Ranking of Steels in Categories based on Edge Retention cutting 5/8" rope

It's good to see production companies dialing in more on steel grades and hardness values to the intended use. I would like to see the edges thinned out more though, specially on hunters and folders.
 
chiral.grolim said:
:eek: Why would they NOT advertise that hardness? I'd be shouting it from the proverbial roof-tops! What a performer!
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Not sure, but it's a Hunter so I suppose they wanted better edge retention. :)

waterstoneblades said:
It's good to see production companies dialing in more on steel grades and hardness values to the intended use. I would like to see the edges thinned out more though, specially on hunters and folders.
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Well they have to be smart about it with all the later type YT videos etc. ;)
 
S30v appears to still be a decent steel even with super steels becoming the norm, its closer to zdp189, m390 etc than to vg10. Also I really need something in s110v :eek:
 
SBaker34 said:
S30v appears to still be a decent steel even with super steels becoming the norm, its closer to zdp189, m390 etc than to vg10. Also I really need something in s110v :eek:
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S30V/S35VN are well balanced steels. :)
 
How did that harder XHP feel? Still like the Mili you had? It is one of my favorite SS because of how easy it sharpens and polishes, plus how it seems to hold that keen edge well.
 
nccole said:
How did that harder XHP feel? Still like the Mili you had? It is one of my favorite SS because of how easy it sharpens and polishes, plus how it seems to hold that keen edge well.
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It was VERY aggressive and held a very sharp edge for a VERY long time.

Still carry my Military and Sebenza. :)

Have to work in the UH over time as I have a need for it etc, very nice knife really.
 
I m surprised at the hardness numbers you got on the Ultimate Hunter. I find mine easier to touch up on my sharpmaker than my American lawman. I wonder how much the numbers vary from batch to batch. My first two Cold Steels . Got them because of the steel up grade and I was happy with the idea of an rc of 60-61. I like 62-63 better. I ll use my Hunter more outside the next few weeks and see how my edge holds up.
I greatly appreciate your testing.
 
Ankerson said:
S30V/S35VN are well balanced steels. :)
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Indeed they are. I just ended testing edge holding of my Fantoni Hide S30V Carbon Fiber First Production Run #16/25, 61-62HRC and it went as far as 620 cuts with stock edge and 400 Naniwa Chosera . Thickness behind the edge was 0.021" and stock angle was 20° included. Not too bad at all!

CTS-XHP
Cold Steel Ultimate Hunter - 63-64 HRC
If HRC figures are right they MUST have used deep-cryo AND an austenitizing temp of at least 1066°C (probably even more) and a tempering at 200°C.
This brings a lot of good news: edge holding and stability, approximately 15% Cr7C3 carbides and nearly 11% Cr in solid solution (corrosion resistance), albeit I wouldn't go below 20° inclusive should I wish to stay on the safe side.
 
daberti said:
Indeed they are. I just ended testing edge holding of my Fantoni Hide S30V Carbon Fiber First Production Run #16/25, 61-62HRC and it went as far as 620 cuts with stock edge and 400 Naniwa Chosera . Thickness behind the edge was 0.021" and stock angle was 20° included. Not too bad at all!
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Nothing to complain about there. :)

daberti said:
CTS-XHP
Cold Steel Ultimate Hunter - 63-64 HRC
If HRC figures are right they MUST have used deep-cryo AND an austenitizing temp of at least 1066°C (probably even more) and a tempering at 200°C.
This brings a lot of good news: edge holding and stability, approximately 15% Cr7C3 carbides and nearly 11% Cr in solid solution (corrosion resistance), albeit I wouldn't go below 20° inclusive should I wish to stay on the safe side.
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I have no reason to doubt my source on the hardness figures taking into count the way it performed and the actual sharpness level before and after testing was measured.
 
ArcticHighlander said:
How do you know that it is 63-64 HRC and not the 60-61 that they advertise?
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I did a quick check with my testing files.. They are accurate, confirmed accurate. ;)

Based on my actual source and my files it's actually harder than 61-62 and softer than 64-65 so that would put it in the 63 range. ;)

Still thinking about sending the blade off to confirm what it is, I am thinking 63 actual.
 
[emoji106]
Better checking 'cause was it in the 62.5-63 realm it could be so by means of 1040°C/200°C and no deep cryo, in which case a lot of BAD news would chime in.
In simpler words, what I wrote above it is valid only from 63.5 to 64.
 
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daberti said:
[emoji106]
Better checking 'cause was it in the 62.5-63 realm it could be so by means of 1040°C/200°C and no deep cryo, in which case a lot of BAD news would chime in.
In simpler words, what I wrote above it is valid only from 63.5 to 64.
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Saw zero chipping so the HT is good. :thumbup:
 
Clearly it is. But at 1040°c we would see a lottta less stain resistance with 9% or alike Cr in solid solution. At this point for the same price +/-30$ there are better alternatives around in s30v or s35vn with better edge holding and stain resistance. That's my point.
 
daberti said:
Clearly it is. But at 1040°c we would see a lottta less stain resistance with 9% or alike Cr in solid solution. At this point for the same price +/-30$ there are better alternatives around in s30v or s35vn with better edge holding and stain resistance. That's my point.
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Yes I know, but they are using XHP so we have to go with what they are using. :)

S30V or S35VN would perform better at 62 due to alloy content, the problem is we don't see S30V or S35VN in that range in production knives, more in the normal 59-61 range or 59.5-60 actual.

Then we have the Military in XHP that was tested, is 60.5 actual and .025" behind the edge.

And another Military in S30V that was tested, is 60 Actual and .025" behind the edge.

Both are on the list.

Now take the Ultimate Hunter in XHP that's 63-64 and .020" behind the edge.............

We have to go with what the results say they are in the end.
 
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Ankerson said:
Yes I know, but they are using XHP so we have to go with what they are using. :)

S30V or S35VN would perform better at 62 due to alloy content, the problem is we don't see S30V or S35VN in that range in production knives, more in the normal 59-61 range or 59.5-60 actual.

Then we have the Military in XHP that was tested, is 60.5 actual and .025" behind the edge.

And another Military in S30V that was tested, is 60 Actual and .025" behind the edge.

Both are on the list.

Now take the Ultimate Hunter in XHP that's 63-64 and .020" behind the edge.............

We have to go with what the results say they are in the end.
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From the top: I cannot add more than said but I would not use in my usual heavily humid/salted environments if not in the 63.5-64 (64 being mentioned as the upper limit by manufacturer). Edge holding it is quite good, though.

S30V and S35VN indeed are quite good at 61HRC already. At 62 and above start screaming.

There is only one production maker that routinely goes 61-62 with S30V and now S35VN and with HB 02 PVD S30V on my way I'll be having 4 folders of his soon to be 6 folders line. One of these I own being S125V.

I and he have had an intense email exchange last week which ended with a bottle of a certain aged Amarone sent to him and his family also because his knives are top notch heat treated and saved me money (huge money) that could have been wasted in seconds (always knife-wise).
It happens that he disclosed to me the heat treat specs, that I'm held responsible of not disclosing in turn, but he uses aust. in excess of 1100°C and deep cryo.

Said that and said I purchased his knives three in a cutlery store in Bergamo and one at an online German reseller (no names to avoid hidden advertising) and I did it at full price, everybody here is perfectly able to detect the brand.
 
daberti said:
From the top: I cannot add more than said but I would not use in my usual heavily humid/salted environments if not in the 63.5-64 (64 being mentioned as the upper limit by manufacturer). Edge holding it is quite good, though.

S30V and S35VN indeed are quite good at 61HRC already. At 62 and above start screaming.

There is only one production maker that routinely goes 61-62 with S30V and now S35VN and with HB 02 PVD S30V on my way I'll be having 4 folders of his soon to be 6 folders line. One of these I own being S125V.

I and he have had an intense email exchange last week which ended with a bottle of a certain aged Amarone sent to him and his family also because his knives are top notch heat treated and saved me money (huge money) that could have been wasted in seconds (always knife-wise).
It happens that he disclosed to me the heat treat specs, that I'm held responsible of not disclosing in turn, but he uses aust. in excess of 1100°C and deep cryo.

Said that and said I purchased his knives three in a cutlery store in Bergamo and one at an online German reseller (no names to avoid hidden advertising) and I did it at full price, everybody here is perfectly able to detect the brand.
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I talked to them at Blade. :)

Nice guys. :thumbup:

The knives seem to be high quality from what I held in my hand and played with for the 20 mins I was there talking with them.
 
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