Ontario's SP series, past and present...

Discussion in 'Ontario Knife Company' started by PocketKnifeJimmy, Jun 19, 2018.

  1. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    To update on what seems to be the market status of the SP-36 Sniper Spax... As of today, (June 21, 2018), it seems that the SP-36 has just about dried up on the most common online vendor sites. The vendor I purchased mine from, now has it listed as sold out and discontinued. My advice to anyone considering buying one, is to act fast if one is found at a decent price, (a price you feel comfortable paying), because I think they just about made it onto the SP DoDo Bird list.
    If you'd like to have this item for it's uniqueness as a tool, or just simply as a collectable, this may be the last opportunity to get one at a truly bargain bin price. Remember, these were not being made for Ontario's civilian sales, but instead for a specific US military use. They probably only made like one of these for every thousand or so standard SP-16 Spax' manufactured, (just my off-hand guess). Their limited niche use will likely keep them in the discontinued catagory, (unlike the SP-5 Survival Bowie that Ontario put back into their line after it had been discontinued for some years).

    If you decide you want one, you may try using one of the vendors that support this site. But, if they don't have any, you can try googling for someone that does. As a friendly warning, be careful if you run across the name "HR Knives LLC", (which their website shows having the SP-36 in stock
    ). HR Knives is definitely a scam site, (but, very convincingly legit looking). I fell for their scam business with some previous merchandise, (my fault for not being careful), and now I'm out some funds, no product, and had to cancel/redo my debit card. They will send you the initial email verifying the order, and will soon take the funds from your account, but you will not receive your merchandise or hear from them again. Don't take my word for it, the BBB reviews and ratings will be a tell all on this fraudulent company's method of operation. The BBB rating for HR Knives is a solid F. Also, do not bother calling them, they know that your order will likely be done online, and calling them will only get you a "this number is no longer in service" message. Just trying to help save folks from being taken by this fraudulent business :)
    Being taken was only one slap in the face, the other is that they even claim to be a disabled veteran run business... What a slap that is to anyone that respects the service of our men & women in the armed forces, ugh!
    Anyhow, I'm wishing all of you that may be interested in buying one, (or more), the best of luck in your search... Happy hunting! :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2018
    Yonose likes this.
  2. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
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    SP-6 Fighter/Fighting

    Factory specs:
    OVERALL LENGTH 13.0 in (32.9 cm)
    LOCK TYPE Fixed
    HARDNESS 57-59 HRC
    EDGE TYPE Plain
    COUNTRY OF ORIGIN United States of America
    HANDLE COLOR Black
    BLADE GRIND Flat Bevel w/ Secondary Flat Bevel
    BLADE FINISH Powder Coat
    BLADE COLOR Black
    BLADE THICKNESS 0.188 in (0.478 cm)
    BLADE MATERIAL 1095 Carbon Steel (likely 1075 in more recent manufacture)
    BLADE LENGTH 7.9 in (20.1 cm)
    HANDLE MATERIAL Kraton®

    This one has some cool history.
    Called their "Fighting" knife for a reason, since Paul Tsujimoto, (Toooj), designed it using the Randall Fighter knife as his inspiration for this blade's style/shape.
    What else is so cool about it?... It is the basis for the later OKC Freedom Fighter knife, the OKC Chimera knife, and the basis for the US Marine Corps OKC3S bayonet. Yup, the SP-6 is the basis and Grandaddy of these other OKC knives :)

    Ontario no longer sharpens the top swedge on this model knife, but they used to. They stopped doing so to meet all the different knife laws throughout the US. Some States consider the sharpened swedge as being illegal because it becomes like a dagger, (double edged).
    Anyhow, either way, it's still a neat and serious business knife! :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  3. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    This is the Ontario SP....... well, actually, it's NOT an SP series item at all!
    For the life of me, I can't figure out why the Ontario Kukri is not part of the SP series. It uses the same SP series Kraton handle, the same steel (1095 and/or 1075), and the same black blade finish. That said, it is simply listed as the Ontario Kukri, no SP designation at all. OKC has the Kukri under their Tactical section of their website. So, I'm giving it an honorable mention here for being the SP that isn't ;)
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  4. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-2 Survival/Air Force Survival Knife

    OVERALL LENGTH 10.6 in (26.9 cm)
    LOCK TYPE Fixed
    HARDNESS 57-59 HRC
    EDGE TYPE Plain
    COUNTRY OF ORIGIN United States of America
    HANDLE COLOR Black
    BLADE GRIND Flat Bevel w/ Swedge
    BLADE FINISH Powder Coat
    BLADE COLOR Black
    BLADE THICKNESS 0.188 in (0.478 cm)
    BLADE MATERIAL 1095 Carbon Steel
    BLADE LENGTH 5.5 in (14.0 cm)
    HANDLE MATERIAL Kraton®
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  5. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-7 Diver Probe

    Discontinued

    Blade: 1095 carbon steel

    Blade Finish : black epoxy powder coated

    Black polymer/Kraton handle

    OVERALL LENGTH: 10.90"

    BLADE LENGTH: 5.75"
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  6. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-3

    Discontinued

    This knife's blade is based on the M-7 Bayonet, which itself can be traced back to the M3 Trench knife of WW2.

    1095 carbon steel blade
    Blade length: 6-3/4"
    Overall length: 11-1/8"
    Blade thickness: 3/16"
    Black Polymer/Kraton handle
    Metal "skull crusher' pommel
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  7. Yonose

    Yonose

    Jul 10, 2017

    Is the guard kraton or plastic? I believe one of the sp series knives (aside from the sp-10) has a metal guard, but can’t remember or find which one. I assume it’s the black polymer listed as a handle material.
     
  8. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    It
    It was molded of Kraton as well. Don't know which SP knife, other than the SP-10, has a metal guard. Hope someone chimes in to let us know :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
    Yonose likes this.
  9. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP9 - Broad Point

    Discontinued

    • 6" Blade, 11 3/8" Overall
    • 3/16" Blade Thickness
    It seems that this knife, as with the other SP knives/tools, had the Kraton handle and black epoxy coated blade.
    This knife does not show up too much when doing a google search. Many of these SP knives that were discontinued, were probably also sold in low overall numbers.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  10. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    Well, I guess I will finally stand back and see if other folks chime in with additions to this list... There are certainly many more to be added :)
     
  11. Boru13

    Boru13 Super Moderator Staff Member Super Mod Moderator

    Apr 25, 2000
    You better not stand back, this your thread :D
     
    buckfynn and PocketKnifeJimmy like this.
  12. Roguer

    Roguer

    915
    Jan 5, 2015
    :cool:*Ponders if Spec Plus will round up to Spec Plus Gen II?*
     
  13. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    Boru13 already included one of them, the SP-43, which is a model in the Gen2 series. So, heck yeah, the Gen2 will be part of this roundup :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
  14. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-11 Bolo

    Discontinued

    • BLADE LENGTH : 10 INCHES.
    • OVERALL LENGTH : 15 1/8 INCHES
    • BLADE WIDTH : 2 1/8 INCHES
    • BLADE THICKNESS : 3/16 INCHES
    • Black Kraton handle
    • Black epoxy finish on blade
    • 1095 carbon steel
     
    dingy likes this.
  15. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-12 Tanto 6
    (the 6 in it's name for it's 6" blade length)

    Discontinued

    Kraton polymer handle
    1095 black epoxy coated carbon steel blade
    Black Cordura and leather belt sheath with leg tie
    Fixed 6" blade
    Overall length: 11-1/8"
    Handle Color: Black
    Blade Edge: plain
    Blade Type: tanto point
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
  16. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-13 Tanto 8
    (the 8 in it's name for it's blade length)

    Discontinued

    8" Blade
    Handles made with a Kraton polymer
    1095 epoxy powder coated-carbon steel blade
    Combination leather/cordura sheath
    13 1/8 inches overall
    3/16" thick blade
     
  17. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SP-14 Tanto 10
    (the 10 in it's name for it's blade length)

    Discontinued

    Specs: same as the SP-13 above, except for the blade being 10 inches long (two inches longer than the Tanto 8).
     
  18. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]

    SPS-21 Navy Mark 1... 440A stainless steel

    Discontinued

    9 3/8 inches in overall length
    4 5/8 inch blade
    Blade material: 440A stainless steel
    Handle: Black Kraton polymer
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
  19. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    SPC-21 Navy Mark 1 (Magnum?)... 1095 carbon steel

    Discontinued

    I could not find too much about this Navy Mark 1, or about the one in the post above it.
    Both were made by Ontario as SP models, but the SPS-21 was the 440A stainless steel version, while the SPC-21 was the 1095 carbon steel version. I'm thus far taking, from what little I have come across, that the dimensions are the same for both, with blade material being the big difference between them. Both supposedly were made using stainless steel pommels, with the carbon steel blade version having it's stainless steel pommel blackened with an epoxy finish.
    I'm sure there is much more info than this I'm sharing here that could be found with some more online digging... But, for this roundup thread, this basic info has served it's purpose. That said, any of you have info you want to add to any of this about any of these models, or any that have not been covered, please chime in and do so
    :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
  20. PocketKnifeJimmy

    PocketKnifeJimmy

    Aug 4, 2013
    Spec Plus Generation 2 (SP Gen2)

    As this thread proceeds, you may notice that some SP knives will be listed as being made from 5160 carbon steel. In the SP series, that will only be found when the knife is part of the SP Gen2 series. Thus far, (during this thread), the only SP Gen2 knife discussed, has been the SP-43. It, as with the other SP Gen2 knives, is made using 5160 carbon steel.

    Just like the first generation of SP knives, the Gen 2 series has also seen many of it's models be discontinued. Both the first and second generation SP series knives are USA were and are still made at the Ontario Knife Company's Franklinville NY facility.

    Many of you folks already knew that Ontario had come out with this higher breed of SP series, (Spec Plus Generation two/SP Gen2). The SP Gen2 series did not replace the previous SP series, it was simply added to them. While the standard SP series, (now sometimes referred to as Gen1), are/were made using 1095 carbon, 440A stainless, and 1075 carbon steels, the SP Gen2 series was/is only made using 5160 carbon steel.
    Dan Maragni, a custom knifemaker that works/has worked for/with the Ontario Knife Company, was put in charge on how the new Gen2 series would go. In an email correspondence with another individual, this is what Mr. Maragni shared concerning the SP Gen2 series...

    Here is some information about the Gen II Spec Plus line that are being made at Ontario. I was given complete control over the material, heat treatment and manufacturing process, so I took my 18 years of factory experience and, remembering all the failures I had seen in knives over that period, eliminated any processes that might damage the knife.

    1. Material- American made 5160 and not some unknown import of indifferent quality supplied by a large steel retailer. This stuff is made by WCI in the US and I had micros done so I could examine the material and it is very nice. I like 5160 because it is quite a bit tougher than the higher carbon steels (such as 1095) and is much more compatible to industrial style heat treatment. I also found the cutting ability comparable to higher carbon steels in my physical testing, contrary to what one might read in the literature.

    2. Water Jet Cutting- the blade blanks were cut out of the plate using a water jet cutter rather than a laser because I have seen many blades ruined by laser cutting. The laser leaves a heat effected zone around the perimeter of the blank which has a combination of melted steel, hardened steel and hardened and tempered steel which can cause cracking while the blanks are being cut and when heat treated.

    3. Stress Relief- I introduced a vacuum stress relief operation after cutting to eliminate any residual stress that might cause straightening or other problems due mainly to coil memory.

    4. Surface Grind- I had about 0.030" per side ground off to eliminate any possibility of problems from the hot rolled surface. I once had blades made of 5160 from a large steel retailer crack due to cracks in the surface of the material from the hot rolling process."

    5. Heat Treatment- I set the hardening temperatures, soak times, quench, snap temper and temper procedures based on my research/experimentation with this material. I heat treated blades in my shop, tested them and then had metallurgical analysis done of each procedure to document them. I also added the snap temper step to the factory heat treatment. This is an operation that I have never seen done in any other knife factory but one that I have always used in my own knife making and is common in commercial heat treatment plants. What it does is relieves some of the stresses of hardening before the clamp and temper operation and prevents any cracking of the blades while tempering. I also introduced heavy duty tempering racks which results in straighter blades which results in more consistent grinds.

    6. Grind- I supervise the grinding set ups and specify dimensions for the taper and edge thickness which results in functional blade geometries which can be repeated throughout the production.

    7. Laser Imprint- I have seen many blades damaged or destroyed by stamped imprints. When blades are powder coated they must be imprinted deeply and I have seen blades cracked by the imprint or weakened to the point that they crack in heat treatment. These blades are laser engraved which only really effects the powder coat.

    8. Sharpening- I trained the sharpeners at Ontario and they sharpen with two abrasive belts of different grits to refine the edge (the usual factory procedure uses one belt) and then a buff to remove the burr and further refine the edge.

    9. Designs- I tried to design these blades from a strictly functional perspective. The blades are fairly wide and flat ground to maximize cutting ability and are based on traditional designs with various functional aspects exaggerated. The SP-40 blade is based on the European "Alpine" knife, the SP-41 on the Skene Dhu and the SP 42 and 43 based on a variety of dirks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018

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