(NYC) Caught a misdemeanor

swamp said:
I was going to ask you about the perm record part. I would get it sealed or expunged completely. Other than that, if you can prove hopefully by video that they put a firearm in your bag they will be in absolute hot water. And could result in dropping your charges completely. I am not a lawyer, nor pretend to be. might want to check out www.policeabuse.com they will open some eyes, but may not be relevant to your case at all. the videos are sometimes all to common, and extreme like yours. They offer free help.
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I don't know about the NYC subway system, but here in Boston, the M.B.T.A. (Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority) subway system has an extensive network of CCTV cameras. On the news last night, the M.B.T.A. Transit Police were looking for a guy who groped a woman. The video and stills from the subway cameras were amazingly clear, showing the guy's face as well. If HellGuard99 is telling the truth about the NYPD cop putting the gun in his messenger bag, chances are a camera caught it. He will have to reference the date/time (should be included inthe cop's arrest report). This info could be used to really crucify the cop and get him/her criminally charged and/or terminated.
 
What happened was certainly very sad from the perspective of knife lovers like us. I hope it gets sorted out with little to no negative ramifications for the OP. I did want to extend props to TOM1960 for helping this kid out with advice, and for going above and beyond to get this situation resolved as favorably as possible. Thanks, man, from all of us on BF!

- Mark
 
I read that the knife must also be locking, not just 'flickable' to the open position in NYC.

That's why Spyderco created their slipjoint Urban model.

I am in NYC and really don't know what I can use for EDC.
 
Glint said:
I read that the knife must also be locking, not just 'flickable' to the open position in NYC.

That's why Spyderco created their slipjoint Urban model.

I am in NYC and really don't know what I can use for EDC.
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You are correct...in order for it to be considered a gravity blade, it must be able to be flicked open, and then lock in place. That is why balisongs have been deemed as not being gravity blades, because when opened, they do not lock themselves.
 
Glint said:
I read that the knife must also be locking, not just 'flickable' to the open position in NYC.

That's why Spyderco created their slipjoint Urban model.

I am in NYC and really don't know what I can use for EDC.
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From what I've been reading here and elsewhere, a small traditional (slipjoint) seems to be the only kind of knife carry that NYC wants to permit at this time.
 
In my public highschool they have some law study classes, so its not absurd he be a "law student" at 16.

good luck, next time bring a nice Queen stockman :)
 
rifon2 said:
From what I've been reading here and elsewhere, a small traditional (slipjoint) seems to be the only kind of knife carry that NYC wants to permit at this time.
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You can carry sub-4" Spydercos, Benchmades, Kershaws, Emersons, Striders etc. with locking blades. Just make sure to tighten the pivot screw down until there's absolutely no possibility of the blade being flicked open in any way.

And carry it deep in your pocket or bag with absolutely no part of the knife visible.

Personally, I carry slipjoints. :D
 
It would appear that the CRKT Eros and Ripple lines would also fit the bill for NYC. They can only be opened by using the lever protrusion on the back side. There is not enough room to grip the blade to apply the "inertia" test that is getting people in trouble with a ridiculous interpretation of the statute. I hope someone applies the public corruption laws as stringently to the DA - he is clearly shaking down retailers to enhance public position for re-election. They craftily tried to cover their track by arguing that such knives are used in crime, but the key is that they must be used disproportionately in crime compared to common usage. In a trial, they ought to also bring out Federal interpretation as well as those in common usage across the US. This DA is a pain in the butt and will eventually get slapped down, but it will take time.

People who have run afoul of this case should begin a campaign to videotape every aspect of the DA's life in public view and report every single infraction: stuff like driving while talking on a cell phone, jaywalking, etc. and demand that he be prosecuted under NYC law. If he is convicted of sufficient misdemeanors, he'd be considered a habitual criminal and no longer eligible to hold elected office, but every instance could be used by a political opponent. Public officials and law enforcement work for us; we are not ruled by them.
 
I graduated from a tech school here in Delaware. My major was in criminal justice, so im sure some high schools have a law classes.
 
mz9393 said:
You can carry sub-4" Spydercos, Benchmades, Kershaws, Emersons, Striders etc. with locking blades. Just make sure to tighten the pivot screw down until there's absolutely no possibility of the blade being flicked open in any way.

And carry it deep in your pocket or bag with absolutely no part of the knife visible.

Personally, I carry slipjoints. :D
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NYC outlaws any and all locking knives.

jayinhk said:
Since balisongs are not considered gravity knives in NYC, that's what I'd be carrying. :)
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This is all of New York State, not just NYC. just have to make sure that the blade is less than 4 inches in length.


here are New York City's laws pertaining to knives...

Chap. 1 Public Safety 10-133
Historical Note: Formerly 436-5.1

10-133 Possession of knives or instruments.

A. Legislative findings. It is hereby declared and found that possession in public places, streets and parks of the city, of large knives is a menace to the public health, peace, safety and welfare of the people of the city; that the possession in public places, streets and parks of such knives has resulted in the commission of many homicides, robberies, maimings and assaults of and upon the people of the city; that this condition encourages and fosters the commission of crimes and contributes to juvenile delinquency, youth crime and gangsterism; that unless the possession or carrying in public places, streets and parks of the city of such knives without a lawful purpose is prohibited, there is danger of an increase in crimes of violence and other conditions detrimental to public peace, safety and welfare. It is further declared and found that the wearing or carrying of knives in open view in public places while such knives are not being used for a lawful purpose is unnecessary and threatening to the public and should be prohibited.

B. It shall be unlawful for any person to carry on his or her person or have in such person's possession, in any public place, street or park any knife which has a blade length of four inches or more.

C. It shall be unlawful for any person in a public place, street or park to wear outside of his or her clothing or carry in open view any knife with an exposed or unexposed blade unless such person is actually using suck knife for a lawful purpose as set forth in subdivision d of this section.

D. The provisions of subdivisions b and c of this sections shall not apply to (1) persons in the military service on the state of New York when duly authorized to carry or display knives pursuant to regulations issued by the chief of stall to the governor; (2) police officers and peace officers as defined in the criminal procedure law; (3) participants in special events when authorized by the police commissioner (4) persons on the military or other service of the United States, in pursuit of official duty authorized by federal law; or (5) any person displaying or in possession of a knife otherwise in violation of this section when such a knife (a) is being used for or transported immediately to or from a place where it is used for hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, picnicking or any employment, trade or occupation customarily requiring the use of such knife; or (b) is displayed or carried by a member of a theatrical group, drill team, military or para military unit or veterans organization, to from or during a meeting, parade or other performance or practice for such event, which customarily requires the carrying of suck knife or (c) is being transported directly to or from a place of purchase in such a manner as not to allow easy access to such knife while it is transported; or (d) is displayed or carried by a duly enrolled member of the Boy or Girl scouts of America or similar organization or society and such display or possession is necessary to participate in the activities of such organization or society.

E. Violation of this section shall be an offense punishable by a fine of not more than three hundred dollars or by imprisonment not exceeding fifteen days or by both such fine and imprisonment.


Case notes:
This section promotes a legitimate governmental objective and is not unconstitutionally vague or an improper exercise of the city's police power.------ People v Ortiz 125 Misc. 2d 318 [1984]




10-134 Prohibition on sale of certain knives...

A. Legislative findings. It is hereby declared and found that the possession on public places, streets and parks of the city of folding knives which lock upon opening, is a menace to the public health, peace, safety and welfare of the people of the city; that the possession in public places, streets and parks of such knives has resulted in the commission of many homicides, robberies, maimings and assaults of and upon the people of the city, that this condition encourages and fosters the commission of crimes, and contributes to juvenile delinquency, youth crime and gangsterism; that is this situation is not addressed, then there is a danger of an increase in crimes of violence and other conditions detrimental to public peace, safety and welfare. It has been found that folding knives with a blade of four (4) inches or more that locks in an open position are designed and used almost exclusively for the purpose of stabbing or threat thereof. Therefore for the safety of the city, such weapons should be prohibited from sale within the jurisdiction of the city of New York.

B. It shall be unlawful for any person to sell, offer for sale within the jurisdiction of the city of New York any folding knife with a blade length of four or more inches which is so constructed that when it is opened it is locked in an open position and cannot be closed without depressing or moving a release mechanism.

C. Exempt from this section are imported and exporters or merchants who ship or receive locking folding knives, with a blade length of four or more inches, in bulk, which knives are scheduled to travel or have traveled in the course of international, interstate, or intrastate commerce to a point outside the city. Such bulk shipments shall remain in their original shipping package, unopened, except for inspection and possible subdivision for further movement in interstate or intrastate commerce to a point outside the city.

D. Violation of this section shall be an offense punishable by a fine of not more than seven hundred fifty dollars ($750) or by imprisonment not exceeding sixteen days (16) or both such fine and imprisonment. Any person violating this section shall be subject to a civil penalty not to exceed one thousand dollar for each violation.
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FWIW, since the subject/question of law classes in high school keeps coming up, I went to a Catholic high school in the Bronx. In my Junior or Senior year (can't recall which, at the moment), I took a class in Business Law--the teacher did occasionally veer off into more general law at times. I don't know what other law-related classes (if any) there might have been at my school at the time.
 
Balisongs ( butterfly knives) have been declared dangerous knives many times over, so don't carry them. All locking knives are NOT banned in NYC, but if they can be flicked open then they are considered a gravity knife by many. A locking sod buster can not be flicked and many other locking blades also out there....
 
Tom, I would be interested. In Memphis, he would still be treated as a Juvenile assuming no other weapons charges before and a pretty spotless history with our Juvenile Court. Unofficial Probation is what I would shoot for. But we do not have mass rapid transit other than our bus system and so we are quite a bit different. I do agree with getting the best lawyer you can afford. If you want to go to law school, you need a pristine clean record. Unless you have the best grades and test scores, you are competing against a wide variety of students for spots and well, a blemish here or there is not going to give you a leg up. If you were in Memphis, I would take it pro bono if for no other reason to give me an excuse to bone up on knife law and knife cases and see how our local DA's treat these sorts of cases.
 
As I stated above, locking knives are not banned in NYC, the isue is if they can be flicked open they are illegal, and some officers, ADAs and Judges allow the holding of the blade and flicking open of the handle to count ( most don't accaept this method). A non locking knife is a better choice if you don't need the safety factor of a locking knife for what you use it for.
 
tom19176 said:
As I stated above, locking knives are not banned in NYC, the isue is if they can be flicked open they are illegal, and some officers, ADAs and Judges allow the holding of the blade and flicking open of the handle to count ( most don't accaept this method). A non locking knife is a better choice if you don't need the safety factor of a locking knife for what you use it for.
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Officers, ADAs and judges who have any common sense whatsoever do not accept that method because it is dangerous. If the officer or ADA attempts that idiotic method of opening a knife in court, there is a good chance that they could get seriously cut or lose their grip on the knife and accidentally cut someone standing nearby. Courts are usually crowded and a flying piece of sharp steel in that type of environment is not a good thing. By the way, Tom, have you heard from the OP? Just wondering how his case is progressing.
 
No I did not hear back from him. The last I heard was a ACD, which would mean he would have no record if he did not get in trouble for six months.
 
i live in nyc too.. and edc.. well... i have it clipped when im in my house or some1 elses but when im walking around in the streets or goin on the train... well i have it buried deep in my pocket... yes every knife i carry is a locking knife + gravity.. but i conceal it very well, been carrying for years and never caught.. theres no reason to stop carrying man, if u love knives like i do although i just recived my juice s2.... its a leatherman multi-tool and iam gana start carrying this instead of a knife also this multi-tool has a great knife in it... and its under 4 in limit and it dosn't lock so cops cant say shite...
 
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