off topic: What new hunting rifle?

... I have been wanting a Marlin guide gun in 45-70 for awhile.

I swear Trevor, we do think alike. I really like the Guide’s model for scouting and for close-quarters black timber work where I may have to stop something big quick at close range. The stainless one below is my only production rifle these days, sighted in with Buffalo Bore 405 gr. semi-jacketed flat-nose bullets @ almost 2000 fps yielding about 3500 ft lbs muzzle energy. (just shy of elephant but will rock anything in the Western Hemisphere)…

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I do enjoy my ultralights for mountain hunting. Each of the following weighs in at under 7 lbs. including 3x9 Zeiss Diavari scopes. The top one is in .30-06 and the one below in .300 Wby Mag, both on skeletonized 700 actions by Lex Weberneck at Rifles, Inc:

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This last one is a tack-driving favorite for open-country/bean field hunting from any kind of blind or stand. Chambered in 270 WSM, it’s glass and lead-bedded into a bench rest-style laminated/vented stock:

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The 300 Wby and 270 WSM are capable of sub ½ MOA groups from a Ransom rest. I’m not that good, but on a typical day at the range I can count on getting quarter-size 5-shot groups at 100 yds from all three (inc. the 30-06).
 
Ok, so this past year I had it pretty rough and had to sell some guns. One of the ones that went was my only hunting rifle, a 300 win mag senders. Now I loved it and was thinking on just picking up a Remington tactical SPS and throwing a new stock on it, but then I started thinking about all I hated on the Sendero. The 26" barrel got snagged on everything. It weighed 14 pounds with scope, sling, bipod, and cheek pad. The stainless glittered like a disco ball.o it's out. So I started thinking about a new Winchester m70 featherweight. The rifle will be used for all my hunting, basically deer, hogs, and yotes. But there are so many good options. So tell me what rifle you like, and what you like about them.
Here's a list of what I'm looking at.
Winchester M70 featherweight
Tills T3
Browning X-bolt
Remington SPS tactical
Cz 550 American
Kimber 84 I think
Ruger 77 Hawkeye
Any models I'm just missing? I don't like Savage.
Chime in with what you like and don't. I'm problem going 308.

Of the rifles you are looking at - if the T3 means the Tikka T3 - then that is the one I would pick.

The reasons for my choice are because I carried out the same exercise as yourself - wanting a lightweight hunting rifle that was reasonably cheap as a back up to my Sauer 202 Take Down - and chose the T3 in 300WSM - after thinking it through very carefully.

The advantages are as follows - the action of the T3 is fully enclosed - the design is a lightweight version of a Benchrest Action such as a BAT or a Stolle Panda. I have 4 BAT actions and 2 Stolle Panda's - I shoot F Class like you - and use these on my F Class rifles and the extra rigidity of the action enables the accuracy of the rifle barrel to be maximised. It flexes less under recoil and this is an advantage when shooting magnum calibres with heavy bullets as the torque from the bullet twisting down the rifle will flex a lightweight action. So if you want "lightweight" going for an enclosed action design, which is the most rigid of all, is the best option.

This can be simply tested and shown. Take a .308/30-06 and fit it with a Harris bi-pod. It does'nt matter if the barrel twist is not suited to heavy bullets this is not an accuracy test. It is to show the effect of "torque". Take 5 bullets at 155g and shoot them using the bi-pod set on sand or wet mud. The lighter bullet places far less torque on the barrel and because all barrels are right hand groove and twist the torque effect will depress the right hand leg of the bi-pod deeper into the sand/mud. This is hardly noticeable in the weights of 155g to 180g. Then take 5 rounds with 230g or 240g bullets. The depression into the sand/mud of the right leg on the bi-pod is far more noticeable. You can even feel the twist of the torque in the rifle when you shoot it. This is magnified much more when shooting at higher velocities such as in .300 Magnum calibres. So having a rigid action which can resist the torque flex is a plus when looking for ultimate accuracy.

Then there is the length of the action. The T3 is always on a long action. Not needed in theory for a .308 or a WSM but in reality it is a considerable benefit. All factory rifles come with a SAAMI chambering which is "generous" dimension wise and to maximise the accuracy of many bullets the seating depth of the bullet to the lands of the rifle is critical. Essentially you want to load the bullets far out to reduce the jump and to do this with .30 cal VLD's can mean on a short action that the Over All Length of the bullet is too long to reliably feed in a short action. The advantage then is that in a long action you can buy .30-06 magazines and load .308 bullets with long seated rounds perfectly. The magazine in a T3 is a standard size - it uses a reducer at the rear to cater for different bullet lengths. Being plastic they are cheap and if you ordered a 30-06 mag having bought a .308 you have the option to reliably feed the longest of bullets.

Then there are the compatible scope mounts done by Tikka - they use the same rings as Sako but different bases and have a rubber inner ring washer which sits between the ring and the scope. This enables you to shim the rear base between the base and the ring to provide an incline on the scope without needing a custom base or custom rings. You can achieve the same effect as a 20MOA base by doing this and this enables you to retain far more inner scope movement to shoot much further out than you would normally be able to do with a standard parrallel set of scope rings usually found on hunting rifles. The rubber washer rotates and moves when tightening up the scope and prevents putting a dint or scratch mark on the scope body. I use old 35mm camera film for shims and cut them to shape. For many the long range capability this gives you is not what they are looking for in a hunting rifle. For me I like to have this benefit. Why not ?
When the rifle shoots .25 MOA after proper load development and can match my F Class rifles on three shot groups out to 1000 yards ( after 3 shots the thin barrel can start to wander due to heat build up ) I like to be able to have "fun" testing myself on long range vermin culling. I have taken Crows at crazy ranges using this rifle.

Then there is the barrel. Tikka and Sako share their barrels as both rifles come out of the same factory. The quality of these barrels is superb. Hammer Forged from great steel ( this last part is the key to their brilliance ) - they have always been comparable for me to the best custom barrels. I have owned 3 Sako and two Tikka T3 rifles and all were superbly accurate barrels once the bullet load was developed.

The final part is the trigger which for me needs a little work. Mainly because I am used to shooting lightweight Jewel triggers. You can get the factory trigger down to around 2 Ib but I had specially made trigger springs which replicated the factory length but were able to hold tension at a much lighter setting. My trigger is down to 1.1 Ib and feels lighter due to being very "crisp". The factory trigger though is perfectly adequate. Way ahead of most.

My .300 WSM shoots as good as any rifle can shoot. As good as my custom rifles until the barrel becomes too hot for sustained "grouping". In the cheap "value for money range" it is hard to beat.
 
its My only problem with tikka is the synthetic stocks, but I would go with wood. I went and handled a Browning x bolt in 308 today and they feel very nice. I have to go lay hands on a Tikka. The trigger on my Sendero was done by a local benchrest smith and was around 30 oz. It scared the crap out of everybody but guys like us. The local shop has a Winchester 70 Laredo in stock that I like, but there are 2 problems. One it's in 7 mag, one of my least favorite cartridges. I know it shoots flat but it's a barrel burner, uses to much powder when reloaded, and frankly I like the 300 win mag better. The second is that Laredo are famous for having the chamber cut off center. Third I guess is it's got all the problems of a Sendero in the field. To long, heavy and gets snagged on everything. I don't need a mountain rifle, but I think a 30-06 or 308 in a 8 pound rifle is about perfect.
 
I live in Kansas. I am a competitive F class shooter and the Sendero did double duty on that out to 1000 yards. I don't shoot at unfounded animals past 300 or so.
My first rifle was a savage in 30-06. The problem I have with em is that they tend to feed poorly, after a pretty good number of rounds they tend to develope issues, and I just don't like the look of em. No they are not bad guns, just not my cup of tea.

The model 70 is the classic riflrmans rifle. I'm pretty set on 308 as a caliber. The only reason Remington keeps coming up for me I'd the ability to mod it to be good at both hunting and F/TR. But I think with a Winchester, Browning, or Ruger I could have a rifle to pass on to my kids.

My brother has a Rem 700 in 308 set up with heavy barrel and good glass -- he lives on the east coast, so it's pretty rare that he can find a range that will let him shoot past 500 yards, so he's not very good with long ranges -- that said, he can hit "minute of gong" with it out to 600 yards -- and is convinced the rifle is capable of better accuracy than he is.

I have a Stevens 200 that I picked up with intent to build a dedicated long range target rifle, but shortly after getting it my gunsmith moved and budget cuts at work killed all OT -- which meant I no longer had the discretionary funds to buy parts. :(
since then it's been gathering dust after putting a whole 10 rounds through it. At some point, I need to post that one up on armslist.
 
I was soooooo close to dropping some $$$ss on a like new Sako in .375H&H at the Gun Show yesterday. The rifle probably dates to the late 80s and was sweeeeeet..... Hard to justify when I don't use the M70 .375 enough....but did I mention it was SWEEEEET.... !!!
 
I went with the Sako. Glad I did but kinda upset to. Before I went and got the rifle I called.every gun shop inside.100 miles looking for a M70 in 30-06 or 308. Nothing. Can't even order one. So I went and got the sako. Drove the hour to cabelas and waited 3 hours to get rings, glass, and a sling. Look over at the new rifles and what do I see? M70 30-06 featherweight. But oh well. I got the Sako for less than half what it lists for. Put a Leopold 3-9x40 on it. Going to go shoot.it today. Pics after that.

Oh and to top off my night I backed into some lady in a little black car. My fault. Didn't do anything to my expedition, but destroyed her bumper, hood, and headlight. I felt horrible cause.it was totally my fault. Hope my insurance takes good care of her.
 
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got me kinda a wanting a new rifle, and I picked up this Sako 75 Grey Ghost in 30-06 with a Leupold VariX scope, stainless and grey laminate are always pretty.. got the same combo in a ruger 10/22.. Now to put some rounds down range :)
 
In the mid 80s I bought the Weatherby Mk V chambered in their .240 Weatherby Magnum cartridge. Fantastic rifle and the .240 Magnum is simply amazing.
 
Well it easily shoots into 1" at 100 yards with cheap Remington 150 grain soft points. That will probably be my deer load. All said I got it broken in, sited in, and ran 4 different brands thru it. The only thing it didn't like was Winchester white box 180s. I'll haven't tg post pics later.
 
I forgot to take pics of the groups. But it HATED Winchester 180 grn Power Points. Like 4" group bad. Best group of the day went to my buddies "Garand" load, a 150 matchking at around 2800fps at around .5". I got to get better at shooting hunting rifles.
 
I really like my lever gun, Marlin Limited V. Lever guns may be our next assault rifles.
 

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Forgot to mention the best thing, EVERY store that sells ammo that I have been in has 30-06 on the shelf, for normal price!
 
Forgot to mention the best thing, EVERY store that sells ammo that I have been in has 30-06 on the shelf, for normal price!

Two things I love about the .30-06, in addition to the fact that it's a great straight-up hunting cartridge for an extremely wide variety of game, are 1) the array of factory loads available is so broad as to approach the limits of imagination and 2) no matter where you hunt in the US, if you need to buy shells you can always find a store that sells something in .30-06. :thumbup:

Just a great, great round--I'll always have a place in my battery for an '06.

Congrats on your new Sako--handsome rig!
 
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