paper sharpening wheels - when your time is important to you

Richard I noticed that the directions for the wheels from Razor Sharp recommends "3,000 to 3,600 rpm." In another place they recommend "over 3,000 rpm." Yet you recommend around 1,700 rpm. Some reason for this difference?

Thanks, Lou
 
i like the slower speed which allows for more control and it is a little safer. if the operator forgets and happens to push too hard or place the blade in the wrong position on the grit wheel you will not mess up the blade so bad.

i have tried sharpening on a 3400 rpm buffer and i myself do not care to have the wheels running at that speed when i sharpen. there is not any difference i can see in the edge. it might take a few seconds longer to sharpen a knife but thats not really an issue if the results are the same.
 
I'm quite interested in paper wheels! :)

A couple of quick questions:

Suppose you want to get an edge to a mirror-finish, say for a display-knife or something.
Yes, this is a novelty-edge, etc. But hey, it's a free country, right?
I'm allowed to be silly. And you're allowed to critique me for it! :D

So for a mirror-finished edge, what sequence and/or type of abrasives, and in what grits would you use?

Sincerely,
--Lagrangian
 
From a precision standpoint, Richard's technique is superior. I get a good enough edge (for me) by having the top of the wheel rotating away. My primary concern in having the top of the wheel rotating towards me is ingesting dust. I have asthma and it's usually too hot here to wear a proper dust mask.

The only time I've ever caught an edge was with scissors - my fault entirely - caught the edge not being sharpened.
 
lagrangian, you can get different grits to use on the wheels if you want. i have some coarser grit and finer grit. you can get grit from detroit abrasives. a buddy has a lapping machine used for lapping hair trimmers and the grit used on it is 500. that would be too fine a grit to use on the grit wheel for my liking.

you can also spend more time on the slotted wheel and polish up an edge even more than what they already do or use a belt sander like i do when i convex an edge with a 400 grit belt. if you use a very well worn 400 grit that polishes more than it cuts that will leave you with a polished edge. finish that off on the slotted wheel and it will be nice and shiny.

i never use any belt over 400 grit when i convex an edge. i have a 19 micron belt that is about 20 years old and i seldom use it.

go back and read the post stevenkelby made in this thread (post # 710)
 
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phil, you can set up a fan to blow across the front of the wheels so any dust will be blown away from you. plus if its hot it will help cool you off :D
 
@richard j:
Thanks! :D
I remember reading stevenkelby's post (post #710); it's very good. He didn't specifically mention the grit sizes he uses on his paper wheels, but I guess I can always experiment with that myself (for getting a mirror edge).

I'll need to save up for awhile before I can buy a wheel (right now buying some supplies for another knife project).
But when I do, I'm thinking I'd use the wheel for the main sharpening, and then if I want a mirror polish I might just strop it up a bit by hand. Or I might think about getting an extra wheel with just polish/compound on it.

richard j said:
lagrangian, you can get different grits to use on the wheels if you want. i have some coarser grit and finer grit. you can get grit from detroit abrasives. a buddy has a lapping machine used for lapping hair trimmers and the grit used on it is 500. that would be too fine a grit to use on the grit wheel for my liking.

you can also spend more time on the slotted wheel and polish up an edge even more than what they already do or use a belt sander like i do when i convex an edge with a 400 grit belt. if you use a very well worn 400 grit that polishes more than it cuts that will leave you with a polished edge. finish that off on the slotted wheel and it will be nice and shiny.

i never use any belt over 400 grit when i convex an edge. i have a 19 micron belt that is about 20 years old and i seldom use it.

go back and read the post stevenkelby made in this thread (post # 710)
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i just want to remind guys that the wheels are cheap to buy and its not worth stitches or a funeral to try something home made. posting about home made contraptioins are not a good idea. some kid without any common sense might get hurt or seriously injured. i know that i would not want to read in the paper or on line about a kid who was injured or killed due to someone posting about a home made contraption.
 
Richard,

I'm really torn right now between trying out a paper wheel setup, the Work Sharp KTS, or an EP or Wicked Edge. I love the results you are getting from paper wheels, but I'm worried I'm going to jack my blades up with not being able to hold the correct and consistant angle. Is there a guide of some sort to help out with the angles?
 
skelt11 said:
Richard,

I'm really torn right now between trying out a paper wheel setup, the Work Sharp KTS, or an EP or Wicked Edge. I love the results you are getting from paper wheels, but I'm worried I'm going to jack my blades up with not being able to hold the correct and consistant angle. Is there a guide of some sort to help out with the angles?
Click to expand...

It just takes a little practice. And as for a guide, you need to do two things, hold the blade at a consistent angle and make passes on the wheel at the same spot. So my guide is a simple pointer that tells me where on the wheel I need to contact. I use a rafter square to make sure my reference point is at 90 degrees and then move it so it's right next to the angle marks I put on the wheel. As long as I make my passes where the square is, it's at the correct angle.

paper.JPG


Here's how the angles are marked in relation to a reference mark. I do the exact same thing to mark the wheels at various angles, 10, 15, 20 degrees. Following Richard's advice, I practiced on old hack saw blades and some cheap old kitchen knives.
 

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skelt11, like dan says, practice on junk knives before sharpening your good knives. most guys take to the wheels right off but its always a good idea to learn how to hold the knife at the same angle on both sides. i offer help over the phone to anyone in the states or canada that has problems or questions. it saves a lot of typing too and i hate to type if i can keep from it.

a note on guided systems. i used to have an ez sharp which is similar to a lanksy. i'll never go back to a guided system again since its hard to get the knife back in the same positioin you sharpened it at the last time. if you take 2 knives of different widths and sharpen them on a guided system using the same hole or slot and neither knife will have the same angle. in order to measure an angle there has to be 3 points at a certain length. if any of these 3 points are off the angle will be off too.

with the wheels, you hold the knife at the angle you want and you can pretty much match an existing angle easily with plenty of practice or change the angle to whatever you want. you can maintain an esisting edge with the slotted wheel instead of a strop.

with the wheels there are no belts to wear out. grit, rouge and elmers glue are cheap and the wheels last a long time. i have a set that are 20 years old and still going.
 
@richard j:

Thanks! That's one shiny axe edge! :)

Sincerely,
--Lagrangian

richard j said:
when you buy a set of wheels, you get the grit wheel and the slotted polishing wheel which takes the place of a strop. in the time it takes you to set up your strop and get everything else ready, you can be done and onto something else. check out this post and you will see an axe head that i convexed and finished off on the slotted wheel. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...r-free-Knife-Sharpening?p=7380927#post7380927
Click to expand...
 
I think a lot of people miss Richard's points. This is not a "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" thread. A knife is a tool. Just because one could drop a hair on an edge and cut it in half doesn't mean one has a usable edge. Richard is showing us how to achieve a usable edge in the minimum amount of time.

The edge is just one factor in the overall usefulness of the tool. The edge itself may have several factors that make it usable. Each of these factors are further defined by other factors that ultimately make your tool usable for your task. Richard, thank you, is helping us to achieve that ultimate usefulness.

This thread is a waste of time if sharpening is an end in itself or you get some sort of Zen pleasure out of achieving a good edge with a stone. I'm not against stones. I have many - carborundum, water, novaculite, ceramic and diamond, as well as other sharpening systems. I use them all every now and then.
 
If you guys want to be able to walk in your garage and sharpen 3 or 4 knives to absolute SCARY sharp,in about 10 minutes,get you a good set of paper wheels.If you like spending 20 minutes of sharpening time per knife,keep doing it the old way.I for one will not go back to stones,i have been at it with stones for about ten years and figured out really quick if i was in a hurry i would do more damage than good.I am always in a hurry.
 
today i touched up 2 scrap yard knives and 1 busse on the slotted wheel. it took me more time to find hairs to pop off than it did for me to sharpen all 3 :D.
 
just a reminder for you guys to take a hack saw blade or something of similar thickness and clean the slots out on the slotted wheel. compound builds up in the slots and its a good idea to keep them open. make sure to be off to the side when you turn on the motor after cleaning the slots.

another note. in my other thread ( http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...rs-ago-today-i-started-the-paper-wheel-thread ) i am asking all of the registered users to show their appreciation to spark for having the forum and buy a membership. a basic membership is only $10. and i'm sure some of you guys can sharpen up a few knives for your neighbors and get enough together to get a membership.
 
First post from a long-time lurker. This thread has been really helpful and I love the razor sharp wheels. I have 8" wheels setup on a 6" PC variable speed grinder. One problem I'm having is doing really long blades. The other wheel gets in the way. Any tips for how to deal with this? Thanks.
 
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