Rick Hinderer sent Cease and Desist to Youtuber for saying the steel was soft in his knife?

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The updated tk video reeks. It's disgusting that people will spend their money in the name of "the knife community" . Who the hell is this guy to speak for the knife community? Then to morally justify unethical behavior he's going to maybe donate to kniferights?
 
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I haven’t had a chance to read through all of the replies here, but there seems to be a small contingent of knife knoobs on the internet that complain about Hinderers heat treat based solely on their poor understanding of the steal. A guy on Reddit made a post crying how Hinderer wouldn’t listen to his ignorant advice on FB and how it somehow showed how he is out of touch and incapable of taking criticism. I pointed out that they would certainly look at it if there was something wrong with the knife, but no well established maker should be expected to change their practices based on someone’s obviously poor understanding, especially considering 58 is what crucible tests it’s properties at, and I got called a fanboy and cultist.

These days anyone with a computer can put their voice out there and get followers. So of course some guy who probably has never used a knife to cut much more than packing tape says whatever they’re thinking and all their mindless followers will join the pitchfork brigade.
 
People with too much free time and confusion that they are somehow interesting.
 
If you wanna boycott RHKs for the interaction he had with this fella, that’s your business, but I definitely wouldn’t be doing it by giving some kid on instagram my money for potential legal fees. It sounded awfully weird in my head when he started talking about providing receipts and mentioned hoping to spend it wisely twice.
 
Two things:

Anyone complaining about the “little guy” vs. “big guy” thing and suggestion RHK is just going to potentially use a lawsuit to intimidate and financially harm TK: TK lives in California. Hinderer would have to sue him in CA. California has provisions in place to stop strategic lawsuits against public participation (SLAPP). Any good attorney will likely raise this issue. At that point RHK will be required to show that they have a probability of winning the case. If they fail to prove it, then they’d pay fines and damages. So, Robin Hood already exists in this case; you’re not needed.

Next, I find it odd that RHK (especially Rick himself) has built a reputation for being a jerk to people in the FB group in a completely unwarranted way, but this is the one to which the crowd is hitching their wagon.
 
Looks like Neevesknives and Rockscale are in support of this TK guy judging by the Instagram remarks.

Where is the guy that shoots holes in knives/parts made by makers he doesn’t like? I have a couple Rockscale scales that need some bullet holes in them.
 
Murdamook said:
Two things:

Anyone complaining about the “little guy” vs. “big guy” thing and suggestion RHK is just going to potentially use a lawsuit to intimidate and financially harm TK: TK lives in California. Hinderer would have to sue him in CA. California has provisions in place to stop strategic lawsuits against public participation (SLAPP). Any good attorney will likely raise this issue. At that point RHK will be required to show that they have a probability of winning the case. If they fail to prove it, then they’d pay fines and damages. So, Robin Hood already exists in this case; you’re not needed.
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Imagine that, a lawsuit against someone that is trying to intimidate and financially harm RHK being called an act of “intimidation and financial harm” against TK.
Murdamook said:
Next, I find it odd that RHK (especially Rick himself) has built a reputation for being a jerk to people in the FB group in a completely unwarranted way, but this is the one to which the crowd is hitching their wagon.
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You find it odd that people that have known and used RHK knives for years and possibly have used them and entrusted them to save lives would take issue with a low-tier Instagram drama Queen bashing his steel hardness? Uh, okay?
 
EngrSorenson said:
It gets particularly tricky if someone's taking data and offering his opinion, because the two can become conflated.
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That's really what it comes down to. Saying you don't like something is fine. But as a competitor and industry "expert" who gets paid for their "expertise", using pseudo science to claim fraud when what you really mean is you don't like they way a business does something, is a totally different animal. Throw in social media BS and RHK has every right to protect their business.

This isn't just some guy's opinion. He's a business and he's making money of presenting false facts that directly hurts another business.
 
I think this Kim guy is really the antagonist here. He trolled RHK and his customer base with the hardness testing and when that cease & desist arrived he said to himself “jackpot”. He is preparing for a lawsuit that hasn’t even come yet and is attempting to rally support on his page, with tones of “I’m the little guy who discovered something big and they’re attempting to silence me”. I’m not sure strategically speaking which move would’ve been best, because these things have an unpredictable viral nature. Maybe it would’ve dropped off the radar.. maybe every time someone mentions “Hinderer”, a guy somewhere in the chat says “but TK found out they’re scamming people on hardness”.

I do think this Kim guy sees self-validation and profitability in the “struggle”, and he will absolutely be monetizing it. I hope RHK brings the pain.. this guy saying his knives are “overpriced” because of faulty heat treating is an act of war.
 
3D Anvil said:
Agree, but if that was the case all RH would have had to say, if he was going to say anything at all ... is just that. "We intentionally run our knives in this range because we feel it offers the best balance between toughness and edge retention."

TK's response would be that, if you value toughness, M390 isn't the best steel choice. Which is probably why Hinderer is using S35vn for his X knives, and why CRK uses S35vn and S45vn.
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Hinderer uses S45vn for his Project X knives, and a wide range of steels for his XMs these days, just FYI.
 
Bob Denman said:
58.6 versus 59...
Wow!
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Yup, all this for basically nothing. Dude should have just kept to his opinion of hinder's business practice of producing admittedly lower HRC level blades. That would be just fine and not actionable, IMO. Rather, he's making money off being an "expert" and "testing" products using supposed industry standards. That is no longer opinion and if done wrong is actionable.
 
3D Anvil said:
Agree, but if that was the case all RH would have had to say, if he was going to say anything at all ... is just that. "We intentionally run our knives in this range because we feel it offers the best balance between toughness and edge retention."

TK's response would be that, if you value toughness, M390 isn't the best steel choice. Which is probably why Hinderer is using S35vn for his X knives, and why CRK uses S35vn and S45vn.
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But that wasn’t “TK’s response”. He said the knives were overpriced. He fired shots at Hinderer. Don’t act like TK is some innocent objective neutral party. He absolutely threw down, and there are consequences for it.
 
3D Anvil said:
My point being, they challenged his testing equipment and his operation of it, but the same equipment measured 11 of 12 Hinderer blades as being in spec. If there was a problem with the equipment, don't you think that would have affected *all* of the readings?
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Well, it all depend of the margin of hypothetical error that equipment shows.
If Hinderer numbers are overall higher than Kim’s, and Hinderer’s equipment is tested and calibrated on regular basis, than Kim numbers are result of bad equipment.
We don’t know how much is supposedly off Kim’s equipment but if it’s not huge number, the difference between Kim’s and Hinderer’s numbers is indicative of Kim’s faulty equipment and it is possible the other tested blades to be still within the specs, so why bother contesting those ?
 
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