Please define "mid-tech"

[bodog]

Just like the title says. What makes a knife a mid-tech?

I usually think of a person who primarily makes custom knives who outsources portions of the "mid-tech" knife to other manufacturers and then refines and finishes the knife himself. No other people involved in the fit and finish.

Once the knife is produced in large quantities, either in house or via outsourcing, and there is no specific knifemaker who finishes the knives, or the person who finishes the knives can be replaced without losing the company name or identity, then it becomes a production knife. Doesn't matter how many or how few knives are produced.

But really though, I think the term "mid-tech" is bunk. It is a custom made knife, a one off of a custom knife, a small batch knife, a large batch knife, or a full production knife.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

As I said in an earlier thread, I think we get waaaay too caught up in labels with these things. As long as the maker is upfront and honest about the methods they use I don't care what they call it and, in fact, my general advice to manufacturers and makers would be to specifically avoid terms like custom, mid-tech, production, etc. as the meanings has gotten so muddied that they're more likely to give rise to accusations of false advertising and confusion than admiration.

 

[benchwarmer380]

Insipid, your post in the other thread (HERE) was spot on and carries right on over to this thread, IMO. It's probably even more on point regarding mid-techs.

To me, "mid-tech' is a marketing term and it's use to describe a knife sways me naught.

 

[bodog]

As I said in an earlier thread, I think we get waaaay too caught up in labels with these things. As long as the maker is upfront and honest about the methods they use I don't care what they call it and, in fact, my general advice to manufacturers and makers would be to specifically avoid terms like custom, mid-tech, production, etc. as the meanings has gotten so muddied that they're more likely to give rise to accusations of false advertising and confusion than admiration.

Generally I'd agree but this stems from a thread where a company would accept a return of a knife with no restocking fees if it was a production model. If the knife is a custom or mid-tech then there is a 5% restocking fee. They consider Rockstead knives mid-tech. I disagree. It has nothing to do with me, but I do find it curious how that company would define mid-tech and why they chose Rockstead to fall into that category.

So rockstead does some hand tweaking with their stuff. Ok. So does every other company with their higher end stuff.

Does a factory custom Buck knife fall into that category? What about a benchmade with aftermarket scales and polished washers? A Chris Reeve knife? A fully outsourced Hinderer? Where is the line?

And because no one can really say where the line is, a company shouldn't say they charge a restocking fee for mid-tech knives without having it defined.

Anyway, I cannot buy a knife from this company because they use the term "mid-tech" and there's no real definition of what that means. At some point someone puts their hands on a blade to assemble some portion of it. And whose hands need to touch it and for how long until it's classified as a midtech?

 

[Ccc]

I agree with the other comments. There is no knife regulatory agency so no definitions will ever become standardized, and nothing can replace a company's transparency.

Anyways, I see mid-tech and think "Oh good, a more affordable version from the manufacturer, as opposed to a collaboration."
They typically encompass a price range that I consider my sweet-spot for knives.

 

[stabman]

[video=youtube;j4XT-l-_3y0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4XT-l-_3y0[/video]

 

[btinder]

A knife whose parts have been outsourced, but was put together and QAQC'd by the maker.

Example: Les George has been very adamant that every VECP goes through his hands before it reaches the customers.

Lately, I get the feeling all knives want to be a "mid-tech" in price...

 

[PURPLEDC]

This thread topic has been exhausted numerous times. I myself have made a thread on the topic. My conclusion is that there is no set definition that all others will adhere to. We could argue the finer points of the definition and it will pretty much not matter. People will continue to interpret these terms as they see fit. I choose to ignore all definitions as there really is no point to debate what isn't provable. If we are talking in respect to how dealers list their items It still isn't of much importance. A dealer can list a Pakistan knife as a custom knife if they want. Its up to me to know their terms and conditions as well as their policies and decide for myself if I am within my comfort zone to place an order no matter if I think they are wrong or not. What they think isn't changing my opinion and I doubt my opinion will change what they think. If people want to believe their knife is more special than I believe it is its of no real consequence to me.

 

[LaneMeyer]

Mid-tech is just a term manufacturers can use to charge more money for production knives. By saying the knife touched a makers hands gives an additional markup of 100%.

 

[Alpha Knife Supply]

The term "Mid-Tech" was coined by Ken Onion. He had some work outsourced and wanted to differentiate the knives with outsourced work from his custom knives.

Mid-Tech has since been used to define several things including knives that are completely outsourced. It no longer has a defined meaning.

I don't know of any manufacturer using the term Mid-Tech.

Chuck

 

[Rat Finkenstein]

It just means "production."

And people pay more for no good reason.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

Generally I'd agree but this stems from a thread where a company would accept a return of a knife with no restocking fees if it was a production model. If the knife is a custom or mid-tech then there is a 5% restocking fee. They consider Rockstead knives mid-tech. I disagree. It has nothing to do with me, but I do find it curious how that company would define mid-tech and why they chose Rockstead to fall into that category.

So rockstead does some hand tweaking with their stuff. Ok. So does every other company with their higher end stuff.

Does a factory custom Buck knife fall into that category? What about a benchmade with aftermarket scales and polished washers? A Chris Reeve knife? A fully outsourced Hinderer? Where is the line?

And because no one can really say where the line is, a company shouldn't say they charge a restocking fee for mid-tech knives without having it defined.

Anyway, I cannot buy a knife from this company because they use the term "mid-tech" and there's no real definition of what that means. At some point someone puts their hands on a blade to assemble some portion of it. And whose hands need to touch it and for how long until it's classified as a midtech?

NOW I get where you're going and, yeah, as nice as Rockies are I would never have thought to consider them a mid-tech. But this also comes back to the problem of labels. If they just had a policy that all knives returned that cost over $XXX would be charged a restocking fee that clears it up.

And I'll bet you solid money that their rule probably wouldn't apply to very inexpensive customs. If I bought a $50 custom bottle opener from them I'd be shocked if they charged the fee, I have a STRONG feeling it just comes down to cash.

 

[PURPLEDC]

Still I think the fact of getting hung up on the actual definition is a moot point. The fact is the dealer in question sells the knife as a "semi-custom". Their policy is they charge a restocking fee on those knives. When we buy from them we agree to those terms. So for me the question really isn't why or how these knives are chosen to be defined by those selling them but rather why we as customers refuse to read the fine print and then seek any and every opportunity in which not to be held accountable for our own actions. I mean even when it is literally spelled out for us some would rather search for loop holes after the fact. Even if they called it a "Super ferocious flying space knife" (of which we all know that definition is ridiculous) if they have a policy that super ferocious flying space knives have a restocking fee and we buy it anyways we cant try and get away with not paying that fee because we disagree with the definition after the fact.

 

[Scurvy092]

The term "Mid-Tech" was coined by Ken Onion. He had some work outsourced and wanted to differentiate the knives with outsourced work from his custom knives.

Mid-Tech has since been used to define several things including knives that are completely outsourced. It no longer has a defined meaning.

I don't know of any manufacturer using the term Mid-Tech.

Chuck

DPX calls their production knives mid-techs.

Brous I believe also calls his knives mid techs.

 

[craytab]

It actually doesn't matter what you call a knife. The process of the manufacture is what counts. Along with the definition a dealer gives to a certain item as it relates to their policies. Read the fine print. Ask questions before you buy. After you have agreed to the terms it is too late and it doesn't matter if the knife is a super undercover double midtech.

 

[JR88FAN]

I never understood that term.

There's customs and productions, and there are VERY few custom knives being made.

Mid-Tech to me is a fancy way of saying lower volume production.

 

[craytab]

NOW I get where you're going and, yeah, as nice as Rockies are I would never have thought to consider them a mid-tech. But this also comes back to the problem of labels. If they just had a policy that all knives returned that cost over $XXX would be charged a restocking fee that clears it up.

And I'll bet you solid money that their rule probably wouldn't apply to very inexpensive customs. If I bought a $50 custom bottle opener from them I'd be shocked if they charged the fee, I have a STRONG feeling it just comes down to cash.

It doesn't really matter what the item is or how much it costs if you agreed to the terms and gave them your money. That's it. Done.

Then......we add in no documentation of said reasons for return? No leg to stand on there. This is just a rehashing of a couple other recently closed threads.

 

[craytab]

And because no one can really say where the line is, a company shouldn't say they charge a restocking fee for mid-tech knives without having it defined.

So it was a double secret restocking fee the buyer was unaware off?

That is rhetorical. I know the answer. They are described as "semi-custom" by knife center. Also, when you agree to Knife center's terms you agree to their return policy which clearly states their return on "semi-custom" knives. They could have defined that knife as a "Jacuzzi use only knife" and if they qualified specific return requirements for their "Jacuzzi use only knife" to which the buyer agreed to, that is it. Nothing to argue about. Don't like the terms? Don't agree to them and then fork over your money. Simple.

 

[RevDevil]

We aren't discussing restocking fees anymore, so don't go there. That horse is dead and the lesson has been learned (one can only hope).

This thread topic has been exhausted numerous times. I myself have made a thread on the topic. My conclusion is that there is no set definition that all others will adhere to. We could argue the finer points of the definition and it will pretty much not matter. People will continue to interpret these terms as they see fit. I choose to ignore all definitions as there really is no point to debate what isn't provable. If we are talking in respect to how dealers list their items It still isn't of much importance. A dealer can list a Pakistan knife as a custom knife if they want. Its up to me to know their terms and conditions as well as their policies and decide for myself if I am within my comfort zone to place an order no matter if I think they are wrong or not. What they think isn't changing my opinion and I doubt my opinion will change what they think. If people want to believe their knife is more special than I believe it is its of no real consequence to me.

I agree with you. Well stated, people may not like it but it doesn't make it any less accurate.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

It doesn't really matter what the item is or how much it costs if you agreed to the terms and gave them your money. That's it. Done.

Then......we add in no documentation of said reasons for return? No leg to stand on there. This is just a rehashing of a couple other recently closed threads.

I don't disagree, but I actually think the cash angle makes MORE sense than the custom. I'm gonna be a lot less picky about my $50 custom caplifter than my $1800 production knife. That means that, if you send me one that's already been returned once, I'm going to be a lot more likely to catch any minor cosmetic blemishes or fingerprints that got on the blade, etc. That means I'm more likely to complain, causing headaches and just generally being a pain in the butt.

That's why I think it makes more sense, from a business perspective, to charge the restocking fee based on money spent, not vague definitions.