Nothing Magical About Sebenza

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I must wholeheartedly agree. When I first got onto the forums, all I heard was Chris Reeve (how does a guy with a broken neck make knives?)</font>
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Oh man I just spit beer on my monitor !! That is tooo funny !

Um no ..no thats awful.
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ALex
 
Let me just start by saying that the Sebenzas are GREAT folders and one of the most quality and strongest production folders made. They ARE worth what CR is getting for them especially with the industry leading customer service that CR provides.

I caught the Sebenza "bug" a few years back and soon aquired the "Zulu Trio" and a large "user". After carrying and using the large for awhile, they also soon lost their luster for me. I can't quite put my finger on it but they just didn't "float my boat" any longer. I traded them all off. I still like the little Umfaans though for a great little pocket carry and LOVE their one pieces.

A few months ago, I got the opportunity to aquire a Darrel Ralph large bowie bladed Mad Max. Well, my boat got floated and was floating on air! Here was a knife, IMHO, that REALLY did the intregal lock RIGHT! It is many times smoother opening than the Sebenza and that is saying something! I just love this thing and plan on aquiring the "Mad Trio". I realize that it is even more expensive than the Sebenzas but worth every penny.

Now I love less expensive knives such as Spydercos and own many of them. I also think Sifus are a bargain. I just think that a knife should ellicit pride of ownership in you as my Mad Max does for me, (I STILL go "ah-h-h" every time I pull it out).
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The bottom line is if a Sebenza does that for you, go for it! If it doesn't, find something that does, no matter if it's inexpensive or very expensive.
 
As I sit here writing this, I'm opening and closing my large Sebenza (well inbetween typing anyway). The action is slick and precise, although not slicker than any other folder I own. So what is it about this knife I really like? Well first of all I prefer fixed blades to folders, and I carry a fixed blade whenever I can. Even though I live in Alaska, and the brown bears seem to keep the sheeple numbers in check, I cannot always wear a fixed blade on my belt without being accused of overdressing for the occasion, so I have a number of folders I carry instead. Of all my folders, the Sebenza is the one that feels most like a fixed blade when opened. It just feels stout and capable of rough use. In fact, when I do use it I forget I have a folder in my hand instead of a fixed blade. To me, that is worth every cent I paid for it. The BG-42 steel, the great blade geometry are nice extras, and for me the aesthetics are in its functionality not in the way it looks.
 
Flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, flips my burger, well you get the idea........the Sebenza.....................well, it just FLIPS MY BURGER!!!!

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Art Sigmon
"I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me"
Php. 4:13

"For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword"
Heb. 4:12
 
I definitely cannot afford a Sebenza, but I have a question about an alternative. If I understand how the Sebbie locks up, the BM 750 is the same, isn't it? I haven't actually seen either of them, but it seems to me that the 750 might be a comparable "grey turd" and a heck of a lot cheaper, too. Am I right or am I imagining things? :P

Asha'man

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Ó caíde sín don té sín nach mbaíneann sín dó.
"Since it’s no one’s concern, then no one should care."
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Asha'man:
If I understand how the Sebbie locks up, the BM 750 is the same, isn't it? I haven't actually seen either of them, but it seems to me that the 750 might be a comparable "grey turd" and a heck of a lot cheaper, too. Am I right or am I imagining things? :P

Asha'man

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Interesting observation. Thanks for the heads up.
 
I tried out a 750 recently. I didn't find it to be quite as smooth as the Sebenza. The blade shape also wasn't my personal preference, but that is very subjective. The big difference is the blade steel and possibly edge geometry.

What's really odd is that an integral lock is pretty simple to take apart and maintain. An integral lock, with its open design, does need some regular cleaning. Yet with all of this, Benchmade says you'll void your 750 warranty if you field strip and clean it. That's whacked. Not for me.

Better get one while you can though. Word has that it's being discontinued. Which brings up another point. Why would they discontinue the knife featured in the Sept issue of Tactical Knives. It'll be gone before the issue leaves the stand!!!
 
The first I heard of the Sebenza was here on the forums and couldn't wait to see one.

I went to a gun show and there was a knife dealer there who had a couple right handed Sebenzas.

Well I fumbled with them for awhile (I'm Left Handed) and just didn't see what all the hype was about.

A few monthe later I bought a Left handed Sebenza and started using it.

Well now I feel naked without it.

But that's just me and hundreds others.
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Like a Timex and solid as a tank.



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Rick Gray - Left Handers Unite
 
Buzzbait, Benchmade's warranty simply covers them if you send in a knife that was obviously damaged by an incompetent user. If you strip it and put it back together without messing it up, no one will ever be able to tell that it was taken apart. However, if you send them a bag of parts and a note saying 'oops', they are covered.

--JB

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e_utopia@hotmail.com
 
I have heard from several people not on the forums that they carry it every day as opposed to some of their other folders, but this makes me wonder if they carry it strictly for how it performs. If I had a bunch of 150 dollar knives and I just forked over 325 for a knife then I myself would almost certainly carry it because I would not want it collecting dust since I paid so much. It seems to me that the initial impression is not so great but once you use it every day for the reason mentioned above it becomes very natural to you and all other knives feel foreign to the hand. Tell me if I am on the right track is uncovering this mystery.
 
I finally handled a small Sebenza the other day, and well, I wasn't to impressed. I think I was expecting much more. It's a very nice knife, just not to flashy. I will buy one though. Just not a new one.
 
Carl, the opposite is true for me. I rotate in my other knives because I feel guilty not using them -- a couple of them are WHs that you mentioned in your original post. They are great knives, gifts from my wife, and I feel bad not using them. I prefer the WHs in some situations -- like the Kestral is a much better choice when I put on a suit. But, going out the door most days I choose the CRK. The resale is so good on the CRKs that I would have sold it if I didn't like it. But hey, if it doesn't do anything for you, that's cool. I think that the point many are making is that it can take a while to appreciate the Sebenza.
 
The Sebenza is a precisely made, strong and reliable knife, with an extraordinary blade, but only fair handle ergonomics. It is one of only a few folders being made today that are fit for regular, hard use. Whether you like it or not is a personal matter, and usually not of much use to others. I don't like it either, but it is still a great knife. One need not worry about wasting money on one, as it seems they sell used, in good condition, for almost as much as new.
 
I almost bought a BM pinnacle as my beater because I use my knives HARD, and I didd'nt want to put my seb in harms way. I decided I would try one out first. Since then I've tried somewhere between 7 and 10 of them. I never found one that was even worth the materials it was made of.

Did my sebby spoil me?

I have yet to find a hard use production knife that could measure up to the sebenza. OK OK... Microtechs are good, but you can find a used seb for almost the cost of a MT, get it refurbed LIKE NEW for $25, and well, there you go. Whether it be $50 OR $350... Either way, in 5 years the money would have been long gone, but do you still have AN INVESTMENT? A COMPANION? Or do you have a few old wobbly A$$ Benchmades?

I could carve a knife out of soap, it would open smooth... could you use it? Never know unless YOU DID!
 
Its true that in a store you can't compare knives by using them hard. On the other hand, you have a bit more than just the look of them and how smooth they operate when opened. Ask questions about the warranty. Think about what you will do if the knife ever gets dropped in the mud. Can it be disassembled and reassembled by you or do you have to send it back to the maker if its in need of some serious cleaning, etc? People who frequent forums like this have additional resources to draw from, the time honored testimonial.

What you are not grasping is that the Benz shines in all of those areas where most other folders fail miserably, and that's not good looks or smooth operation under ideal conditions. The benz can be smashed, bashed, beaten, and pounded, even through dirt and mud and still come up for more. When it stops operating because its got more dirt in it than steel, you can strip it in the field, wash it out with plain water - don't worry about the lube till you get it back in safe territory - and it will be ready for another round. Try that with your William Henry or any BM.

Can't afford it? Well that is something else again, and something no one can argue with. I want a Hummer, and I can't afford that. Indeed I can't afford "the best" in a lot of things, its just the way it goes. Still much as I would love to see Benzes at $100 cheaper, I'm glad I eventually got around to affording one.
 
on the BM pinnacle,

i beat the hell out of it outside. i looked at other titanium handled folders and the BM was good fit. I'll admit that the thing is relatively "unrefined" compared to the Seb, but the materials are ok and it'll take as much punishment as any other folder i have.

i bought it because i know that replacing it in extreme use or loss would be easier than replacing a Seb. sooner or later i'm sure to splurge for a classic 2000, but i just got a one-piece in and i'm more than convinced that quality will not be an issue.

the "magic" from one of CR's knives seems to be in its understatment rather than its flashiness. the one-pieces are very dull to look at, but they convey some sort of presence. hard to explain, but the seb was the same. i'm sure there's no overt magic there at all, in fact i think they were designed that way. handling the blades are different though. you KNOW that what you have in your hand will not fail you. with any tool, especially a tactical one, that's a great thing to have.

IMHO, my 2 cents, etc. No matter what, go with what you feel.

toast



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"One must practice ceaselessly." -Miyamoto Musashi
 
I'll try to express my opinion justifying it as much as I can.
I have "played" with Sebenza about 15 minutes in knife store in Germany. It's quite problematic to find so expensive production knives in stock in Europe but I have managed
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I'm inviting to do not confuse knife hard use with improper use like prying, pounding etc. Used improperly - as prybar - the Sebenza probably will hold up not any better than each other knife. For me hard use means extensive cutting through tough materials, so the handling comfort here is much more essential than warranty terms, customer service, knife appearance, tight tolerances or action smoothness. Handling a knife in store you can evaluate handling comfort only provisionally. The knife what fits your hand nicely in store can cause heavy disappointment in hard use - it can become quite uncomfortable. But it is rather hard to imagine inverse occasion, the knife which fit you hand so-so in the store certainly will not fit it better in hard use.
So, it is impossible to evaluate how good this knife will be for you in hard use. But it is quite easy to evaluate how bad it might be.

Sebenza fits my hand not too comfortably, BM Pinnacle fits it much better. Another thing - I would never feel myself enough safely and comfortably carrying liner lock or integral lock in tip-up position, especially if it is large folder with heavy blade.
These reasons cause that having the choice Pinnacle or Sebenza I would choose Pinnacle even if they would cost the same money. Even less reasons I can see to pay for Sebenza triply.

I don't want to state "I'll never buy Sebenza", greatly probably I'll do it earlier or later. But the only reason which could cause me to own Sebenza is the desire to own Sebenza
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I think there are several things being missed here that I want to address, and I did NOT read all the posts so I might be repeating someone. First....Chris' design is the FIRST great framelock...give him that. Second...they arent made to be looked at. Judge one after you have carried and used it for a YEAR OR TWO... not 5 minutes. And finally, they are built like a tank... I hate to say it but a few of the knives mentioned here will have gone back for repair while the SEBY will keep on ticking!
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That is if you USE IT! And I mean HARD!! I regularly drop my personal TNT from the height of 3'+ onto the concrete to show its durablity! You CANNOT hurt those knives!
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This thread has the markings of starting to get ugly, so I’d like to add a few comments. The BM Pinnacle looks like a good knife. I own a BM 730, and it is a good knife. I really do believe that BM makes an awesome knife for the price. Although the Pinnacle wasn’t for me, I’d never refer to it as a POS or any other derogatory term. With all that said, I like the Sebenza better. Here’s why:

1. You can field strip a Seb without voiding the warranty. Some people can say, “But BM would never know”, but is that the relationship you want with a company that makes your a$$ saver? Lying also would show a lack of integrity on my part.

2. The blade on the Seb is much better, IMHO. I’ll take the tough hunk of BG-42 over a blade of 154CM any day. There aren’t a whole lot of production BG-42 knives out there, so you have to take what you can get.

3. When I use the Sebenza, it never even occurs to me whether the blade might develop play after a few years of hard use. I think I’d be concerned that a BM would run out of gas much sooner. That’s no shot at BM. As I stated, the BM is a great knife for the price. It’s just not $300.00 good. The Seb is $300.00 good, if you absolutely need the value shown in a Seb.

I bought my Sebenza out of curiosity. Somebody questioned the quality in another thread, mentioning the lack of handle ergonomics and smoothness. I figured that I’d just sell the Seb if I didn’t like it. Sebenzas really hold their value. I decided to keep the Seb after a little use. The smoothness isn’t anything like an Axis lock, but plenty good enough to live with.

The ergonomics are misleading. The handle doesn’t feel $300.00 good after holding it, but shines when you go to use it for a wide variety of applications. Neither my Buck110, my Military, nor my BM 730 are as handy for smaller, detail oriented cutting chores. The Sebenza has more of a universal grip, for lack of a better term. A large Seb is a big cutter and a small cutter built into one knife. When I carry my Sebenza, I don’t bother with an additional smaller knife. There are better handles for small chores and large chores, but none better for both.

I think of the Sebenza as my ‘out in the middle on nowhere’ knife. I’d trust my life with it under any adverse condition. There are lots of knives, BM being near the top of the list, that would suffice under better conditions. I guess I just get a kick out of having such a sturdy knife in my pocket, even when I’m not trapped on a desert island. I’ll probably never need a knife as good as a Sebenza, but it’s comforting to know that I have it.

So I like BMs, but I love Sebenzas. If I were to purchase a knife tomorrow that embodied as much of the Sebenzas qualities as possible, but only paying out $100.00 or $125.00, I’d buy a PCKS Buck 110. The custom 110 would give me the BG-42, an awesome lock, and a myriad of handle options. The PCKS Buck 110 is closer to the quality of a Sebenza, IMHO, than a BM. Benchmade shoots for excelling in other areas, which they do very well. I think that Buck shoots for the same values as Chris Reeve, but at a lower price point. Comparing Chris Reeve to Buck is more of an ‘apples to apples’ type of comparison, where comparing BM to Chris Reeve is very much an ‘apples to oranges’ kind of deal.

I guess that shows my priorities in a nutshell. Speed means little to me. Weight doesn’t matter all that much either. Neither does carry convenience, not that the Sebenza is bad in terms weight and carry. BM excels, if you ask me, at draw and weight with its axis models. The axis is also a very solid knife if you happen to accidentally hit the handle with a sledge hammer. What I’m after is a knife that will survive a mountain of hard use, and still cut well without starting to fall apart. That’s why I like Chris Reeve and Buck.

Now if I were planning on getting into a knife fight, I’d be looking at BM. They seem to be the epitome of the urban warrior concept. Or even that ‘special ops’ kind of mix between cutting chores and skinning bad guys. That’s just not my personal concern. I live out in the sticks, and venture further in on the weekends. The only foe I have to deal with is myself, and perhaps a pissed off bear. And if the bear catches up to me, I don’t think that my knife will make a darned bit of difference.

[This message has been edited by Buzzbait (edited 06-29-2001).]
 
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