New Mill and Milling Station - What did I get myself into???

[Erin Burke]

This is going to be a long, photo-intensive thread.

This year I got a smokin' tax refund and decided to pick up a couple of tools that I've always wanted. The first thing I pick up was a Millermatic 212 Mig. The second thing on my list was a bench-top mill. I decided on the Sieg X3 model sold by Grizzly (G0463). This thread chronicles some of my adventures - so far - in getting this mill.

The first step in the process was finding space, and building a station on which to place the mill. My shop is in the basement of my house and is VERY small (about 9'x21' if I remember correctly). The photo below shows the north wall of my shop before I started.

You can see my drill press in the far left corner. The roaster on the two horses is filled with Parks 50, and right next to it is my kiln. As you can see, I have some work to do.

So I went to my local recycled cabinetry store and bought 57" of old kitchen cabinets for my new bench. While there, I also found two 1-1/2" tabletops that fit perfectly over the cabinets. I figured I'd double them up to make a nice, 3"-thick heavy-duty bench-top to support the mill's 353lbs of advertised weight. The problem with the two tabletops, however, was that they were only 1-1/2" thick around the edges. In the middle, they were only 3/4" thick. The photos below show my solution to the problem.

That's right... those are 2x4's in the middle. As we all know, a 2x4 is actually 1-1/2" thick... a perfect fit for the hollow space between the two table-tops. They are glued...

... and screwed together. AWESOME...

And there's also a meaty surprise underneath the new top. It seemed to me that the weak point in the cabinets was between the two big drawers/doors. There was just not much support in there. So I took two lengths of 1-1/4" pipe with flanges on the ends and placed them so that they run vertically between the drawers/doors from the underside of the bench-top down to the concrete floor beneath. I wish I had taken a photo before I put the top on.

I did however take a photo of me testing the bench's load-bearing capacity... you know... just for fun.

The photo speaks for itself.

 

[J. Hoover]

Come on Erin, what came off the truck dude........................

 

[Erin Burke]

So then I ordered the mill... and the accessories. Don't get me started on the accessories...
Packages started showing up on my doorstep yesterday... from Grizzly, Enco, and various Ebay sellers. But today - today the big crate showed up. I took the whole afternoon off from work, because the FedEx freight guys told me they would deliver between 1pm and 3pm. Turns out the truck didn't end up getting here until about 5:30. Oh well.

This is what came off the lift gate of the truck.

This was a much bigger crate than I had expected. Thankfully I have this handy red HF hand-truck. No problemo. Nothing me and a couple of friends couldn't handle, right??? Hmmm - one problem - turns out all my friends either were busy or had just had shoulder surgery. I guess when the doctor said "don't lift anything too heavy", he probably DID mean things like 450lb crates.

Still, I'm a fairly big boy. And I got this red hand-truck see.

Unfortunately, I've also got these seven stairs to overcome. Yup... that's my basement shop door down there.

Dang. Time to call the wife.

So a couple of problems presented themselves at this point:

1. My trusty red hand-truck doesn't like to roll very well on soft grass... especially when being pushed toward the top of a steep flight of stairs.
2. The crate just did not want to approach the stairs at the right angle. I can't really explain it clearly, but wheel divots in the grass kept making the top of the crate bang into the side of my house.
3. When things don't go right, I get frustrated.

Fortunately my wife has a calming spirit...
So she went inside while I proceeded to rip the sides off the crate... and then, all by my lonesome, I drove my new milling machine down the stairs. And guess what... I made it. Needless to say, we can never move now. We're in this house forever.

The next trick was getting the mill (still attached to the base of the crate) from the bottom of the stairs into my shop. The base of the crate is 30.25" wide (on the short side). My doorway is 31" wide... but only if I remove the door, which I did. With the judicious application of pipe rollers I was able to get the unit through the door. Then, I was able to tip the unit again, so my wife could slip the HF rolling base under everything.

And here is where my new X3 mill is sitting now.

Now my next big task if to figure out how to get it up on the bench.

I'm thinking about renting a hydraulic scissor table, since I don't think I have enough head-height (or room) for an engine hoist. Any other ideas?

Erin

 

[J. Hoover]

That's a much bigger mill than I expected, seeing it in perspective with the cabinet and other tools it looks downright big. Is disassembling it out of the question? If so three good men should be able to hoist it up. Exactly what is the weight on that unit. Very nice looking machine, I know you will enjoy using it, after the headache of getting it in place is complete. Congratulations.

Just as a afterthought, how about using some 4 wheeler ramps to roll it up on. Might be a stupid idea but I figured I would throw it out there.

 

[balibalistic]

Looking good, brother!!

i would suggest you take her apart. you really should clean all the red grease and crap out of all the important area's. i dont think you'd have much trouble moving it if disassembled in three parts.., head, table and frame..

 

[LX_Emergency]

Good excuse for a BBQ. Get some friends over for a BBQ and tell them meat's on me if you guys help me lift some little thing.

 

[Erin Burke]

That's a much bigger mill than I expected, seeing it in perspective with the cabinet and other tools it looks downright big. Is disassembling it out of the question?

i would suggest you take her apart. you really should clean all the red grease and crap out of all the important area's. i dont think you'd have much trouble moving it if disassembled in three parts.., head, table and frame..

Joseph & Shawn... I will definitely be taking the table off. From what I understand, I'll have to do that to install some of the DRO brackets anyway. Plus - like Shawn said - I'll want to clean all the red stuff from the nooks and crannies. I'm not planning on taking the head off for lifting however... my ceiling height is not great enough to be able to reinstall it on the column once the unit is on the bench-top (assuming the head is removed/installed at the top of the column... I'll need to look closer later).

If so three good men should be able to hoist it up. Exactly what is the weight on that unit.

Good excuse for a BBQ. Get some friends over for a BBQ and tell them meat's on me if you guys help me lift some little thing.

The spec sheet HERE says that the machine weights 353lbs and that the shipping weight is 445lbs. The MANUAL has the same machine weight listed (353lbs), but gives the shipping weight as 372lbs. I'm sure that three guys could lift 353lbs easily if it were attached to a weight bar... but this unit doesn't have a lot of places for three dudes to grab on. This is definitely an awkward 353lbs.

Just as a afterthought, how about using some 4 wheeler ramps to roll it up on. Might be a stupid idea but I figured I would throw it out there.

This is one of the approaches that I am considering. I am also thinking about (as mentioned in my previous post) renting a hydraulic scissor lift table... if I can find one that doesn't weigh even more than the mill.

I'll have to put this project on the backburner over the weekend though. My little sister is graduating tomorrow. :thumbup:

Erin

 

[Patrickknives]

I found the take it apart and buying a 12 pack with some friends worked great in getting it up and running with no hurting parts, looks great now you can spend your excess cash on milling jigs, fixtures, and parts. Here is a link to a great minimill supply, they have everything. If you send your email they have great monthly specials.

http://littlemachineshop.com/

 

[richard j]

erin, if your ceiling is open and exposed you can attach a pulley system to the floor joists and a use a ramp to pull the mill up on the table.

 

[Salem Straub]

Wow erin, entertaining thread. No better feeling than a new AWESOME toy showing up at your door. It's a time consuming and meticulous process, but if all else fails you could just get a pile of scrap wood and a jack and just jack/shim that crate bottom back and forth on both sides, then when you get to bench height skid it onto the top...

 

[Atlas Knife Company]

I had a similar problem, lifting something really heavy. It turns out levers are a great tool. Your average car jack can easily lift 500 lbs. 6-8" at a time. Three jacks are required to do it safely and and keep the load stable. Jack up a couple inches at a time on each jack. It turns out that that is just enough to brace it up and slide a pallet underneath. Do this 3-4 times and you've raised it enough to get it up onto the table.

Bricks also work really well and they are easier to maneuver than pallets. Cinder blocks are functional, but too tall for some smaller jacks. Although, if you have a couple of the really old bumper jacks, you can probably do it in one shot.

 

[Atlas Knife Company]

What is the ceiling like above the work area? Perhaps a block and tackle or pulley to lift it up?

 

[Abrasive]

The first thing I pick up was a Millermatic 212 Mig.

Off topic but congrats on the welder. I love the hell out of my MM 210.

Dave

 

[R.H.Clark]

Is there any way to remove your table top? If so just set it beside the crate bottom and slide it onto your table top.You could use some cardboard to keep from scratching it.Then three or four guys should have no problem putting the top back on the table with the mill attached.

 

[peter r]

that red goop stuff is a bitch. wear shitty clothes when you clean it off.

 

[Abrasive]

Rent an engine hoist. The lift point doesn't have to be above the column.
or
Disassemble (hell, removing the head would probably do it) and get it up in pieces.
or
Improvise a ramp and slide it up.

Doesn't look like it, but are there any holes in the sides of the base casting? Sometimes there are holes where you can put pipes through, cross-ways, and lift it like a stretcher.

Really I think baliballistic has the best idea. Disassemble, clean, DEBURR, and reassemble in place.

Dave

 

[Erin Burke]

...now you can spend your excess cash on milling jigs, fixtures, and parts. Here is a link to a great minimill supply, they have everything. If you send your email they have great monthly specials.

http://littlemachineshop.com/

Hah... no doubt. I've already spent more money on accessories than I spent on the mill... and I have a long way to go yet.

erin, if your ceiling is open and exposed you can attach a pulley system to the floor joists and a use a ramp to pull the mill up on the table.

I think that this is my best bet. :thumbup: The ceiling is open, so I'll probably borrow some tractor ramps from a friend and pull the mill up the slope.

Off topic but congrats on the welder. I love the hell out of my MM 210.

Dave

Hey Dave... forgive me, but I transposed/mis-entered my numbers. The welder that I bought is the MM 211... not the bigger MM 212. I think that the 212 is similar in size and capacity to your 210. Mine is quite a bit smaller.

Improvise a ramp and slide it up.

Yup... seems like the way to go. :thumbup:

Doesn't look like it, but are there any holes in the sides of the base casting? Sometimes there are holes where you can put pipes through, cross-ways, and lift it like a stretcher.

Really I think baliballistic has the best idea. Disassemble, clean, DEBURR, and reassemble in place.

Dave

No holes... boy would those be handy though.
I will be disassembling the table for cleaning and DRO installation, but I do not plan on removing the head... too many wires and such to deal with.

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I'll be sure to post more progress photos as this project progresses.

Erin

 

[Abrasive]

Hey Dave... forgive me, but I transposed mis-enteredmy numbers. The welder that I bought is the MM 211... not the bigger MM 212. I think that the 212 is similar in size and capacity to your 210. Mine is quite a bit smaller.

No prob - it's still blue. That box will get 'er done. You're gonna love it!

In fact, it looks like it'll push the same amperage, just a lower duty cycle. For a home shop, that's great. The box weighs half as much, and I don't think many of us lay tons of bead non-stop.

Dave

 

[NickWheeler]

Can't you just get Nick Wheeler to pick it up and put it on the bench???

Cool stuff bud.... now you've got TWO tools you don't know how to use!

You did your research though, and I know you'll get it all figured out quick. That little mill should work well for you.

I would shy away from a 2.5" face mill with a mill that size though. Rigidity plays a huge role there. In my experience, you'd be better off getting a 3 or 4 insert end mill in the 1.5" range. A 2.5" face mill is a lot of mass in motion on a small machine.

 

[Erin Burke]

Can't you just get Nick Wheeler to pick it up and put it on the bench???

Now that's hilarious... I almost posted the same thing. I mean that anvil you have hanging on the wall weighs more than this machine. I didn't figure anyone would get the joke though, because Nick Wheeler don't hang around these parts much anymore.

Cool stuff bud.... now you've got TWO tools you don't know how to use!

I got way more than two tools that I don't know how to use. But with the one tool that matters, I'm a genius.
{6/5/10 Edit: Wife says "genius" may be an over-exaggeration. }

I would shy away from a 2.5" face mill with a mill that size though. Rigidity plays a huge role there. In my experience, you'd be better off getting a 3 or 4 insert end mill in the 1.5" range. A 2.5" face mill is a lot of mass in motion on a small machine.

I went with a 2" face mill. We'll see what happens.

Been over a year since I was down there... your schedule open up yet. Or maybe you could come up here and throw my mill on the bench.