you can just ask for new screws from Emerson and they'll give 'em to you. It doesn't really bug me at all.. just as long as they aren't shiney silver. Right now they're just dulled silver with a tinge of black.



[This message has been edited by CatatonicDismay (edited 12-10-2000).]
 
Same here. Nothing new to my experience with factory Emersons. Most all of the screws' darkened color fade rather quickly with normal handling. Most specially on the pivot screw where tip down carry/ deployment is concerned. Personally, it doesn' t bother me much anymore since I learned and somewhat accepted long ago that if I was going to continue to own Emerson products this was something that I' ll have to tolerate. That doesn' t mean that ones concern for this matter should be discounted. Besides, I 'd much rather have to tolerate a screw "problem" than any mechanical QC/ lockup problem any day, which is nothing new as well.

It is notable though, that their pocket clips hold up quite well in this regard. Probably different manufacturers.

L8r,
Nakano
 
You guys need to do yourselves a favor and get a Sebenza. You won't find any complaints in the Chris Reeve forum. No, the Sebenza doesn't have the "I'm going to cut your throat look", and they are expensive. They also make tanto folders and encourage you to take the knife apart, clean and relube and put it back together. What more could you want. But I guess if you don't mind the frustration that comes from buying knives that have hoo hum quality, then stick with Emerson. Unless of course you could get a custom but that will set you back a good $1,400.00 and even those aren't the greatest of quality. But I guess that the bragging rights are worth all that money.
 
Scott Dog

Why post in the Emerson Forum to criticize the people that buy them? I guess you're trying to enlighten us
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[This message has been edited by VOODOO CHILD (edited 12-10-2000).]
 
Why not just get a Sebenza? Well, what does "Sebenza" mean? It must mean "ugly knife that costs twice as much as a production Emerson." Or is Sebenza a word that somehow defines that "I'm going to butter your bread" look? No thanks. Faded finishes on the screws won't kill me. I just think that this would be an easy problem for Emerson to remedy, and it would go a long way towards improving quality control issues. Not a huge step, but a good one in the right direction. Enjoy your Sebenza, and I'll happily keep my Commander.

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Ed Jezz

"The best toys are the ones that you can put an eye out with."

[This message has been edited by Ed Jezz (edited 12-10-2000).]
 
Scott Dog, why is it that you only post here to critize people, last time i checked this is a place where we are free to make a choice as educated adults that work hard for there money. I do own a Sebenza (96 vintage )great knife but completely different from Emerson (have owned 8 customs. I also have had or owned customs from the best out there and they all have there pros/cons but every ones taste is different and that what make collecting great. Something you really enjoy collecting i probably don't but i don't go out and make posts that put people down for there choices. Just my honest opinion, venting.

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Carpe' Diem
Usual Suspect AKA Tattoo
 
Buy any knife you like! It's a free country. I was only suggesting that you would save yourselves alot of problems by buying knives from a company that cares about the type of products that they send out. You need to look no further than this forum to find several quality control issues While you continue to keep fixing your production Emersons, I enjoy the quality of my Sebenza and I don't have to worry about it falling apart everytime I open it. I'm not putting you guys down, just trying to broaden your horizons. If you like to fantisize about ripping someones heart out, then Emerson is the knife for you. Happiness is in the eyes of the beholder. Go right ahead and make Ernie rich.
 
We're here to talk about Emerson knives in the Emerson forum.

I fantasize about ripping people's hearts out every day mind you! Haha.

 
No Offense fellas but I have to agree with scott dog.I own a CQC6, Plus most of the production models,plus I own 2 sebenzas sorry but you cant beat the quality of a sebenza,It just that I dont trust the paper thin liners on the emersons,besides my CQC6 that I DO WEAR,Those liners are to thin,besides In my opinon it is what you know not what a knife looks like!I dont trust my life to the production emersons but i will trust my life on a sebenza!
 
Screw finish is NOT within Emerson's control. Screws are purchased parts, and the corrective action is with the screw manufacturer!

Screws can be black oxided, phosphated and oiled, plated, etc. Depending on application, a plated screw can be nice. All these finishes are done by the screw manufacturer.

It is unlikely that Emerson would see the deficiency in the screw finish while it was still in the shop. Emerson's only possible corrective action remains to deal with the screw manufacturer, and offer customers replacements if desired!
 
EDGE1

I understand what you're saying, but I'd still have to disagreee. I can't speak for anyone else, but for me a folder is nothing but a back up blade to a bigger fixed blade, just like a neck knife. In my opinion there is no substitute for a good fixed blade(not even the almighty sebenza
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. I don't trust my life to any folder. However, if someone got lucky and managed to take my fixed blade from me(a big IF
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) I would much rather have my Commander than a sebenza. The commander has 2 important advantages in that situation: quick access and a blade design which allows for more aggressive cuts.

[This message has been edited by VOODOO CHILD (edited 12-11-2000).]
 
CatatonicDismay

I always have something more reliable than a folder all the time. If I could carry a firearm I would. But as of now I carry anything from an expandable baton, to a Tops Hawk Recon in a Bladerigger harness
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Here's what I call an IDEAL self defense package:

Primary weapon, back up fixed blade(small), neck knife, folder, JSP V-gar belt
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.

Please note that I don't carry this much stuff (wish I could) and I don't even own the V-gar belt(wish I did).


[This message has been edited by VOODOO CHILD (edited 12-11-2000).]
 
Howdy! Ok so we know opinons vary LOL,It is I feel the commander has to much of a recurve blade for such a small knife,recurves belong on big knives.
vooDoo I understand nothing beats a fixed blade as I carry a Mike Snoody Kwakien Myself
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but i dont trust those liners toooo thin my brother!
 
What is all of this, "cut your throat, rip your heart out" bullsh*t?

I don't fantasize about anything anymore except peace on Earth and a safe country. That is not going to happen.

You seem to think that the average person on here that carries an Emerson is also a fan of Bruno Magli shoes and Isotoner gloves.
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And the, "make Ernie rich" statement more or less shows everyone where your head is at and exactly what your real motivation is in this Forum.

If you would have left these things out, you would have come across much more rational, intelligent and unbiased.

Here is a clue for everyone...all across this country, every day, human beings die from the legal and illegal application of folding knives. Most of them are no where even approaching the quality of an Emerson Commander.

The idea of saying that is not to link knives or Ernie's knives to any illegal activity, but to simply state that sometimes the need for strength is a Red Herring and an excuse to make everything a folding or fixed prybar.

I have some of these knives, they work for me and I have had no problems. And most certainly, the finish on a screw is not going to effect my ability to defend myself.
 
I hear ya ,but I still dont like them liners I would like to see them thicker Iwill not use a knife as a prybar that is what um prybars are for but when you make a knife fold,it should when opened be strong not have the liners bend,with the commander the design of the blade is cool looking very tactical! But it profile is to blunt as a slasher or cutter it works great still that recurve is a bit much(by the way I have 2 commanders)for thrusting to blunt I need a knife that is a slim profile for both the sebenza has both plus a tough lock to boot!
No offense I like ernies knives like i said I have and carry a CQC6,but my productions dont match up to my sebenzas,now if ernie makes a integral lock Hmmmmmm,that would be cool!!!!
Just my opinons boys!
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It is your opinion and you are entitled to it.

However, the common screwdriver has basically *owned* the #2 spot in the edged weapons category for "Civilian Homicide" in this country for years. Heavy duty shears have also been used for many years in "Civilian Homicide." These are two powerful thrusting weapons. They have no real cutting ability, just as the icepick is deadly with the same lack of a slashing ability.

When you consider the fact that every ounce of your arm, shoulder and at times, the power of your hips and legs will be focused on a point, the Commander's ability to thrust becomes rather stellar, doesn't it? There is a razor-sharp edge there as well on the forefront that actually forms the point of the Commander. This is also something shears and screwdrivers lack.

Now, the goal of the conversation is not to say, "Well, the Commander is a sharpened pair of shears or a screwdriver." It is to point out the mechanics of wounding and the reality of the physical application of a blade in flesh and not in someone's mind.

1. Skill
2. Weapon
3. Knowledge

"Knowledge" encompasses alot. Not only anatomy and the trauma of wounding and knowing where to cut and thrust and why you cut or thrust there, but to examine and study in-depth the mechanics of it in the real world and not in someone's biased opinion.

This is not meant to be macabre or just to put forth, "blood and gore for effect." It is to somehow bring some sanity to an issue that is really a non-issue to begin with.

When you compare a Commander with a SOCFK (Spearpoint or Tanto), which will thrust "better?" It is a non-issue. Which will thrust "easier?" Probably the Tanto or Spearpoint.

Mark Fuhrman thinks that a "certain someone" used a Swiss Army Knife to murder two people. In his book, "Murder in Brentwood," he states clearly that he believes the knife used was a lockback Swiss Army Knife.

These knives have very thin blades. There was no broken off blade in either body found.

The "Suspect" in the case had a cut finger, however. What does this point to?

When you examine the evidence presented but never really discussed, someone thrusted Ron Goldman in the chest cavity, one thrust split a rib (read the Autopsy report). The thin blade did not break. In all probability, a large man's grip was weaker than a thin blade with a lock inferior to a liner lock. Due to the presence of blood, no guard or even an integral guard, slick grips and a thrust that was powerful enough to split a human rib, it appears someone cut their finger.

By the looks of the hysteria over strength and piercing ability, one would think that a snapped off blade would have been found on the ground or in a body. That never happened. To think that someone would cut two people up, snap a blade and then hunt for the snapped-off portion on the ground is not really grounded in reality either.

The human body is tough, yet it is frail. To think that you need something so incredibly strong that will not break when you hang barbell weights off of it, is just a non-issue to me.

I would rather have a really good knife that will slash and thrust well, and opens really fast. The Commander and the SOCFK both fit that bill...

You people know how hard you can punch with your palm or fist or pound on a bag with a hammerfist. You know your muscle power and your body weight in motion as well as the torque involved at twisting your torso to generate power. When all of that is focused on a point, that point has the ability to even penetrate bone.

I have X-rays somewhere of a piece of trash, Flea Market "Survival Knife" stuck in someone's skull, to the guard. With all of the hysteria regarding blade/handle area weakness, who would have thought that would ever happen?

Pardon the pun, but the myth that the Commander will not reliably thrust is moot.


View
 
LMFAO
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Go Don
(Sound of applause in the background)

Guys, guys, guys

Wasn't there a string recently about how civil the Emerson Forum was.
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I . . . enjoy the points of view that a Commander lacks any penetration ability just as much as the "Chisel ground blades won't cut" and the "Right side, Left Side, Red Fish, Blue Fish, One Fish, Two Fish" strings.

Don and Voodoo, you presented your cases in an excellent manor. I couldn't agree more.

The Sebenza is an excellent knife. No kidding, I really like them and have owned a couple in the past.

If someone is dead set against Commanders (or any other design), all the logic in the world isn't going to change their mind. I'm reminded of the story about trying to teach a pig to sing.
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Bottom line everyone, carry what makes you happy and works for your style . . . then carry a Glock for defensive usage.

John

[This message has been edited by John Hollister (edited 12-11-2000).]
 
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