Long story short, handle a few then make your decision. People like Strider, and they are ugly as sin.
Completely agreed
+1
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Long story short, handle a few then make your decision. People like Strider, and they are ugly as sin.
So like so many others, you will immediately judge a book by its cover. I owned (very briefly) a Mantis Pit Boss, and aside from being smooth to open it was unmitigated crap. I really gave that knife as much of a try as possible, but it just sucked. I was curious when I saw Quartermaster because they had similar designs but improved everything (proper steel, bearings, improved ergos). The Pit Boss was all hotspots, every edge was 90°, but the Murdock that I fell in love with has all chamfered edges. The G10 has just the right grip, and the jimping is grippy but not sharp.
Long story short, handle a few then make your decision. People like Strider, and they are ugly as sin.
@Noctis
With given respect, mate, to my knowledge the only commercial/production folding knife born to be used as a pry bar is E.R. RAO.
I owned many Strider knives and using them without gloves it brought about blisters, not to mention the ABSURD (today I'm in polite mode) price they're sold at, which makes it economically cheaper to buy a custom folder with custom handles, design and steel (heat treated per my knowledge and likings).
Then. ZT knives...also here I can chime in. Model 0560 i.e. Elmax steel, titanium frame (one side) and butter smooth opening.
When it came to my regular 1yr servicing inspection that I do on each of my folders I grabbed the torx keys of mine and tried to unscrew the screws. Sorry to say that they were glued, so I had to have the frame clamped and with some lubrificant and a lot of efforts I eventually managed to get things done. At which point I discovered quite an interesting fact: all of the torx sockets have quit, were no longer usable. Nice isn't it?
So I wrote to ZT and they said they would have shipped the screw set in a few days. It was March the 3rd of current year. No screws yet, but I went it my own way and bought some #6 - 32 UNC Socket Button Headed Screws, Allen Bolts 1936-60 UNC Thread - Grade 12.9, Self Coloured (due to HT).
So, original screws, including pivot screw that I'm replacing as well, were not HTd and were VERY mild, which I could accept in a 30EUR knife but not here.
Like it or not QTRMSTR uses a fully hardened stainless steel frame/screws/pivot screw asset and this means A LOT MORE mechanical resistance.
This at a fraction of the price of ZT/Strider.
What about blade performance of my own QTRMSTR #6 against my own ZT 0560 ?
Admittedly I'd both HRC tested. 61.2 and 59.8 respectively. Elmax should be HTd at 61+ to deliver its own, so all I can say is that edge holding is on par, with slightly more stain resistance to ZT 0560 credit.
Bottom line: titanium frames on steel blades (R.I.L. locking system) are not my own preferite ticket as far as reliability and long term even wear resistance are concerned.
Looks like a prybar, but I wouldn't say it's "born to be used as a prybar" unless it's 2 feet long where you can get some leverage on it with two hands.@Noctis
With given respect, mate, to my knowledge the only commercial/production folding knife born to be used as a pry bar is E.R. RAO.
Agreed that the handles look like they would shred your hands, to say nothing of actually using one. Thus why I placed specific emphasis on the CC versions, which again seem to sell out the fastest.I owned many Strider knives and using them without gloves it brought about blisters, not to mention the ABSURD (today I'm in polite mode) price they're sold at, which makes it economically cheaper to buy a custom folder with custom handles, design and steel (heat treated per my knowledge and likings).
I assume "quit" means you stripped the heads? I did that quite a bit myself before some more careful reading on these forums reveals that all of their screws are held on with blue loctite. A soldering iron held to the screws prior to removal stopped that from happening again.Then. ZT knives...also here I can chime in. Model 0560 i.e. Elmax steel, titanium frame (one side) and butter smooth opening.
When it came to my regular 1yr servicing inspection that I do on each of my folders I grabbed the torx keys of mine and tried to unscrew the screws. Sorry to say that they were glued, so I had to have the frame clamped and with some lubrificant and a lot of efforts I eventually managed to get things done. At which point I discovered quite an interesting fact: all of the torx sockets have quit, were no longer usable. Nice isn't it?![]()
Might be an issue with you being overseas. I got my replacement parts from them(including liners for a ZT 0551) quick and free of charge.So I wrote to ZT and they said they would have shipped the screw set in a few days. It was March the 3rd of current year. No screws yet, but I went it my own way and bought some #6 - 32 UNC Socket Button Headed Screws, Allen Bolts 1936-60 UNC Thread - Grade 12.9, Self Coloured (due to HT).
Honestly, I don't know anyone else who specifically uses hardened screws in a knife. It's not practical in a mass production standpoint, and those screws typically aren't manufactured with knives in mind.So, original screws, including pivot screw that I'm replacing as well, were not HTd and were VERY mild, which I could accept in a 30EUR knife but not here.
Assuming for a moment that's true, it either makes their country of origin suspect, or they're using illegal immigrant labor. Assuming it's true of course. I mean, maybe someone can request spare parts from them and either test the hardness with a Rockwell diamond penetrator or a file:thumbup:.Like it or not QTRMSTR uses a fully hardened stainless steel frame/screws/pivot screw asset and this means A LOT MORE mechanical resistance.
This at a fraction of the price of ZT/Strider.
Would be interesting if it's true, given the lower carbide volume of BD-4P.What about blade performance of my own QTRMSTR #6 against my own ZT 0560 ?
Admittedly I'd both HRC tested. 61.2 and 59.8 respectively. Elmax should be HTd at 61+ to deliver its own, so all I can say is that edge holding is on par, with slightly more stain resistance to ZT 0560 credit.
How long is long term? None of my framelocks ever wore down to the point where it contacted the opposite scale, save for a ZT 0301 that came like that out of the box(which was promptly sent back and adjusted, and now locks up at 50% and hasn't moved a millimeter since).Bottom line: titanium frames on steel blades (R.I.L. locking system) are not my own preferite ticket as far as reliability and long term even wear resistance are concerned.
I've actually never seen a steel framelock on a full sized knife. Maybe on something like a Kershaw Shallot where it's small and relatively thin, but not on something the size and thickness of a ZT 0560. I assume weight is the biggest consideration there, as it would be like carrying around a 12 oz folding knife, at which point we might as well just call it a sharpened brick:thumbup:.I'm new to knives and all, and I don't quite understand why so many knives use titanium lock frames. Stainless steel is significantly stronger as a frame or linerlock, and it's cheaper. Maybe there's not much difference?
Looks like a prybar, but I wouldn't say it's "born to be used as a prybar" unless it's 2 feet long where you can get some leverage on it with two hands.
Agreed that the handles look like they would shred your hands, to say nothing of actually using one. Thus why I placed specific emphasis on the CC versions, which again seem to sell out the fastest.
As far as full customs, I think that'll largely depend on materials and the maker. I've yet to have one made that is 100% custom designed as opposed to pre-made designs like Andrew Demko's AD-10(for reference, mine costs $800 with M390 steel and Desert Ironwood inlays). I'd expect such customs to have an extra premium tacked on for that effort. As well, I again made specific mention to the handle design, which looks like a real pleasure to handle(CC model again). I doubt many makers would be willing to rip off that design feature.
I assume "quit" means you stripped the heads? I did that quite a bit myself before some more careful reading on these forums reveals that all of their screws are held on with blue loctite. A soldering iron held to the screws prior to removal stopped that from happening again.
Might be an issue with you being overseas. I got my replacement parts from them(including liners for a ZT 0551) quick and free of charge.
Honestly, I don't know anyone else who specifically uses hardened screws in a knife. It's not practical in a mass production standpoint, and those screws typically aren't manufactured with knives in mind.
I've actually never seen a steel framelock on a full sized knife. Maybe on something like a Kershaw Shallot where it's small and relatively thin, but not on something the size and thickness of a ZT 0560. I assume weight is the biggest consideration there, as it would be like carrying around a 12 oz folding knife, at which point we might as well just call it a sharpened brick:thumbup:.
Assuming for a moment that's true, it either makes their country of origin suspect, or they're using illegal immigrant labor. Assuming it's true of course. I mean, maybe someone can request spare parts from them and either test the hardness with a Rockwell diamond penetrator or a file:thumbup:.
Putting aside the added costs of properly hardened contact points, unless the screws are also only hardened at certain points, a hardened screw would also be more brittle and prone to breaking under strain/shock(say, if you stab something solid, or drop your knife). That also holds true if only the head is hardened, because it could break off from the screw body unless we're talking about case hardening or some kind of hard coating.
Would be interesting if it's true, given the lower carbide volume of BD-4P.
How long is long term? None of my framelocks ever wore down to the point where it contacted the opposite scale, save for a ZT 0301 that came like that out of the box(which was promptly sent back and adjusted, and now locks up at 50% and hasn't moved a millimeter since).
I've actually never seen a steel framelock on a full sized knife. Maybe on something like a Kershaw Shallot where it's small and relatively thin, but not on something the size and thickness of a ZT 0560. I assume weight is the biggest consideration there, as it would be like carrying around a 12 oz folding knife, at which point we might as well just call it a sharpened brick:thumbup:.
I'm new to knives and all, and I don't quite understand why so many knives use titanium lock frames. Stainless steel is significantly stronger as a frame or linerlock, and it's cheaper. Maybe there's not much difference?
Titanium is whole lot (I think like 40%) lighter, is practically corrosion proof, and I believe has a better tensile strength and toughness.
I only have had a few steel frame locks, but titanium makes the knife feel less brick like.
There seems to be a likelyhood of these being manufactured elsewhere, probably in China. If so, this is one of the better examples of what they are now able to do with higher priced knives. A few bigger names use Chinese manufacturers for their budget lines but in a few years I bet you'll see this kind of quality work competing at it's proper price level as a Chinese product.
I don't care for the dishonest marketing but it sounds like they got their contractor to give them the quality they wanted. Jared's crazy designs are getting a better treatment now than Mantis seems to have been capable of. All he needs now is a model that'll catch on with the general knife crowd. Sounds like the quality is there.
How is the steel performing on these?