Re grind a spey to a pen?

[SVTFreak]

After carrying this fightin rooster awhile, i think I've decided it is a wonderful stockman for me. The only issue I have is I wish it was a pen blade instead of a spey. So I've been thinking about turning it into the other myself. Has anyone ever done this? How would I do it? I would grind the back off on my bench grinder to remove the spey "humpback" but then how to go about taking a touch of the belly out of the edge? Do I grind be edge straight on then give it a new edge on the Lansky? I would probably form a rough edge using the grinder then clean it up on the stones.

I know to go slow and lots of cooling to save the heat treatment.

What say you guys?

 

[Woodrow F Call]

NO!!!! The spey is such an underappreciated blade. Get that fella SHARP!!!! and it's a great little blade.

 

[WhittlinAway]

I've done that very thing with my Schrade 34OT (and also modified the sheepsfoot as well):

It's very doable. I used files for all of the shaping and then used a coarse stone to establish the new bevel.

I'd never used files before, but was able to get all of the pointers I needed in this thread. I would recommend practicing on a knife you don't care a lot about first, both to get some practice and also to gain confidence.

 

[Markesharp]

If you do it, only remove material from the spine. You will lose some taper at the point but you can grind a swage on the spine to thin it out.

 

[SVTFreak]

NO!!!! The spey is such an underappreciated blade. Get that fella SHARP!!!! and it's a great little blade.

Haha. I knew someone would not like that idea. I know what you mean, man, but I prefer a pen so much more for my uses. Now if I was skinning rabbits and squirrels, I would be caught without a spey!

I've done that very thing with my Schrade 34OT (and also modified the sheepsfoot as well):

It's very doable. I used files for all of the shaping and then used a coarse stone to establish the new bevel.

I'd never used files before, but was able to get all of the pointers I needed in this thread. I would recommend practicing on a knife you don't care a lot about first, both to get some practice and also to gain confidence.

Thanks. The shape of yours is exactly what I want. How did you reduce the belly? I'll check that thread out.

If you do it, only remove material from the spine. You will lose some taper at the point but you can grind a swage on the spine to thin it out.

Why not the edge? Part of what I want is to reduce slightly the belly for a longer taper to the point.

 

[SVTFreak]

This would be the about shape I'm looking for.

 

[Markesharp]

Haha. Why not the edge? Part of what I want is to reduce slightly the belly for a longer taper to the point.

If you grind the spine only to a spear point, you will have effectively removed the belly and kept the flat grind intact and thin. Just my humble opinion.

 

[SVTFreak]

If you grind the spine only to a spear point, you will have effectively removed the belly and kept the flat grind intact and thin. Just my humble opinion.

Maybe I'll try that first. I suspect it'll still be a bit more curve at the end than I like.

 

[WhittlinAway]

The shape of yours is exactly what I want. How did you reduce the belly?

I did that with files as well. I drew the shape I was aiming for with a Sharpie, similar to what you did. I then slowly worked up to the line.

I found it helpful to frequently pause and look at the blade from the side that did not have any markings. That way the ink doesn't trick your eye into seeing a shape that isn't really there.

 

[afishhunter]

I would not do it, but that is just me. It's your knife, modify it if you want to, or get a stockman with the pen instead of a spey. I think both Case and Rough Rider make a stockman with a pen blade in place of the spey.
Another option is add a canoe or 2 blade Barlow to your pocket along with the stockman. There is no rule that says you cannot carry more than one knife.

 

[VashHash]

I use a dremel or bench grinder and very steady hands. For the bench grinder i keep a cup of water around. I rough out the shape with the dremel /grinder and then finish with 100grit Emory cloth and then 240 to satin finish it. If you're really good at establishing an edge you can grind from the side too but it'll be thicker behind the edge after. I also work around the nail nick instead of grinding it off so far. I'm sure with a cut off wheel on a dremel you can make another. Forgot to mention with the dremel i use the mini drums sander.

 

[btb01]

This would be the about shape I'm looking for.

I've never altered a blade like that, so I'm no expert, but I would definitely be worried about grinding away on the edge side of the blade. I would think it could mess with the flat grind on the blade and make it difficult to put a good, even edge on it again.

Here's the same image that I played with a little to give you an idea of how you could take material just off the spine and achieve a semi-pen-spearpoint (Zulu spear?) shape that would be pointier than the spay but avoid having to take anything off of the existing edge side of the blade. The green, of course, shows the material you would remove from the existing blade shape, and I colored in gray over the pink marks you had made to make it a little less visually confusing.

Not quite as pointy as what you proposed, but I would think it would be a lot easier than having to completely recreate an edge after grinding the existing one away.

 

[Wowbagger]

Do it !
Definitely.

On my Trappers I have removed the spays entirely. Never had a use for them.
A few days ago I heard they make good peanut butter / sandwich spread spreaders.
For my birthday I am getting another trapper, (can't have too many trappers) and I think I will keep the peanut butter blade on it . . . at least for a while.

 

[Ernie1980]

I say go for it! I have done minor mods like that a number of times on my knives (sorry, I don't have pictures right now) and the key is just going slow and checking your progress frequently I did a couple with files but that was SLOW....
I have since started to use my belt grinder to make short work of minor blade grinding projects, if you like to tinker they are worthwhile investments.

 

[dannyp]

I did it to a 301. Just removed material from the spine. I also made the sheepfoot a bit pointier while I was at it.


Here's the other side that shows how close I got to the nail nick on the spey blade and how the sheepfoot sits in relation to the clip blade in the closed position.


It's not too hard to do. You just have to have a bit of patience and be careful not to overheat the tip.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

I reshaped my Buck 301's spey to more of a pen/spear profile. I used a 120-grit 3" x 21" zirconia-alumina sanding belt cut and glued flat to a 24" board. Drag the spine in a tip-trailing stroke along the length of the belt, starting relatively low-angle and gently raising the handle through the stroke to facilitate the curvature toward the tip; don't raise it too much. I used a wine cork stuck sideways onto the sharpened edge of the blade as a place to rest my index finger and exert pressure downward into the abrasive; that makes a pretty big difference in grinding speed, done with a little pressure. The 4th pic below shows some additional thinning, convexing & polishing of the edge, at some later time.

As mentioned earlier, I'd also NOT do much, if any, grinding on the edge-side of the blade. It removes thinner steel near the edge, which is of a waste of the best cutting geometry. Taking steel away from that side will only leave the (usually) thicker steel closer to the spine, assuming a taper from edge-to-spine, as most blades are ground. OR, at the least, don't take that steel right away. Sharpen it and use it for a while, then gradually move the edge back over time, during future sharpenings, IF you still think you absolutely must do that.


David

 

[SVTFreak]

Lots of good information! Thanks everyone.

If I do remove some of the edge, I will thin it back down using the lansky before putting the final edge on to retain some thinness. It might has a thick edge when viewed but it would function I think.

Thanks everyone! I'll post results later this week maybe if I decide to go ahead and try it.

 

[traumkommode]

I've done a handful of these myself, and I agree about only grinding the spine. If you grind up the tip, you'll change the way the tip presents in the handle and may also have to grind down your kick. Not that that's a reason not to do it, and you may want to anyway. There are considerations if you want to drop the sheepsfoot to sit lower, and eo notches are an option, but now we're talkingredients about 4-5x the work.

It will also make for easier sharpening if you only grind the spine and not the edge, because then you have to set and blend a new bevel, and you're also introducing heat to the cutting edge, which, if you dip the blade in water between sander swipes, isn't a problem, and any overheated surface metal will sharpen off easily, but still.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

I've done a handful of these myself, and I agree about only grinding the spine. If you grind up the tip, you'll change the way the tip presents in the handle and may also have to grind down your kick. Not that that's a reason not to do it, and you may want to anyway. But, it will also make for easier sharpening.

:thumbup:
That's another good point. The danger in taking too much from the edge side, especially if it also removes metal at the tip, is that the tip may no longer be fully concealed in the handle when the blade is closed. Hence the subsequent need to file down the kick to lower the tip which, in itself, can present new problems in it's own right (cutting edge too close to backspring, backspring 'dropping' below flush with liners, etc), and may still not be enough to hide the tip anyway.


David

 

[black mamba]

Go for it! I have done the exact mods you are talking about several times with excellent results, using a 1x30 belt sander with first 80 grit, followed by 220 for the final shaping and smoothing. I took this big spey main down to a drop point, by both lowering the spine and removing some belly. The only downside is that the raised belly gets into thicker blade material, so the edge bevel will be wider to achieve a consistent angle. If this bothers you more than the shape of the belly, then don't do it.

Here is an #85 that I also smoothed out the belly on, removing the "tanto-like" abrupt curve. It's very visible how the edge bevel widens on this one, but it cuts great, and is just as thin at the edge.