Schatt Morgan, Queen and GEC

HEMI 49 said:
Wow!!..... That's a beauty; twin to mine..... They certainly knew how to do some spectacularly gorgeous jigging......
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I'm looking at purchasing my first S&M, it is hard to tell from photos how good they actually look, yours is spectacular, what year is yours, it may help me as a guide.:cool::thumbsup:
 
cudgee said:
I'm looking at purchasing my first S&M, it is hard to tell from photos how good they actually look, yours is spectacular, what year is yours, it may help me as a guide.:cool::thumbsup:
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It is a 2005....... My understanding is Bill Howard was still with Queen at that point.....
 
The last few posts got me thinking about some of the Queen made Railsplitter patterns that I used to have and the ones that I still have.

I don't wish to place any disrespect on anybody that worked at Queen but my experience with these particular knives has been rather ironic and contrary to popular opinion.

The three Railsplitters in this picture are all from a 2005 run. The top two knives each had blade play on two of their blades although I don't remember which blades they were. The bottom knife is rock solid all around.
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These two knives both have the DFC stamp and they are both virtually flawless as far as I can tell.shrug.gif I'll go as far as to say that they are the two best Railsplitters that I've ever owned.
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It just goes to show that knives can come out of a factory both good and not so good regardless of who oversaw production at the time.
 
Queen (under Servotronics) was struggling in the late 2000's, and were near to filing bankruptcy. The Daniels came in, in 2012, and tried to save a sinking ship, and managed to keep it afloat for 6 more years. I don't think you can blame all the issues that had been going on at Queen for 20 years onto DFC, especially when an internal audit showed that the President was stealing huge amounts of money.
 
When I first got back into traditional knives, I ordered three examples of Queen knives (a Queen/Pardue collab gunboat in stag and D2, a Queen/Burke collab Granddad barlow, and a S&M file and wire Grandad barlow in ats34)

I initially really regretted the Queen/S&M purchases as the fit showed a lot of gaps in all three, and a bit of a bend in the S&M.

I tigntened all the bolsters in a vice and closed up the gaps pretty well. I FULLY reground the blades on the D2 models. Thinned the primary grinds right up. That took some doing!! With my 1x30

Once this was accomplished, they became some of my favorite EDC's. The S&M blade grinds were thin enough they did not need any fixing. The D2 was great for edge retention.

Unfortunately the back spring on the coping blade on the Pardue gunboat snapped.

I am contemplating pulling the knife apart and either deleting the coping blade or making a new back spring. I have some thin 15n20 sheets that may work.

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ive had one where the shield fell off coming outta the box, ive had one where ive had to modify the kick cause the blade was sticking out. But at the same time, 85% of the Schatt &Morgans that have passed by my hands were ok, the heritage ones were by far the most amusing because some of those had some ridiculous pulls, like a 9 or 10 but thats subjective.
 
Rookie82 said:
Queen (under Servotronics) was struggling in the late 2000's, and were near to filing bankruptcy. The Daniels came in, in 2012, and tried to save a sinking ship, and managed to keep it afloat for 6 more years. I don't think you can blame all the issues that had been going on at Queen for 20 years onto DFC, especially when an internal audit showed that the President was stealing huge amounts of money.
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I agree with everything you said. Not that I doubt the story; but I always like to get as close to the source as possible for information. Do you have a link, etc. to anyone other than a Daniel's saying that Jennie (or anyone) embezzled? I know it was said by management at the time; but I don't see that they went after her.
 
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knifeswapper said:
Not that I doubt it; but I always like to get as close to the source as possible for information. Do you have a link, etc. to anyone other than a Daniel's saying that Jennie (or anyone) embezzled? I know it was said by management at the time; but I don't see that they went after her.
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There might have been too many skeletons in the closet to open that door.
 
knifeswapper said:
I agree with everything you said. Not that I doubt the story; but I always like to get as close to the source as possible for information. Do you have a link, etc. to anyone other than a Daniel's saying that Jennie (or anyone) embezzled? I know it was said by management at the time; but I don't see that they went after her.
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No, don't have any direct 1st hand knowledge, and didn't mean to imply that there was legal action taken. But I live only 30 miles from Titusville, and word spreads around. Towards the end the Daniels left her in charge, and it turned out to be a factor of the deck stacked against them trying to make the factory work the way it should. That's how I see it.

As others have said, don't automatically figure every knife made after 2006 by Queen is junk. There are some incredible knives of top tier quality that came out during that era.
 
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knifeswapper said:
I agree with everything you said. Not that I doubt the story; but I always like to get as close to the source as possible for information. Do you have a link, etc. to anyone other than a Daniel's saying that [redacted] (or anyone) embezzled? I know it was said by management at the time; but I don't see that they went after [redacted].
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Maybe you should not mention anyone's name on the internet, particularly if you believe them innocent. You could edit it out.
 
Rookie82 said:
No, don't have any direct 1st hand knowledge, and didn't mean to imply that there was legal action taken. But I live only 30 miles from Titusville, and word spreads around. Towards the end the Daniels left her in charge, and it turned out to be a factor of the deck stacked against them trying to make the factory work the way it should. That's how I see it.

As others have said, don't automatically figure every knife made after 2006 by Queen is junk. There are some incredible knives of top tier quality that came out during that era.
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My point is simply that I would think there would be some proof that financial malfeasance occurred if it is going to be used as reasoning for the insolvency of a company. Maybe it is out there, other than accusations, and I haven't seen it. I was just wondering if there is some information in public records or such of wrongdoing - and if not; why not. I have seen issues that have no named source in small articles here and there. The only official quote that I have seen from anyone was Ken saying there was a "cash flow" problem. Although the image attached is a small article that insinuates balance sheet tampering and employee theft. There were a lot of rumors of various financial elements of that tragedy. And everyone involved that I had any dealings with - were stand up folks. And I had many dealings with most actors. It is just a bit un-nerving to me when rumors get floated that place blame without response. At this point I don't really know what it matters - but the little bit of thought I can still muster just wonders what really happened.

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I bought a S&M Barlow in 2014 and it is a pretty good one . In 2017 I went to the Knife Show in the Cow Barn near Titusville with the intention of buying a S&M Barlow in Stag . They had them and the price was okay , but I could not find a good one in the 5 or 6 to choose from . I am not just talking not good , I talking Hole in a Bolster bad among other big issues .

Harry
 
If I could handle a DFC marked Queen knife and check it out in person first I wouldn't have an issue with buying one (Assuming it was a nice knife when I checked it out) but most of the ones I have bought have been online and the DFC Queen knives have been disappointing.

I think Knifeswapper mentioned pallet loads of seconds sold cheap. I suspect those ended up on ebay.
 
knifeswapper said:
Finding out who the President was at the time is not complicated. This article is an interesting read if interested in a historical overview while the company was still in business.
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Thanks for the link to the article, for me who lives overseas, very informative and interesting.:thumbsup:
 
Railsplitter said:
The last few posts got me thinking about some of the Queen made Railsplitter patterns that I used to have and the ones that I still have.

I don't wish to place any disrespect on anybody that worked at Queen but my experience with these particular knives has been rather ironic and contrary to popular opinion.

The three Railsplitters in this picture are all from a 2005 run. The top two knives each had blade play on two of their blades although I don't remember which blades they were. The bottom knife is rock solid all around.
View attachment 1431569

These two knives both have the DFC stamp and they are both virtually flawless as far as I can tell.View attachment 1431583 I'll go as far as to say that they are the two best Railsplitters that I've ever owned.
View attachment 1431571
View attachment 1431574
It just goes to show that knives can come out of a factory both good and not so good regardless of who oversaw production at the time.
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Those are some beauties Rick! What's pretty funny is that I just received an antique green like you show. However, instead of mine being rock solid...it rattles. Both secondary blades are so loose in the closed position that they rattle when I barely shake the knife. In open position, they both have pretty bad blade play in both directions. This is the very first knife I have ever had to return, and it kills me to have to do it.
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