Off Topic POLL Why are GEC knives difficult to buy, for some.

[Quiet]

Yes it is. They purposefully only make a few. They have 200 workers how is that small? That's more than most usa made knives.

They don't "purposefully only make a few". Also, I am pretty sure they don't have 200 employees. If they do, they aren't all cutlers, and training new cutlers to make vintage slipjoints is difficult.

Again, you seem to be attempting to assign some malfeasance or bad acting on their part, when it's pretty clear that you don't know what you're talking about, and are attempting to spin some conspiracy theory where there is none.

Oh, you disagree? Tell me, who profits by them not making a million knives? Is it.....them? Or is it the flippers and others who hoover up the knives when they drop for resale? Do you think those dudes cut GEC a check?

LOL Criminy, some people, I tell you what. If GEC could pump out a thousand knives a day and keep them at their present level of quality, fit, finish, and traditional design and build level, they'd do it. Simple as that.

 

[Quiet]

Also, here's the candidly sad part: if GEC was able to suddenly drastically increase production, they'd probably lose popularity, and then GEC (and more to the point, their dealers) would be right back where they were five years ago, where GECs used to sit on store shelves and in dealer inventory for months if not years before finally being sold. The Beer Scout? Those knives that go for between $350-$500 or more on secondary these days? Sat for months on shelves back when they dropped. Crazy, right?

 

[slyraven]

They say on their website they only make a handful of knives. That's what I'm going by.

You said it yourself..if they made more it would lose popularity.

If they honestly cared about getting knives in the hands of people who actually want one they'd adjust how they do business. They got popular so they need to figure out how to better serve thier customers.

I think I may have been too heavy saying ARTIFICIAL scarcity..but they sure seem to embrace their scarcity

 

[Quiet]

They say on their website they only make a handful of knives. That's what I'm going by.

You said it yourself..if they made more it would lose popularity.

If they honestly cared about getting knives in the hands of people who actually want one they'd adjust how they do business.

You misunderstood my point. They DO care. They just aren't able to increase production and continue to make the product that Bill Howard wants to make. Simple as that. Losing popularity isn't the reason they don't do it, it would merely be a possible side effect. At this point, I'd like to ask you what you feel GEC is getting out of (what you see as) a refusal to dramatically increase production. How are they profiting from artificially keeping their output small?

 

[Elgatodeacero]

GEC has between 30-40 employees and can make about 20k knives per year.

This is not likely to change.

 

[slyraven]

You misunderstood my point. They DO care. They just aren't able to increase production and continue to make the product that Bill Howard wants to make. Simple as that. Losing popularity isn't the reason they don't do it, it would merely be a possible side effect. At this point, I'd like to ask you what you feel GEC is getting out of (what you see as) a refusal to dramatically increase production. How are they profiting from artificially keeping their output small?

That's a good point. I suppose it's harder to increase production and keep quality..that is a fair point

 

[Jiki]

Yes it is. They purposefully only make a few. They have 200 workers how is that small? That's more than most usa made knives.

Edit. My bad, I misread it..they do not have 200 employees.

They struggle to keep 30 highly trained employees. I recently complained about the lack of 3 and 4 blade knives. Well, I have changed my tune and am thankful for any 3-4 blade knives made after I received additional information. When they do more than two blades it creates a glut of work at blade assembly and the next step, attaching the slabs is starved. They know more about making their knives than all of us. So sometimes it's better to stay out of their way.

 

[Bigfattyt]

I own a few. I simply am not fast enough to score any more. Ever. Does not matter that I have alerts set, try early reserve, nothing.... I have not successfully scored in years and years.

I donr buy to resell. I use and carry. I just can't compete with the flippers who apparently have programs buying for them??

 

[slyraven]

I stand corrected. I'll admit my error.

I'd like to think, however, they could adjust how the information to get their knives is released. It's really vague and frustrating

 

[Quiet]

That's a good point. I suppose it's harder to increase production and keep quality..that is a fair point

Trust me when I tell you that I am absolutely on the side of the discussion who would love for them to increase production enough to where everyone could get one, or even multiples. There are enough of us GEC collectors on the Internet these days, that we'd buy them, and most likely they still couldn't make enough. However, not if it meant that the actual knives lost what makes them special. I have some GECs in my collection that are absolutely heirloom, on-the-same-level-as-some-customs-I-own quality. It's something that Case, or imported knives like Rough Rider just can't match. I would hate to lose that quality about them, if they ramped up production (somehow). I think that, more than anything else, would be what would cause fans to lose interest and stop buying if it happened.

 

[sf fanatic]

They don't "purposefully only make a few". Also, I am pretty sure they don't have 200 employees. If they do, they aren't all cutlers, and training new cutlers to make vintage slipjoints is difficult.

Again, you seem to be attempting to assign some malfeasance or bad acting on their part, when it's pretty clear that you don't know what you're talking about, and are attempting to spin some conspiracy theory where there is none.

Oh, you disagree? Tell me, who profits by them not making a million knives? Is it.....them? Or is it the flippers and others who hoover up the knives when they drop for resale? Do you think those dudes cut GEC a check?

LOL Criminy, some people, I tell you what. If GEC could pump out a thousand knives a day and keep them at their present level of quality, fit, finish, and traditional design and build level, they'd do it. Simple as that.

Again, you seem to be attempting to assign some malfeasance or bad acting on their part, when it's pretty clear that you don't know what you're talking about, and are attempting to spin some conspiracy theory where there is none.

Recently, it appears to me that this has become a national pastime. Now you’ll have to excuse me while I continue my search for JFK Jr. Everyone knows he’s hanging out in a cornfield in Iowa.

 

[mrknife]

you gotta consider that some people have almost absolutely nothing better to do with their really fast internet connection, so they sit there and wait for drops and buy up 3-4 of them when it occurs. Its usually the same handful of folks who typically end up with multiples. Really dont think its bots...

 

[calm]

you gotta consider that some people have almost absolutely nothing better to do with their really fast internet connection, so they sit there and wait for drops and buy up 3-4 of them when it occurs. Its usually the same handful of folks who typically end up with multiples. Really dont think its bots...

Why order/get several of the same model and variant, just because you can, if you do not intend to sell them? Is it to gift, to choose the best to keep, to stop flippers from getting them?

 

[knifeswapper]

I stand corrected. I'll admit my error.

I'd like to think, however, they could adjust how the information to get their knives is released. It's really vague and frustrating

Their "tech" people take time off the line or producing artwork, etc. to do the website. It has a "Production Schedule" (https://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/production-schedule/) showing what is currently on the schedule, a "What's Happening" (https://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/2022/06/28/whats-happening-2/) page showing actual production line photos of the knives moving thru, and a cover shot (https://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/) of the knives as they are preparing to ship to dealers.

At one time they would show several patterns on the Production Schedule page. But the shipment of bocote wouldn't make it, or the blades would come back from Peter's with some small issue and have to go back, etc, etc. So instead of having to apologize and re-organize the schedule page - they have just pretty much stopped pre-posting. Also, many times they probably don't want to have to answer 200 phone calls questioning the upcoming schedule.

On the prior production questions / recommendations.

They have 28-31 employees. When they lose one and have to hire a replacement, it takes Bill weeks to get them trained in their station. Which is weeks that Bill can't take back his "roaming" position on the line to cover for illnesses, vacations, etc. Last time I had a substantive talk with him, he was training 3 people.

When they had @20 employees, they were making @75 knives/day. Now they keep @30 and are putting out 100-130 knives, depending on the pattern. So, let's call it 30k knives / year. It would probably take 5k+ knives to temporarily satisfy demand on popular patterns. So, to try and satisfy the market would allow for 6 patterns yearly. Two months making the same pattern. Not only would the employees lose interest, but so would the market get sick of waiting for the next pattern.

They could probably go out on the street and find 10 more employees. Then you have months of training and the quality would take many months to stabilize again. Then, if the economy gets wrecked (very likely) you get to lay of 10+ people that have become your friends.

The current economy is pushing out those with expendable income and this looks to be a long term trend. So, when the knife market does tank and they can sell everything they are building will the knife community start a gofundme for another failing traditional knife company - probably not. So, Bill has a lot of decisions to make about how he runs a long term business - and I don't know of anyone more equipped to make that call in this particular space.

 

[mrknife]

Why order/get several of the same model and variant, just because you can, if you do not intend to sell them? Is it to gift, to choose the best to keep, to stop flippers from getting them?

some people do it to pick the best one they can but its likely any variation of those and dont forget using it as trade bait. and yes in the rare case, there are still people who do help friends and offer it at cost. but those are really few and far in between from my observations.

 

[r8shell]

...Bill has a lot of decisions to make about how he runs a long term business - and I don't know of anyone more equipped to make that call in this particular space.

Well said. Thank you for the inside look.

Kids these days, wanting constant content updates on their insta-face and snap-books...I remember when I knew about a new knife pattern when a catalog showed up in the mail.

 

[Will Power]

From an entirely selfish, ego driven point, I'm not bothered about snapping up the latest GEC as they have not been making a pattern I really want since the re-release of the White Owl last year. Nothing in the near future changes this so I'm complacently tranquil Could change though Then it will be problematic for sure over here in EU-Land and I will have to rely on the 'kindness of non-strangers' here on the Forum. Building up contacts, friends, allies have all been helpful but there is a limit to this as they too may really want a scarce pattern.

We know GEC is a small company, restricted capacity, producing a high quality knife (regardless of your taste in patterns) . However, it is undeniable that certain Predatory types have noticed this inherent characteristic and have exploited it: multiples were bought not out of interest or collecting ( I'm not talking about buy one to use one to store in case of loss) but sheerly to make fast profits and go back for more thus exacerbating shortages and generating FOMA. Off the back of this is the idle trend seeker, ah this is cool I need to get involved. But as Mike has pointed out, the current economy (not just US but everywhere) is in contraction and those with spare money for interests and hobbies are likely to diminish, in some places dramatically. Thus GEC has to remain cautious and with good reason, the flippers / gross profiteers will vanish but let's hope the GEC-Goose that laid the Golden Egg doesn't. Water, water everywhere but n'er a drop to drink.

 

[slyraven]

Their "tech" people take time off the line or producing artwork, etc. to do the website. It has a "Production Schedule" (https://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/production-schedule/) showing what is currently on the schedule, a "What's Happening" (https://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/2022/06/28/whats-happening-2/) page showing actual production line photos of the knives moving thru, and a cover shot (https://greateasterncutlery.net/blog/) of the knives as they are preparing to ship to dealers.

At one time they would show several patterns on the Production Schedule page. But the shipment of bocote wouldn't make it, or the blades would come back from Peter's with some small issue and have to go back, etc, etc. So instead of having to apologize and re-organize the schedule page - they have just pretty much stopped pre-posting. Also, many times they probably don't want to have to answer 200 phone calls questioning the upcoming schedule.

On the prior production questions / recommendations.

They have 28-31 employees. When they lose one and have to hire a replacement, it takes Bill weeks to get them trained in their station. Which is weeks that Bill can't take back his "roaming" position on the line to cover for illnesses, vacations, etc. Last time I had a substantive talk with him, he was training 3 people.

When they had @20 employees, they were making @75 knives/day. Now they keep @30 and are putting out 100-130 knives, depending on the pattern. So, let's call it 30k knives / year. It would probably take 5k+ knives to temporarily satisfy demand on popular patterns. So, to try and satisfy the market would allow for 6 patterns yearly. Two months making the same pattern. Not only would the employees lose interest, but so would the market get sick of waiting for the next pattern.

They could probably go out on the street and find 10 more employees. Then you have months of training and the quality would take many months to stabilize again. Then, if the economy gets wrecked (very likely) you get to lay of 10+ people that have become your friends.

The current economy is pushing out those with expendable income and this looks to be a long term trend. So, when the knife market does tank and they can sell everything they are building will the knife community start a gofundme for another failing traditional knife company - probably not. So, Bill has a lot of decisions to make about how he runs a long term business - and I don't know of anyone more equipped to make that call in this particular space.

I can certainly understand that. I just have no clue when any of thier knives will hit websites. So when I do see a knife I like..such as the apple fruit knife..I looked and looked and had no clue when to try and buy it..only way I knew was after they were selling second hand and I just scratched my head.

I see now from your link there is a place they put when they are ready to go..thats handy to zero in on the release day.

Do dealers themselves pick the days they make the knives live?

 

[Jiki]

I can certainly understand that. I just have no clue when any of thier knives will hit websites. So when I do see a knife I like..such as the apple fruit knife..I looked and looked and had no clue when to try and buy it..only way I knew was after they were selling second hand and I just scratched my head.

I see now from your link there is a place they put when they are ready to go..thats handy to zero in on the release day.

Do dealers themselves pick the days they make the knives live?

The best thing to do, to go to each dealers website and sign up for whatever notification system they use for releases or drops. For most it is an email, one it is Telegram app, and others it is nothing.

Edit: not just the general knife notifications, the GEC specific ones.

 

[Stelth]

TLDR.
I think it's simply more demand than supply.