Pyramids for sharpening

Just my 2 cents,

I studied on my own the Qi and it's effect on human or inanimate objects. Based on Choa Kok Sui's book on Pranic Healing (He is a Chinese Filipinos, book can be found on Amazon.com) and tested the result myself on the healing power.
I believe the pyramid phenomenon has to do with concentrating fresh good Qi onto the object that yields the effect.

Like leather and rubber prevents Qi flowing, some blade material are easier to be affected then others, thus sort of 'explain' Cougar's finding

I experience that through meditation, the flow of Qi is stronger and cleaner. Yes you may argue it is in the mind but human mind is very powerful and Qi is directed by the mind.

60% of normal people can sense heat/pulse when they hold the imaginary 5-10"diameter ball between the hands and concentrate on the middle of the palm, relax and breathing normally. Further simple proof is that one can push or pull (by simply willing it)to other person's palm and he/she whill know exactly whether it is pull or push. This is not telepathy as telepathy is at much finer level than just the brute Qi flowing in / out.

For those who still don't believe it, no problem. After all, no one can force a belief onto others .. ;)
And BTW, the pranic healing will work less effective if the recipient do not believe it. As Qi obeys the mind, unbelieving mind will block its flow .. I guess ...

Do anyone believe in accupuncture? Till years ago, the 'scientific world' disbelieve its effectiveness and only lately it is being embraced. Also I believe the approach is different: the western science wants hard proof, while the eastern approach is empirical, as long as it works, it is there.
I read also "Tao of Physics" by Fritjof Capra, a scientist and TaiChi practitioner .. that found the end point where East meets West or vice versa ;)
And do you believe light is wave or particle?

When it comes to the truth, no science can claim absolute truth, only "truth as far as our theory has been so far proven" and that "it is subject to change based on next finding" ... remember Newtonian and Einsteinian kinetic theory ?
If seeing is believing, our modern scientists should be very skeptical as they don't see the proof anymore, but through some measuring equipment that in sub-atomic level the reliability goes only so far ..

Cougar,
When you say true North, is it north pole or the magnetic north?
And what is the fomula? i.e. the ration between the base square and the height .. that will give a precise pyramid ..Thanks.
 
My English is not good so i guess BaliSwinger and Cougar made my point exactly..."What you don't see/hear/feel or smell doesn't mean it isn't there"...SO, why believe in GOD when non of us have ever meet him/her(whatever)?

I'm not being hostile here, just curious and amazed at the amount of professional "critics"/"skeptics" we have here. A century ago, who would have believe a Giant Metal Bird could fly?....Tsk..Tsk...

Eric Wong.
 
Originally posted by keninshiro
Humm...what was i thinking?:rolleyes: Maybe it's my fault for not letting you know that the apple outside of the pyramid on the table was COVERED as well!? :eek: Duhhh! Simple Science 101... Nough' said.
Eric Wong.
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That isn't what you said at all. You explicitly stated that the other apple was "out-side on the lab table next to the pyrmaid." This, to me, cannot be interpreted as anything but uncovered.

Eric Wong originally stated:
I have personally experimented with a small scale pyramid made out of perspect and an apple in it's core. As strange as it may seem, the apple in the pyramid lasted longer than the one placed out-side on the lab table next to the pyramid.

There seem to be a great many people who believe this, but I'm afraid I just can't accept it, no matter how many pyramid believers have testimonials to offer. It just has no basis in reality.

I'm not being hostile here, just curious and amazed at the amount of professional "critics"/"skeptics" we have here. A century ago, who would have believe a Giant Metal Bird could fly?.... Tsk.. Tsk...
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The difference being, of course, that those who built "giant metal birds" promptly went out and showed everybody that they worked. Apart from anecdotes from believers (which, scientifically, simply cannot constitute convincing evidence), there is no scientific evidence that shows pyramids possess these special powers.

If someone wants to offer actual scientific (i.e., double-blind) results, I might change my mind. Until then, "pyramid power" is as believable as powdered unicorn horn (that legendary Viagra substitute).
 
Friends,

Just another example:

accupuncture might work quickly for some but might take longer to work for others...

does it make less scientific than:

Valium works fine for some but has ill effect on others ...

If science = proven, anything about pranic healing, or some yogi lifted to air during intense meditation, or some Indonesia martial artist is 'immune' to slashing and stabbing .. does it proof anything?
Do you need to witness yourself everything then you conclude it is scientific? Anyone has witnessed atomic bomb?

When logic is questioned, "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" by Robert M. Pirsig argues heavily and on logical basis about the foundation of western scientific method ..

I am not belittling the current western technology, without which we would not be able eradicating small pox and send men to moon and has tight tolerance on BM42, but I think we should also give chance to esoteric teachings to proof themselves.

I argue using accupuncture because I know it is more readily accepted by the western mind than other more delicate and finer aspect of esoterics, which I think pyramid theory is one of them.

But again, at the end it doesn't matter what you belief, but does it make you a better person that counts.
 
Several posts in this thread attempt to equate skepticism of "pyramid power" with logical inconcistency regarding the nature of science, dogged empiricism, unwillingness to accept "new ideas," or simple obstinacy. This is incorrect; the classic example would be the idea that no one can prove there are no faeries at the bottom of my garden, but niether have I any reason whatseover to believe that there may be (even if I'm told by several believers in faeries that such creatures exist).

Some have said science can never really "prove" anything, and semantically this may indeed be the case. The fact remains, however, that the application of reason and logic to one's day-to-day existence provides one with a pretty good set of guidelines regarding what one should and should not, at least, take under consideration.

I can see no logical basis under which "pyramid power" might work, nor have I seen or heard anything which constitutes a compelling (or even logically plausible) explanation for why this could be true. Therefore, there is absolutely no reason why I should believe it. I will not merely take on faith a claim that sounds absurd; it is the responsibility of those making the claim to back it up.

This skepticism is perfectly logical, and a much more reasonable assumption than the belief that pyramids can magickally sharpen your cats and preserve your knives. It is intellectually dishonest to then accuse those of us who are naturally skeptical of such claims of being somehow unwilling to embrace higher enlightenment.

Frankly, I'm a little astounded just how many believers in "pyramid power" we have -- and how vehement they are in their belief that those of us who don't buy into this hokum are luddites who can't see a glorious leap forward in scientific progress.

This has been illuminating -- but not convincing.
 
I'm as hooky-spooky as the next guy, probably a lot more so than most. I'm also pretty good at spotting BS. This sets off all the alarms of it.
We had a post in Shop Talk some time ago about aligning your quench tank to magnetic north. While I personally don't think it would make an appreciable difference, it does not sound illogical. Magnetics affect steel. This we know. To say that pointing your blades to the likeliest magnetic source to affect your blade when it's structure is being aligned is at least a linked concept.
The only things special about the pyramid shape are that they make a rather nice prism when made out of glass or plastic, and that they're an inherently strong shape. These are really due to the fact that they involve triangles, though. The reason that the ancient egyptians used them is because they would last forever, and that they figured out how. Sharpening knives? Mummifying cats? This doesn't strike anyone else as silly?
There have also been studies to prove the benefits of acupuncture and acupressure, as well as the existence of Qi. This does not fit under that umbrella. I happen to have a rather nice pyramid that came with my Franklin Mint chess set. I used one as a control, one as the experiment, cut carboard up with them.(Mountain Dew boxes, always have lots of those around.) I should have counted the cuts, but I neglected to. I cut with one, put it down and cut with the other. When they were both rather dangerously dull, I put the experiment one under the pyramid, and checked three days later, tried cutting with both of them again. Nearly hurt myself with the experiment blade. They're both dull.
My point? This is stupid. I felt like a jackass for even trying this, knowing from the beginning that it's stupid. Wasted two otherwise useful shop razors on this idiocy. I guess it I had wanted to believe it, and on some level I'm sure that I did, it might have worked better. But I didn't want to believe it more than I wanted to know the truth.
 
This thread seems to be taking on a life of its own, so I had to ask myself why. Well, the subject of "magical" pyramid power is a kind of intellectual knife (hey this is Bladeforums). It tends to cut into different ways of looking at the world Those of us inclined toward logical, scientific explanations for why something works or does not work cross swords with those of us who willingly take things on faith, or as some others have put it, on empirical evidence. But let's not mix apples and oranges here. Empirical evidence means something can be demonstrated through phyicical experiment, and that experiment must be reproducable by a "disinterested third party." Anecdotes are notorious for only working part of the time.

Whether or not Qi exists is debatable, but saying those who do not believe in it can't feel it is the ultimate "flag" to those who want scientific proof, because the opposite applies to empirically derived facts, i.e., it does not matter whether or not you believe in electricity, if you stand in a puddle of water and stick your finger in a light socket you are going to get shocked (if the electricity is on). That experiment can be reproduced every time, or if not, the reason why is easy to explain (the person is wearing rubber gloves one time and not the next).

It is exactly for this reason why scientific methodology is the most powerful methodology in human history. It works. Nothing succeeds like success. Science has supplanted all other beliefs and methodologies because those who have stood against it have perished both intellectually and physically. Don't even bother to debate this. Western scientific method rules the world. Other nations have adopted it to survive, even history's most spiritual and mystical cultures have had to convert to compete. Witness India, China, Japan, etc.

If anyone knows of a good, empirical study regarding pyramid power that supports its magical abilities (as opposed to debunking them), please lead us to this reference. Anecdotal observations don't count for scientific types. For those of us who do believe in powers beyond those subject to scientific analysis, it is sometimes best to smile knowingly and move on. Science has no power over that smile, but be prepared to shave with a dull blade if your belief wavers.

Is science the last and only answer? I doubt it. Is mysticism wrong, I doubt that as well, but even then my harsh, western scientific mind set requires me to qualify by saying that's because we don't yet understand the physical processes at work. In the end we need both ways of looking at the world to ensure every facet of our existence is explored to its fullest. So while I side with Razoredj, I do not want to eliminate the discussion. I won't be building pyramids to sharpen my knives, my diamond hones work well for that and while I understand why they work, they will work whether or not I believe in them.

By the way, Robert Pirsig did not discredit western scientific methodology in "ZEN and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance," he married the objective to the subjective and brought it all back to one principal - Quality. His claim was that Aristotle had severed the connection and that had been an intellectual mistake perpetuated by those too timid to call it such. Much of that book deals with ways to live with hard, scientific facts, like a motorcycle that needs repair, or a son with mental problems.
 
There is a show about the pyramids on the History or Learning Channel that is on rather frequently and they discuss this very thing. It basically goes like this. "The pyramids supposedly have powers that can sharpen razor blades, keep food from rotting and keep flowers from wilting. We put a vase of flowers, a basket of fruit and several razor blade inside the pyramid. We came back later and found that the flowers had wilted, the razor blades rusted and rats had ate the fruit." Thats not an exact quote or anything but you get the idea.
 
Some years ago, during a particularly stressful and chaotic period at work, my friends and I decided to properly equip ourselves for an upcoming departmental meeting. Sure enough when the discussion started getting a little out of control we whipped out anti-static bags and slipped them over our heads. "We trying to reduce the static and think clearly" was our explanation. It worked and the meeting quickly got back on track. Now do any of you actually believe that the anti-static property of our head gear had anything to do with the results. I think they were just humoring the crazy guys. :)
 
Originally posted by Razoredj


That isn't what you said at all. You explicitly stated that the other apple was "out-side on the lab table next to the pyrmaid." This, to me, cannot be interpreted as anything but uncovered.

Eric Wong originally stated:
I have personally experimented with a small scale pyramid made out of perspect and an apple in it's core. As strange as it may seem, the apple in the pyramid lasted longer than the one placed out-side on the lab table next to the pyramid.

There seem to be a great many people who believe this, but I'm afraid I just can't accept it, no matter how many pyramid believers have testimonials to offer. It just has no basis in reality.



The difference being, of course, that those who built "giant metal birds" promptly went out and showed everybody that they worked. Apart from anecdotes from believers (which, scientifically, simply cannot constitute convincing evidence), there is no scientific evidence that shows pyramids possess these special powers.

If someone wants to offer actual scientific (i.e., double-blind) results, I might change my mind. Until then, "pyramid power" is as believable as powdered unicorn horn (that legendary Viagra substitute).
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Dear Razoredj :rolleyes:

I'm not doubting the powers that science have and that it had ruled the world. Hell! It had healed me from cold and fever more than once. I work as a media designer and i'm in constant contact with technologies and softwares 30% of the world does not understand, does that mean i'll rule out believes that does not have scientific evidence? BTW, you did not answer my question if GOD do really exsist!? You merely TRY to make me look stupid for the argument of my grammer! OF whether i did cover the apple next to the pyramid! ANY DONKEY knows that to obtain the same result, test materials must be subjected to the SAME condition which the apple next to the pyramid was covered with a square perspec. Must i write EVERTHING? :eek:

I do not believe in the fact pyramids can sharpen your knives better than a 204(i have one...)or it can maintain sharpness...NOR is ANYONE here forcing you to believe in it's power. I'm just irritated by skeptics who rules out ANYTHING that is not logical...please tell me you don't believe in GOD!? Maybe then, i'll buy what you have to sell...

Eric Wong.

P.S: To those who wants to conduct this experiment, please construct your pyramid with perspec that is TOTALLY covered? Skeleton strcutures will attract small animals that will eat your apple...or fruit flys will lay eggs and rott your apple too!
 
I'm not doubting the powers that science have and that it had ruled the world. Hell! It had healed me from cold and fever more than once. I work as a media designer and i'm in constant contact with technologies and softwares 30% of the world does not understand, does that mean i'll rule out believes that does not have scientific evidence? BTW, you did not answer my question if GOD do really exsist!? You merely TRY to make me look stupid for the argument of my grammer!
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I'm happy for your great and powerful understanding of "softwares," Eric, but I'm not sure from where your hostility comes. I think the criticisms I've offered have been quite reasonable. We are not discussing the existence of God in this thread (though there is no scientific evidence for the existence of God, either; religion is an entirely subjective matter). No one is trying to make you look stupid, and I don't recall taking you to task for your "grammer."

OF whether i did cover the apple next to the pyramid! ANY DONKEY knows that to obtain the same result, test materials must be subjected to the SAME condition which the apple next to the pyramid was covered with a square perspec. Must i write EVERTHING?
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In this instance, yes, since what you wrote appeared directly to contradict that scientific principle. Since belief in pyramid power is anything but scientific in nature, one simply cannot assume that its adherents are indeed applying proper scientific method to the tests they have conducted.

I do not believe in the fact pyramids can sharpen your knives better than a 204(i have one...)or it can maintain sharpness...NOR is ANYONE here forcing you to believe in it's power.
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Who said anyone was being forced to believe anything?

I'm just irritated by skeptics who rules out ANYTHING that is not logical
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Logic and reason are the means by which humans objectively learn about the world around them. Mysticism is entertaining, and sometimes very fulfilling, but it is not the proper path to knowledge.

...please tell me you don't believe in GOD!? Maybe then, i'll buy what you have to sell...
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Eric, I am not "selling" anything. Quite the contrary; belivers in pyramid power are attempting to "sell" a ridiculous notion based in superstition. Whether or not I believe in God or gods has nothing to do with it and, quite frankly, is none of your business. Believe what you like, friend; just don't expect anyone else to accept ideas that have no reasonable basis.

You seem to be very angry that your ideas have not achieved widespread acceptance; skepticism is the rational and reasonable default position for assertions that have no evidence to support them, and should not cause the level of anger you seem to display. I suggest you explore precisely why it is that "pyramid power non-believers" upset you so.
 
Dear Razor,

You indeed have an excellent skill in writing, i'm all AWE by your ability. I'm not angry at what you wrote or if anyone is going to believe me in this pyramid thingy but from what i gathered, you seem to be calling those who believe stupid?...lack of logical ability?...Frankly, i don't seek "knowledge" in such believes, there are proper Universities for knowledge seekers.

From where this thread is going, it is not ONLY about pyramid but the nature of this whole entire subject we humans call it "believes". I don't care if you believe in GOD but don't call out his name in vain when you're falling off a building...

I'm done here knowing i'll NEVER gain ANYTHING against a language professor...but a headache.:p

Stay clam everyone, i'll shut-up now....

Eric WOng.
 
You indeed have an excellent skill in writing, i'm all AWE by your ability.
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Of all the comments I've ever received on my ability to write, the phrase "i'm all AWE by your ability" has to be close to my favorite.

I'm not angry at what you wrote or if anyone is going to believe me in this pyramid thingy but from what i gathered, you seem to be calling those who believe stupid?...lack of logical ability?
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I'm not calling anyone stupid, Eric. There are plenty of wonderful, intelligent people in the world who nevertheless aren't entirely logical; that's just human nature. Most of us harbor some superstitions. I'm merely arguing for common, reasonable sense, and attempting to discourage what I see as a groundless old wives' tale. The concept of a knife's sharpness, while somewhat subjective, may nevertheless be tested objectively. I see no reason to become entangled in mysticism when it isn't necessary. (For that same reason, I don't follow the old superstition that one must give someone a coin in exchange for the gift of a knife.)

...Frankly, i don't seek "knowledge" in such believes, there are proper Universities for knowledge seekers.
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The appropriate task of every human being is to seek knowledge. When you stop learning, you may as well stop living.

From where this thread is going, it is not ONLY about pyramid but the nature of this whole entire subject we humans call it "believes".
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Fine, but that does not in any way make unreasonable any of the criticisms of the subject that I've offered.

I don't care if you believe in GOD but don't call out his name in vain when you're falling off a building...
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The next time I jump off a building, I'll keep that in mind.

I'm done here knowing i'll NEVER gain ANYTHING against a language professor...but a headache.
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By all means, then, avoid language professors.

Stay clam everyone, i'll shut-up now....
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The reference to shellfish is a bit esoteric, but your points are taken as they were offered.
 
Razor didn't call it stupid, I did. And I was referring to this concept, not in its believers. I've known many otherwise perfectly intelligent people that insisted on the most base idiocy imaginable. And this pyramid concept is pretty close.
But perhaps I'm biased because I wasted my time on it.
 
This whole e-conversation is so funny I'm rolling on the floor laughing my ass off. It reminds me of conversations I had as a youth. Proponents of a particular religion (pick one) would engage me in conversation with the full intent of converting me to their beliefs (although I now think they were trying to bolster their own beliefs through the discussion rather than convince me of the rightness of their perspective). I quickly discovered these conversations went on endlessly if I took an atheistic position. However, if I simply told them I worshipped Satan the conversation came to an abrupt end. Now I'm not sure if my supposed affiliation with the Dark Side drove them off, or if my assertion that I at least "believed" in something satisfied their need to reaffirm their own beliefs. Either way it ended and I went on my way. With that in mind, I must tell those who believe in pyramid power that I have discovered highway traffic cones (the florescent orange ones only) are far superior to ordinary pyramids when it comes to perserving dead cats (don't try this with a live cat, they really don't like it)and sharpening razor blades. So go out and grab one off the highway and run your own tests. You will be amazed. :D

The foregoing is not meant to imply I am either an atheist, a Satanist or Conist, just that we need to keep this all in perspective, and think about what Razoredj is saying. Why are those of us who are so adamant about pyramid power getting angry about this dialogue. Are you trying to convince yourself as much as those of us who think otherwise?

Now how does this apply to knives? Many of us, me included, have definite feelings about specific blade styles, steel (and non steel) recipes, and makers. We even imbue certain materials and blades with almost mystical properties (yeah, the Sebenza rules!). None of these feelings should be confused with actual data supporting the effectiveness of a particular knife or steel composition. That is the real value of this forum. In here we get to read the results of tests conducted by knowledgeable folks, like Cliff Stamp, so that we can make reasonable decisions about how we spend our hard earned money.
 
Well,

I was out from the net for a couple of days and all needs to be said has been said.

Not meaning to offend anyone and was not offended myself, I am happy that we all discuss this to a rather 'warm' temperature without getting it hot and lose our temper! :D

I merely want to highlight to the skeptics the possibilities out there and seems that even though Razor in this case dismiss the Pyramid case and I disagree with him, in general I do agree with him and Steelhed ...

And thanks for pointing out Phaedrus point .. which in another way was saying: reality is always perceived with the influence of framework its used against ..

One thing I fully agree with Razor is the troll bashing ;)
 
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