New kitchen knife -- pretty exciting

A fluted steel can be used also so that any steel removal is trivial. Just use it with very little pressure. That's actually the way steels should be used anyway. When some one bears down with a steel to try to restore an edge, that just indicates it is time to remove some steel that is less trivial (with something else, of course.)
 
Hello all - I read here often, but seldom post.

Thought the group would be interested that I just took delivery of a HW laminated kitchen knife that I pre-ordered back in May.

The carbon fibre handle is beautiful, but smaller that any other kitchen knife I own. However, I have to say that it feels very nice in the hand, and the knife is very controllable. Very nice smooth, almost luxurious feel to the handle.

The transition line between the outer and center laminates of the blade is very visible. Looks almost like a hamon, which is what I thought it was a first glance. The fit, finish and grind are first rate, as you'd expect from WH (I'm told that this particualr knife ws assembled by Matt Conable himself).

I've only cut up a chicken with it so far, but I can report that it is very sharp out of the box. About as sharp as I've ever been able to get a knife using my Tormek.

I'm happy with it, even considering the price
 
HoB said:
Also, Mr. Glesser has reported on several occations that their tests at Spyderco actually showed that S30V at 57-59 Rc was perfoming better than at harder Rc's and was still having twice the edge retention of ATS-34 hardened to 59-61. If roll is the major factor in edge retention the two steels should have a much more comparable edge retention with the harder steel possibly even pulling ahead.

HoB: What tests did Sal use to determine that S30V was performing better at the lower Rc? If it was a test that favored wear resistance and toughness, the results make perfect sense. If you want to know about edge retention for kitchen knives, you need to do kitchen-y type testing.
 
HoB, couple of astute points there, yes, in regards to metal removal it is only a minute amount necessary if you focus it right at the edge, which a steel does, so if it removed even a little it might produce results, and thus you could argue that when steeling this maybe the effect. However this logic doesn't hold for two reasons :

1) you can see the deformation before and see it gone after, you really can't see metal removed on that scale (x10 mag, bends are fraction of a mm)

2) if it was metal removal you would expect it to continue, that is 10 passes should be more productive than 2, however steeling either produces results right away or does nothing

After the deformation has been fixed, which happens in the first pass or two, the performance does not keep increasing *unless* of course you really lean down and actual work harden and smear the blade out, JJ has pictures of this in his book. This makes the edge really weak however and it will break off.

As for Spyderco, I would have to know exactly what was done, in general though there is a lot of CATRA testing performed and that is highly dependent on wear resistance because the blade ie held rigid and thus lateral forces (which cause ripples) are minimized and the force just goes right into the blade, perpendicular.

Unless you are a robot, you can't use a knife like that, even if you are really skilled there will be lots of side play and thus deformation sets in and the edge blunts. This is one of the reasons that if you keep doing work with a knife the edge retention keeps increasing.

Try cutting rope with the same blade for example, and you will note (if you have not done a lot of it before) that with each sharpening, over time, you tend to be able to cut more rope, this is just due to you getting better and better and getting the force to be perpendicular.

As a really extreme example of that, Buck did CATRA testing on their IonFusion models, it scored retardly high, but in field use, the edge retention could not be matched to nearly anywhere close to the CATRA tests, why, because CATRA tests would induce a "rat's tooth" sharpening effect which will not be productive for a person.

Aside from the theory, Alvin Johnson and Mike Swaim looked at this extensively back in pre-1996 (it was done when I first came on), there was a lot of testing of plain 1095 at 65+ HRC against a lot of knives with high wear resistance and they all failed to last as long as they were a lot softer. However when both were combined (M2) the edge retention when up again.

Specific to Alvin's work, some of the steels like ATS-34 had a problem forming edges at the low angles he used (~3-5 degrees) due to problems with grain size.

-Cliff
 
  • Like
Reactions: HoB
Ah, great! Awesome information Cliff! Thanks a lot!

Yes, Joe, Mr. Glesser was quoting CATRA tests.
 
Back
Top