Popular Knives at any PRICE ?

well, 440C is not so bad.....

I like them new-fangled materials, but some some of the more traditional blade materials like 440C are easier to sharpen and maintain than the CPM steels. 440C is pretty high on the rust resistance scale and can be finished to a mirror polish. I wonder how 440C would be received today if it had the designation stellite-cpm-45V-2 rather than common old 440C???

Good makers with good designs and quality workmanship will still have a market no matter what blade material they use. There is a small cadre of "folks like us" who want the latest advancements in metallurgy, many others just want a quality blade with first rate workmanship......
 
I don't see that using 440C is a problem. Some of the nicest knives out there are made from that steel. If it is a steel the maker knows, you may be far better of getting him to make you a knife from it rather than a steel that he is not familiar with.

If you want a knife made from one of these other steels and you want it to be made by the maker you have mentioned, ask him if he will work in one of the steels you would prefer. Many maker offer quite a few options as far as steel is concerned. If he says that 440C is all he works in then you will have to choose a different maker.

As far as price is concerned, I have seen knives made from 1050 that cost more than $800.00. It is what the maker does with the steel he uses that counts. Awhile back there was a maker named G.W.Stone. He worked with 400 series steel. He regularly showed off his blades by slamming them with all his might into steel poles, the base of a heavy vice and ebony blocks without damaging them at all. It is all in what you do with what you have.
 
440C, makes a very good servicable, as well as pretty due to its polishing characteristics. However the idea that 440C is cheaper than say ATS34 is just not true anymore, I know becasue I switched to using ATS because of market demand, and because the cost of 440 kept going up. The reason im sure is because its not in as great of use anymore the mills dont make as much of it, therefore what is made costs more to ofset the cost of making it.
 
When somebody thinks a knife is sub-par just because it is 440c, that shows more ignorance than knowledge. A maker who knows how to work and HT 440c will turn out an excellent knife with a very good steel. Just because it is not the newest thing around does not mean that it is no good.

Sure many of the new steels are great, but what makes you think that all of them are better than properly done 440c? Much of the new steel is in huge demand because of very good marketing. Those who are easily swayed and not very knowledgable are easy to convince that they should buy a new steel because an old one like 440c just isnt as good.

Since I started on the forums years ago I have seen times when new steels are announced. I have seen many self appointed experts start spouting how the new steel is simply the best, and you must have it. The funny thing is, a time or two they have done that before any knife is actually avaliable in the new wonder steel. They simply were easily convinced that it was the best because it was new, and somebody had a theory that it would be the best.

How much a knife sells for has so much more to it than just what kind of steel it uses.
 
Never could figure out why stain resistant steels are singled out for this type of snobbery.
When a person buys a forged blade, the type of steel used has been around much, much longer than 440C, but the buyers don't give it a thought, nor should they.
Think about it,01, 1095, 5160, 1045, 1050, etc. All of these have been in use since the turn of the 20th century, if not before. They all make great blades.
There are no surprises with 440C. It is a reliable, and tough stain resistant steel. The big secret is a good heat treat, including cryo.
 
Although I am not about to jump into Jerry's controversy, I dont understand everyone here sticking up for a knife steel that was in use back in the 50's!!!!
It is now 2002.
Crucible has made strides that would have been unthinkable 20 years ago. The CPM 440V rose the bar beyond belief in edge holding and that was only the beginning for them. Soon they brought out 420V, better edge holding and tougher. Then 3V, 10V, etc etc etc. Now we have Stainless 3V and it is looking SO good that many of the top production companies are beginning to switch over to it, including Chris Reeve!!!!! The newer Stellite formulas dont rust and hold an edge for a LONG time......
DUDES>>>>>>>>>>>>> it is a NEW millineum.......lets not sit on our hands here.......the golden age of knifemaking is turning to platinum, and we get to benefit. 440C and ATS are steels from a distant past................... :) :) :)
 
I'm a Knifenut not an Alloy Addict. If I like the knife and respect the maker I don't care what he decides to use, as long as he stands behind his product. That's not to say I don't care about quality, I sure do. That's why I own a Fowler Prong horn, which for me is the ultimate of a High-performance blade. I also own a Carsom Model 4 in Stellite, that blades cuts on par with the 52100 in my Prong horn. To be honest I bought my knife from Kit because of the stag scales. It wasn't until I was showing the knife off to friends and they started saying, "Ohhhhh Stellite!" That's when I had to find out what they heck Stellite was. :rolleyes:
The fact is, I would have bought either of these knives if Kit or Ed had decided to use 440C, Aluminum or petrified smegma, because neither of these two guys, (and most of the makers I know) would put their name on a knife that wasn't a great knife. I've designed a couple of knives to be made, and I can show a maker how I want the knife to look, what I don't tell them is what steel would be best. The only exception is that I want Kit to make me a Chute knife and I requested Stellite to go with my folder. Other than that I trust the makers I work with.
 
Hey, I'm as close to a steel snob as anyone, but I continue to use 154CM because it is a good steel that's fairly easy to work, takes a great polish, and allows me to sell someone a knife for less money because of the fewer hours I put into the blade. For 90% of my customers, including many who use knives in very high stress situations, it is a very adequate steel. It's not CPM-3V or S30V, but it's good. 440C is a good steel, takes a better polish than 154CM, and is quite a bit more rust resistant.

I guess the irony here is that the maker is getting blamed for making what the heck he wants to make, and allowing someone to buy it. Nobody forces anyone to buy a knife. If you don't like 440C, don't buy the knife. In the case of the maker whom I believe this is about, he sells that knife off his table at knife shows for $550. People wait in line to buy them and fights have almost broken out over who got how many. It's amazing tpo watch. At least half the people who buy them walk across the room and resell the same knife for over $1000. Dealers routinely sell them for $800, Why is the maker to blame? I think this is what we call capitalism. It's a great system!
 
I'd rather have a properly heat-treated 420HC knife made by a custom maker like Jerry, Tom, or Kit, than a 440C blade with bad heat treat.

Tom, many of those knives made in the 50s are still handed down to the next generation, and have lasted to this day. That does say at least something good about the 440C steel doesn't it?
 
Man I can understand some folks wanting a cheaper knife from a popular maker but I don't understand some of the butt ugly popular knives out right now with obvious CNC marks all over them. It looks like you get a fan club going, rip off some new looks, anodize them and sell a bunch... I wouldn't say at any price but I don't get some of the prices charged for that level of design and workmanship. It really is all supply and demand...
 
Before I buy the knife, I buy the knifemaker. That is to say that I feel comfortable with the knifemaker's judgement on all sorts of choices, including what would be the best steel for that particular knife.

I figure there are reasons this particular knifemaker is using 440C, and that it's not done to save a few pennies. In fact, I can't see that the cost difference from 440C to something "sexy" like S30V is going to have a big effect on profit margin--this would only work if you are selling a LOT of knives (i.e. production, not custom).
 
My knife gathering consists blade steels made of 02, ATS-34, 440C, BG-42, 420V, D2, Stellite, AUG-8, 154CM, S90V, S60V, S30V and a bunch of damascus. . .

And ? ? ?

Each one works for me !

Hell, I'm just a knife snob !
 
If we're going to be honest - I really can't tell that much difference between steels. My limited experience has shown me that the heat treat makes more of a difference for my uses.

If my favorite maker honestly feels that 440C is the best steel for the knife he's making then I'll get a 440C knife. If I think maker is full of sh!t and just doing it to save a buck or two that maker probably isn't my favorite maker.

Jerry, I'm curious who you are referring to:
i know a CERTAIN makers knife is in HIGH demand..and i can understand that, as he has some really cool designs..but, what is it with the use of 440c as the main blade?
Click to expand...

Ken Onion strongly believes in the merits of 440C - I think that's what he used to use on most of his knives. Now he's switched to BG-42. But I guess it's not him you're referring to, since none of his plain stuff is that expensive. :)

~Mitch
 
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