New Schrade catalog

R

RusCus7

Joined
Aug 12, 2005
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2
I am very interested in Schrade and other knives. I have recently been reading some of the past post with much interest and have found great knowledge about Schrade and its history.
I had the opportunity to attend a knife show in Wilmington Ohio and visit with some very nice dealers. One dealer had the new Schrade catalog, there are over 100 new patterns of Schrade that are on the market today. This dealer had approximately 50 new patterns. I asked him about the Schrade sales and he stated that he had a strong show and would be reordering on Monday from Blue Ridge Knife Company in Marion Va.
I studied the product line and I felt the quality was very good, I purchased all the new Schrade patterns in Sheep Horn. I think Sheep Horn is very pretty. I am getting pleasure out of hunting for old patterns and new.
I asked questions about the new ownership and one dealer told me that he personally knew Stewart Taylor of Taylor Cutlery, that he used to work the knife shows many years ago. He said that Mr. Taylor was a very nice person and all three of his sons were Eagle Scouts (that impressed me!!!). He told me to feel free to call Stewart Taylor direct if I needed any information concerning knives (423-247-2406).
After reading some of the negative past posts I wish this company and others in the knife business the best of luck.
 
ummm....I got nothing...



Oh yeah!

Welcome, there is a plethora of information to be found. If you like Schrades, this is the place to be...

Glenn
 
It sounds like you had a good time at the knife show. You have a chore ahead of you if you intend to collect all 100 of those Chinese knife patterns though. Less than two dozen have been imported so far.


Codger
 
I was in Wilmington and noticed very few Schrades, old or new. In fact I can only remember 2 dealers who had more than a couple. One dealer had a mint Schrade-Walden 25OT with sheath for $45 which I probably should have purchased since I didn't have one and I doubt I will find one any less.

I don't recall see any new Schrades. If there were 50 they couldn't have been on the tables because I would have noticed.

What part of the room was the dealer in? If you can give me a description of the area I can try to figure out how I missed it.
 
I was at the show Sunday morning. At the Roberts center as you enter to the show the dealer was on the right front near the very center. I recall his name Dan Dudy and I believe he was from Kentucky. I remember him saying he would be displaying in Louisville Ky in two weeks. If you go to the Louisville show check it out. Hope this helps, RusCus7
 
I do not know Mr Taylor however I did see him at the Schrade Auction prior to that I did see his picture in a knife magazine or similar some 20 years earlier in which he was with an oriental man the story involved the future development of imported knives. I am sure the quality of Mr Taylors imported products will continue to improve until he has no competition after which I feel his caring partners will export what ever quality they wish. So now is a good time to collect them. I am sorry you find criticism of the quality of his products and the fact that they are made by the communist Chinese and not made in the USA, a negative aspect. I was under the impression that to discuss these matters was still a right of every american ( but perhapes that has changed and to do so is considered by some to be a negative action ) However I do respect your right to feel the way you do. I also wish Mr Taylor and his ventures Luck. I just do not understand what part of the contrived situation involves luck this deck has been stacked for quite awhile. I also am impressed since you informed me that three of his sons were Eagle scouts. I like ( apparently) yourself have a very high regard for this organization My only question regarding this is while his sons were Eagle scouts did they carry communist chinese made scout knives? Mr Taylor is the wave of the future whatever future there is going to be. I am one person with one very small opinion there are a very limited amount of people who post here and overall a miniscule amount of people in general who even care or know anything about the subject. I am personally truly sorry if this massive amount of contention mentioned here is distressful to any reader because of anything which is not of a positive or is of a questioning nature regarding any products or business procedures. The good part is that under a communist form of government people would not have to be subject to these kinds of comments, so perhapes if we buy enough knives in the future none of us will have to put up with dissent. AHHHH SOOOO. LT
 
Hi, I would like to add my ten cents worth to the Chinese verses local issue. As from a South African point, a few years ago our Goverment made trade agreements with China and are now bearing the "fruits" of that agreement. High unemployment in some of our industries, textile the main one. I personally found quality , besides ethics, to be the main factor in not buying Chinese. So I know how you feel about the issue, but the mighty $ wins in the end.
I am still looking out for Schrades (USA) this side of the world to add to my small collection. (7OT,8OT,165OT,13OT).
Regards to all
Derick
 
I can see how a first time visitor here to the Schrade Knife collector's forum might misinterpret what they read regarding Taylor, Pipes, China, etc. It has been but a relatively short time since Schrade was murdered (purposely killed with intent and forethought) by a combination of insider ineptitude and outright betrayal, outsider lending cartel interferance, changing market forces, mass merchandiser predatory practices, buyer indifference, and a host of other factors. A person who has no brand loyalty to Imperial Schrade, who has not followed the details of the demise closely from the beginning, who does not care if American industry is being stripped piecemeal from this country will not understand. I will not debate the pros and cons of buying Chinese goods. For that, you can go to this thread, among others.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=191401&page=1&pp=20
But it is my contention that the people involved in the planning and execution of Imperial Schrade's demise, and who now seek to enjoy the fruits of their efforts do not deserve my patronage. The people who were the most immediate victims (employees, management, the American people) do.

A very large portion of my brand loyalty was connected to the 100 year heritage that came with every Schrade knife. For me, that heritage did not transfer with the name, trademarks, patterns, etc. Neither did the quality I had come to expect from the generations of New York cutlers. As long as there are relics of the original cutlers products on the market that interest me, that is where most of my collecting money will go. And to the American companies whose continuation of the original patterns is produced domesticly.

Derick, the supply of original Schrade knives is still plentiful. At least here in the States. And prices have leveled out after the spring frenzy. Now is a very good time to acquire the patterns you seek. Let us know if we can be of any help in your search.

Codger
 
Thanks Codger for the tip. I will try to find Schrades in South Africa first and then mybe look State side later. All my Schrades I bought about ten years ago so it is not just a recent intrest in Schrade. My small collection consists of 8OT,7OT,13OT and your favorite 165OT

Thanks

Derick
 
With regard to the most recent posts in this thread by LT and Codger I have but one thing to add.....


ME TOO!!!

Paul
 
Codger 64, after reading your post it sounds to me that you are saying Taylor, Pikes and the past President of Schrade did planning for Schrade's demise.

I know that Smokey Mountain has purchased over one million dollars per year for the last several years from Schrade. This would mean to me great support for Schrade.

The past President of Schrade, I understand has started a new knife company. Did he plan this all the time to help his new company? Or are you saying he was trying to make Schrade fail. I would not think a president of a company would try to do this.

As for Taylor in some of his older catalogs he sold Buck, Case, Gerber, Schrade and his imports. This shows me that he had supported Schrade in the past. Was he this powerful to have the banks shut Schrade down?

I do not believe in any way that there was a conspiracy as some state with no proof.

For me I am against imports especially from Germany and Japan. Americans need to remember how many people we lost because of these two countries. I am saying don't buy their cars, knives etc... from these real enemies.
ww2bill
 
This entire history has been written and rehashed it along with almost every variation of opinion should be in the archives but since it seems to have started up again perhapes I can assist in explaining the circumstances. Schrade the last couple of years because of the prevailing market ( WALMART ect) had begun to use foreign parts and assemble some of those items in the USA. Schrade TOOLs were one example. There lines of kitchen cutlery were also imported in effect this was considered by some to be mistake upon the part of the owners and higher managment (who in effect simply had to enforce these decisions.) As a result of attempting to enlarge and compete ( in effect to control ) these markets Schrade invested in new machinery and started new more modern lines of knife production. Was this wise? Was this managments fault? Was it the fault of the owners ( who as I understand it were pretty much out of the loop and only really cared about getting there annual stipend. ONE MILLION is the number I have heard. Whoevers fault this decision was the fact is. These newer lines patterns the expansions ect ment that they Schrade needed more financing. So as you or I would they went to the bank. A bank they had dealt with for some time and never had a problem with. They ( the bank ) looked at the plan and approved the money ( as I understand it even more money if it was needed. ) So Schrade made the changes with the belief that there was plenty of time to develop the new markets while sustaining the older traditional lines. Now believe it or not the communist chinese are not our friends I know that is a harsh opinion in this era but just as you feel ( and I concur ) many of those white markers in Arlington were put there because of the Japs and Krauts ( pardon my vernacular ). There are quite a few put there with Chinese assistance, from Korea and Viet Nam. Sorry I digress you see those friends of mine laying under those markers cannot speak for themselves or have a beer, or make babys and that pisses me off so sometimes I ramble and get emotional for them.

OK back to Schrade. At this point all should be well Schrade is expanding is taking americans off the unemployment and welfare lines. Hiring handicapped people giving them a little pride in there lives ( by giving them repetitive factory jobs that no one else wants to do.) Was a good neighbor to the surrounding communitys and supporting every charity they were ever asked to help. Now This did not sit well in some countrys because these peoples goal has and is to eventually control all of these markets. As I have pointed out in the past certain countrys have no labor problems especially when you have prisons full of political prisoners ( many who are in prison for there democratic beliefs and support of this country ). No OSHA problems here carcinigens by making pearl handles not a problem when one dies just stick another one on the machine. Payroll No problem one bowl of rice a day ( er maybe ) . So back to the tale of Schrade.

Suddenly out of the blue Schrades bank is bought be another larger bank. (Must have been a coincidence ) by the way Schrade was only one of the chips in this move. They come in and look around crunch some numbers and say we are calling in the loan. 12 Million is the figure I heard. Schrade says listen we have guaranteed orders right now for 1 MILLION knives. Most are already made in stock all we have to do is ship and wait for payment. Sorry says Mr Big Bank no can do. Pay Up or close up. Yup the orders were in and much of the stock made. Does that possibly sound like a bank that had an agenda? But then you would say wait a minute that still is a lot of money for a bank or anyone to give up just to bust the competition. You would be right but you see the yellow devil ( whoops there I go again ) is devious. So here is how the rest of the hand played out. You see the deck was stacked right from the beginning. So the first part of the plan is complete Schrade is out. The gooks are in they own the market. Now we come to the rest of the story.

At the auction lots were set up so that only someone with big backing really had any chance of buying the important items. I believe it was lot 4 WIP work in progress was so large that literally any one buying it would have needed a factory to store it I cannot begin to tell you of the amount of stuff. ( All those knives that were made and sold ) Imagine a high scool gymnasium filled from top to bottom ( like a suit case ) then double or triple it. immense. Millions it sold for 34,000 dollars. Do you know why? because no one could move or store it. I figgured it would have cost me 5000 a week to store it let alone move it. Why was it not broken up and sold why do you think because the bank didn't care what it got back ( losses are a write off ) They knew where it was going to the american partners already selling the chinese stuff they produce. The factory collection was sold in one lot it went for 125 thousand. I know buyers from all over the country some of those pieces ( from the old personal Mirando collect will bring 10,000 a piece.) The reason I was given that it was not sold piecemeal ( as originally planned ) was because it would take to long. Yes we wouldn't want to tie up the auction company for a few days when it ment millions. Give me a break it was sold intact because the bank could care less the collection was sold to Pipes who said he would keep it intact for the knife museum or display it himself. Yea right. Items like machinery and items that were not needed or to expensive to ship out of the country were auctioned piece by piece some for a few dollars you see there was time for that. So now factor 2 is complete Using an american front these items can now be sold and the banks losses ( which become writeoffs ) and now can be recouped through the sale of the items through the american front. Which brings us to part 3 Mr Taylor who now buys the IP intellectual property names, patents, rights, ect. I watched Mr Taylor bid it was very strange ( you see I play a lot of poker and I like to look and the players faces when I do ). Mr Taylor bid 3.25 or 3.65 MILLION ( I forget which ) he actually looked bored. All he was doing was what he was told. It didn't matter what it went for because whatever was spent was going right back to the bank which in effect were the same people buying the IP. If Taylor and God were bidding Taylor would have won because he had more backing. Taylor now starts making the knives in China by his bosses ( er partners ).

Now everything is almost complete Schrade is KAPUT, The bank gets a write off. All the money is regrouped by sales of stock. Parts (from Schrade) are assembled more money is made. Taylor starts selling chinese imports under Schrade name. Chinese companies own the market. Pipes and Taylor continue as American fronts often instituting programs to show there patriotism. The american public starts to assimilate these products quickly forgetting or never really knowing or caring what has happened. Part of the orders that were never shipped were to Smokey who were part of the reason Schrade retooled to begin with then Schrade was closed and smokey gets the product anyway. Pretty Neat huh.

So in answer to your questions this is why the events took place. You cannot take one piece and understand it, these are the parts Taylor, Pipes, the managment ect played. It is pretty convoluted but that was how it was designed. I see Taylor is selling a sheep handled line of Schrades. I think I will get one I find it chillingly appropriate for the american public to buy Sheep bone handled knives you know how easy sheep are to lead. The ad for them should read American people buy this sheep handled knife it is part of how we are leading you to slaughter. LT
 
In addition to cheap/free labor, no environmental laws or osha rules the communist government gives many of these factories that used to be in the USA and Europe free electricity as another incentive to move to china-- this has been highly criticized by EU countries, here we just go on buying the cheap crap at Wal-China like we don't have a care in the world.
 
It632ret, I read your post with great interest. And I agree that many Americans are in Arlington because of the Japanese/Chinese/Germans and Koreans. We all need to remember the people that have paid the price for our country. There are a few points that I still do not understand. Are you stating that the big bank that shut the doors on Schrade is controlled by the Chinese?

I was told that another major bidder was Gerber. I have seen that Gerber is in bed with Walmart and I know Gerber and Walmart are big with the Chinese. How could Taylor compete with these Chinese connected companies? I have seen Taylor importing German (Buck Creek) and Jap Crap for many years, do you think that these German/Jap companies actually own Taylor?

From your post, I take it that Smokey Mountain ordered alot of new designs so that Schrade would go in debt and Smokeys plans were for Schrade to close to get these patterns cheaper?

How do you know that Taylor is owned by Chinese or Jap or German companies besides the fact you are a good poker player? Have you seen a Dun and Bradstreet report on Taylor?

As I have said before I am not buying anything, knives or cars made outside the US. We should support all American products.
 
ww2bill said:
....The past President of Schrade, I understand has started a new knife company. Did he plan this all the time to help his new company? Or are you saying he was trying to make Schrade fail. I would not think a president of a company would try to do this......I do not believe in any way that there was a conspiracy as some state with no proof.....
Click to expand...

Well, we all have the freedom to believe whatever we want. I do not believe Wally had anything to do with the behind the scenes fleanegling that went on. He certainly did not profit from Schrade's downfall that I can see. A lot of what went on inside the company, he had no control over. They were using outside "consultants". When Mr. Gardenier started the new Cutlery shop, he and his partners chose the name which included "Walden", to which they owned the rights. That horse was still in the barn when Taylor Brands LLC. threatened to sue them into oblivion if they used that name. Thus, "Canal Street Cutlery" was born. And some other middle management went straight to work for Taylor continuing their previous jobs.

I never said it was a conspiricy, but you could call it that if you wish. I tend to think of it as a carefully orchestrated plan begun years ago. And there was a consensus among the players big and small. A similar plan was launched against another American knife making company a few years earlier. It failed in the longrun because they neglected to scatter the ashes, and a group of employees restarted the company. A pretty good job of scattering was done with the ashes of Imperial Schrade.

Codger

PS- My father served in both theatres in WWII. He never bought a thing that was made in Japan to his dying day. He did buy german in the seventies. And I will probably never buy anything made in Vietnam, Laos, or Cambodia. Walmart is well over 75% Chinese products now. It is nearly impossible to avoid buying Chinese goods 100% unless you live in an antique store. I had a Chinese knife. I gave it away. He threw it into the Tennessee river when it closed on his fingers.
 
I never said I was a good poker player. I am also not a stock broker nor have I claimed to be. I am simply explaining what happened you are as we all are free to believe what you wish. This was simply a form of a leveraged take over. It was and is my understanding that there were interests who had a large say in this matter ( the bank take over and the ensueing foreclosure) that yes were affialiated and had direct interest in making what happened happen who were directly involved with nations now manufactoring these products I know that is hard to believe in this age of honesty and dealing with reputable nations (like Red China) that a foreign nation would use a guise to acquire a foreign economic market. I am also not a banker. Gerber is indeed tied up with Wally world and I am sure that the fact that they presently have the in, there is causing Mr Taylor some consternation and is part of why his marketing may or may not be sucessful. If indeed Mr Taylor has thrown his lot in with these foreign interests they may very well turn on him ( in the direction of Gerber or someone else if it is to there advantage ). I have also ( in the case of Schrade) stated that managment can only suggest, it is the owners who have the final say in major retooling and major financing matters whether those decision are right and have positive or negative impact upon there companies and the responsibilites for there actions falls upon there shoulders. I have not sought to impinge the honesty of any one I am simply stating what I believe to be true. Mr Gardner who is one of the owners Canal Street Cutlery and the past president of Schrade is a close acquaintence of mine who I have never known to be any thing but honest. Mr Taylor has in the past been involved with many dealings with these foreign interests I have no Idea nor do I care what his present present postion in any sense is regarding him and his comrades, partners, business buddies whatever. Nor do I care If it had not been him it would have seen someone else and as I keep repeating I have nothing against him I have nothing against his product ( except where and under what circumstances it is produced) all I am attempting to do is to answer your questions regarding what happened and again you are free to believe whatever you wish.

In the situation regarding Smokey apparently I have not made myself clear the point I was making was that Smokey had knives on order and as such were part of the money owed Schrade and could have been used as a positive to pay off (whatever the nominal amount was ). In stead it became part of the debt owed toward foreclosure Then Smokey ended up with the whole enchilada for almost nothing. Obviously smokey was not the reason Schrade retooled come on now you were just joshing me right you really knew what my meaning was and just wanted to see my response. I mentioned it as a point of Irony. It seems to have been taken as a point of contention.

Now that I have explained what I am not, let me explain what I am. I am a person who has known five generations of cutlers who have poured there sweat and lives into Schrade. As I once told Wally Gardner the main product produced by Schrade was not its knives it was the people and there children and there grand children who because of Schrade and the jobs it produced were able to raise there familys who made many contributions to this nation far removed from the cutlery field. Often times that contribution came in a far away place in the form of rich New York Blood for the things we hold dearest. In world war II and every other defense of freedom be sure the enemy became quite familiar with american determination when they got the feel of american steel and the taste of a Schrade knife. I am a person who knows the pride these people had in the product they produced who's craftsmanship was evident because of this pride. I am a person who understands that every american is a little bit poorer because of the loss of this company. I care not one whit about the venues of the people who now own Schrade and or the vestages of what was left of this once proud american company, Nor do I care about there desire to make money. I do care that an enemy to our way of life and beliefs is producing these products. I do care that through whatever either nefarious or innocuous means these facts remain and that is the bottom line.

In conclusion let me be specific, I have never said who owned Taylor I don't know and I don't care.. I did say that I question where and for what reasons various fundings and actions took place in this entire scenerio. By the way at the auction I was sitting next to another manufacturer that is also an acquaintence of mine he presently has the contract for the knives now being issued to our troops. These are american made. He also bid on the Schrade IP 2.5 million. I guess I am not that much of a card player because I wasen't even in the game and I gulped but Mr T never even blinked. That was because he was holding all the cards. But then again what do I know I don't even check Dun and Bradstreet. LT
 
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