Schrade Cut.Co.Calendar Knife is 14 K gold.

Upstream, a good suggestion, but not yet, methinks. An outside selection of experts (nationally recognized) is being consulted to give their individual opinions on the knife and purse. Mr. Long was kind enough to consent to review the closeup picture of the purse and render his, I consider expert, opinion on the material used in the purse. Eventually, yes, Mr. Levine might be retained to render his own professional opinion of the knife and purse. But that will be the owner's decision if and when to retain, and if and when to make the result public.

Michael

On Edit: Here is a picture for Randy and his hero, Maleus:
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Sorry this took so long.
Here are Larry's pictures.
I'll merge them into the main page but thought the subject matted warranted them separate for now.
Remember to click on the smaller pictures to see the larger view.

Larry's Calendar
 
On Edit: Here is a picture for Randy and his hero, Maleus:
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Thank you Michael for the pic, nice 14k bail!!
W5rwu
 
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Thanks Larry and Larry for hosting and sharing the photos. Nice bunch of shots.

I have to say, I've had a great deal of laughs as I've participated in the scrutiny of this soon to be legendary Calendar Knife. Especially since I was the one that drove the final auction price up to $300.00 for posting and insinuating that it might be a fake, without providing any real details when it was live. (admittedly it was wrong to do on this forum, and used improper judgment).

I would think there might be enough photos from different angles for tactical counsel and the selected panel of nationally known experts to maybe be named later make a valid determination of authenticity. Albeit a verdict the current owner may or may not wish share with the rest of the viewing public, some of which some may not be able to understand, if the explanation has a Down Under twist and needs translation for the culturally challenged members that participate here.

I do hope Larry, that you would send some shots for Levine to review here in BladeForums, but respect your position should you choose not to do that, given some of the nastiness that has followed in the wake here.

"Who is Malleus"? I have no idea. Anyone else know who it is?

"Who would have used the Calendar Knife?" Given it's age, I don't have a feel for it's functionality in the 30's. In all likelyhood, maybe expensive gift to given to to someone to use at a business desk.

As the tension mounts, and the drama marches towards the final verdict, I hope the entertainment value does not wane.

I do hope members in this forum get the whole and accurate story, deservedly or not. Hopefully the undeserved will not spoil it for the ones that do. :)

thawk
 
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Larry,

It is one magnificent and unique knife. Don't know that much about Schrades but it appear to be one rare find. I'm happy for you finding such a gem.

Nice pictures as well. May I ask, what is the reference book shown in your pictures. I've been looking for books on Schrade-Walden knives.

Again, thanks for sharing that magnificent knife.

Jackie
 
Jackie, The book is Jim Sargents No. 2 Edition which has an extensive Cut.Co.,Walden,etc Schrade section. Note they are not in subsequent publications 3 & 4 as I have those editions as well...so get yourself No.2 ..you will also see a photo of a young and dapper Herman Williams whose knives were featured including the Calendar. Herman had mentioned in this forum he bought the Calendar along with my rare 3OT from the same North Carolina gentleman at the same time and both are the knives actually featured in that edition. My 3OT is sitting with this gold calendar at the moment and they appear to get on just fine with talking and walking but no snapping!
Thawk you have mentioned a number of times what an ugly knife it is and I respect your opinion however I find it rather majestic and because it is gold it is quite weighty and you know its in your hands for sure. If this is not genuine my wife can do her nails with it as I do not believe anyone is going to dispute anthenticity of the blades and gold will always be gold. If you compare to the Sargents edition knife I reckon its as near as 'bloody' is to swearing mate.It "works" like a Rolls Royce which also adds to its appeal to me anyway.
Its been suggested that gold coins were illegal at that time so the well heeled used to have gold implements made like Dunhill gold lighters and yes pocket knives. etc..
Roland, you have stated you are confused by the controversary...simple mate the oracle declared it a fake without being in possession of enough photos and data to make the early call and his desciples have been falling over themselves to defend his decision.Declaring the sheath to be 'plastic' and Paul has now confirmed aged Alligator was to me quite absurd.
The panel of experts have been in possession of a substantial number of technical photos now for some 4 days and the fact I have not had a resounding and immediate gong indicates to me this decision is going to the line....This forum is the winner with all the recent viewings IMHO. Hoo Roo

P.S. Thanks Larry Vickery.
PPS.I am now contacting the seller again who is not a knife person to find out whose Beverley Hills Estate sale it was that he obtained this years ago.Was it M.D. Stone?...could he have been Alberts Doctor i.e. MD. Stone....The other rare Swedish knife the seller bought at the same time from this sale had the same monogram so likely original same owner. The seller mislisted this knife <not under Schrade and because he is not a knife person spelt it Shrade...these were the single greatest pointers to me I was dealing with someone who was not misrepresenting as it would surely have been pumped up if it was a "constructed Schrade Cut.Co." and put under Schrade listing on the Bay>The photos were not brilliant so it was difficult..nay impossible for anyone to authenticate or otherwise accurately. I now seek any provenance on this knife which is basically all I have requested since I received it.
 
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i have never seen MD before a physician's name, but i've never been to Aussieland, so maybe they do there. but in N.A. at least, it always goes like this (using my name as example): R.A.Procter M.D.
 
Yes I know Roland I'm just on a fishing expedition ..someone is going to come up with some better ideas. Did Albert himself have one in Gold??? Hoo Roo
 
G'Day, I bring this post up again as it contains the link to my Schrade Cut. Co Calculating Perpetual Calendar Knife on Larry Vickery's site.
Over the past week I have submitted a number of fresh, greatly enlarged, technical aspect photos of the knife to Mr Bernard Levine and sought authentication.
Mr. Levine has confirmed this Calendar knife has not been rebladed and also that the handle is not a Latama handle.
My Jeweller has re- confirmed that in addition to the bail marked 14K the scales of this knife are also 14K. He has not carried out precise gold content weight however has now been given that brief and I will advise further now that I know I have a Schrade Cut. Co. bladed knife that has never been rebladed or has any connection with an Italian Latama Calendar knife.
I have just purchased an original Latama Calendar and will be posting how unlike they are on Larry's site upon receipt.
Paul Long 'Sheathmaker' on this forum has confirmed that following his experience of some 50 years handling/working with Alligator hide the pouch that accompanied this knife is in his opinion aged Alligator and not plastic.
I can confirm that both pouch and knife carry the same monogram initials and the Jeweller has confirmed the pouch is monogramed in the old fashioned way in gold leaf.
I can also confirm by visual inspection the knife has been in this pouch for a considerable time as the indent in the pouch matches precisely the shape/dimensions of this knife.
I have seen no literature that indicates that the knife was only made in 1937 with the handle markings and of the materials as photographed in Sargents No2 edition which was originally owned by Herman Williams.
A number of friends are now pursueing further provinance of this style and indeed this gold knife and I will report in due course.
I would particularly like to thank Michael <Codger> for his unwavering support of me and more particularly the genuineness of this knife both before Ebay auction end and at all times since. Thanks to Paul Long, Larry Vickery and other BF Schrade Forum members who have shown their support and you know who you are.
I would also like to thank those that withheld from bidding so that I may obtain this knife, which I believe may possibly be as scarce as my original 3OT of which only the one has ever been photographed or displayed being my example ,<in my temporary custody at least just like all my Schrades>.
Hoo Roo
 
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Wouldnt we all love to meet up with old UH and Albert with a list of questions.. I wish Dave and Wally would come out to play.

I doubt we will ever know it all but we sure love kicking up the dust and looking in the attic's
 
For 100 years Schrade Cutlery Company and it's Progeny produced a bewildering array of knives. It really should come as no surprise that another variant has come to light. I am still waiting for one special knife to make itself known. I have never seen one, and I doubt that many people still living have. It was a unique concealed carry knife produced on a limited basis for the OSS of WWII by Baer's Ulster. Here is his brief mention from his unpublished memoirs:

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As you can see, there are many wonderful, unique knives which are yet to be discovered by modern collectors. Hopefully when they are eventually found and presented, they won't be sumarily dismissed without a proper close examination simply because they are not exactly like a prior example which appeared in a book, or in someone's collection. Opinions are great. We all like to give and hear them. But at the end of the day, beyond opinion and supposition, it is facts that matter.

Michael
 
Very cool Larry, nice piece of detective work, congrats!

Here's a shot of a Schrade lock picking knife that was posted by a collector on AAPK. Apparently they're inherently rare since they were "supposed" to be turned in after use. I'd hate to think what happened to the folks who were caught trying to smuggle them out:eek::eek:

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LRV - I agree, I've tried to get Wally to talk, but he's bound by the agreement with Taylor to keep mum. Maybe some day.....:)

Eric

PS, I don't think I'd want a "used" rectum knife!!:barf::D:D
 
I understand that the rectum knives were issued with a spray can of Lysol and the real collector's item is an original can with full contents.

Paul



Edited to add: Disclaimer: the preceeding statement, while essentially accurate in its content may not have any connection whatsoever with the truth.
 
Too late Paul. I've ordered the granite stone to be carved with the quote and signed with a genuine facimile of your "Uncle Paul" signature! :D

I don't understand the resistance to owning an anal knife. Unless they were switchblades. Being made for the OSS, wouldn't they naturally be sterile?:)

Michael the troublemaker
 
I'll bet if you take a tampon, slip the cover off and replace the gauze with a suitable pen blade, Schrade of course, and slip the cover back on, you'd have a reasonable facsimile of a rectum knife :thumbup::D. ( you could even leave the string on so you don't strain the old sphincter!)

Ok, I'm going to bed now, obviously it's far too late for me to be posting anything:yawn::confused:

G'nite Y'all!
 
....I find it all most topical I was told to do the same thing with my Calendar knife...I guess it is a date knife.....
 
Larry,

Congratulation for the authentication. I believed it was the real deal from the beginning.

I'm happy for you. Now, the critics can quiet down and take a seat.

Jackie
 
I attach photos of the tang stamp and blades of the Calculating Perpetual Calendar Knife CPC and raise some further questions in the next post.
 

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I refer to above photos.
It has now been established by Mr. Levine that this knife has never been rebladed and it bears no connection whatsoever to an Italian Latama.This was established by submitting enlarged photos of blade seating,both ends,'front on' photos and edge photos and Cut away photos.Khife open and knife closed photos.
The Cut.Co. blades are original to the Calendar case and the Calendar case is original to the Cut.Co. blades as tang stamped above.
This knife with original Cut.Co. blades must be manufactured prior to 1946 and the original sheath/pouch supports this time frame in addition.
The only literature that has been produced thus far concerning this style of knife was in Sargents #2 Edition where Herman Williams example was designated F170 and bore the etch CPC and 1937 on the front and was not 14K gold I believe. It was described by Jim Sargent as 'Very Rare' and this edition of the book was Copyrighted in 1989.Very Rare would indicate few in number were manufactured.
Mr. Levine's advice in authenticating all knives is 'to read the knife and ignore the markings.'
I believe this gold calendar knife is identical in all respects to the known examples if you ignore the handle marking.
If the F170 designated Calendar knife was indeed factory manufactured why isn't there known catalog examples..Catalog E and Supplements. Mr A.G. Russell states in his introduction to the Catalog E and Supplements that the Catalog was for 1926 and every 2 years a supplement was added...namely 1928,1930,1932,1934,1936,and1938. The "factory manufactured" was reputedly made in 1937 would it not have been promoted in at least the 1938 supplement?
Gold Coins were illegal at this time and it has already been established that Dunhill lighters etc were created in gold for the 'well heeled.'
If you wanted one produced in 14K gold would you have had your Jeweller embellish with 'common or garden variety' 1937 & CPC,particularly if being presented as a gift ,or have solid gold clean lines with only your monogram etch as displayed on my 14K Gold Calendar knife fashioned with suitable monogramed genuine Alligator pouch.My Jeweller states the person who monogramed which is quite deep would have kept the solid gold filings for sure.
Indeed were any of the known 'examples' factory finished or skeletons only produced and finished by a fashionable Jeweller in Sterling silver,gold plate or gold? Could they have been gifts to dignatories by Schrade Cut.Co. at that time. or commissioned as gifts by others....did Albert himself display a gold Calendar knife in his office?This would explain why they were not listed in catalog supplements....if they were skeletons produced as SFO's.
Mr. Voyles has reported here on this forum that he is writing a defining Schrade history would this knife not be of interest to the total Schrade story?
He has discussed other Schrade knives at length here why not
so much as an educated opinion on this knife's provenance? Both Forums have had over 2000 viewings on all posts .
Could it be that most involved at that time are no longer alive and in the absence of any written literature or records pertaining to this style of Schrade knife or indeed this actual knife only superficial suppositions are being made and having made a supposition .."my mind is made up don't confuse me with facts" takes over based more on ego rather than factual evidence which includes comprehensive photos.
My late Pappy always told me "Son never attribute to deviousness that which can be simply explained by sheer ignorance".........It's not exactly the same as mine so yours cant be genuine.......piffle it cant!They can both be built on identical and genuine skeletons!
I know all the experts play in the same sand pit but cant someone at least give an opinion on this knife based on factual evidence like the 40 odd photos of this knife now on record from all angles Versus one black and white photo in a publication from 1989 or lame comparisons to an Italian Latama handle in a supposedly plastic Gator fake sheath, both of which have now expertly been ruled out as sheer bunkum. I believe this knife is innocent until proven guilty and not the other way round. What other part of it can I photograph?Cant a Schrade be found after 60 odd years thereby adding another dimension to known Schrade history and shouldn't this be greeted by enthusiasm by genuine Schrade enthusiasts and not scepticism for fear of not being the ultimate Schrade Oracle after all...........
What do you think Codger? Hoo Roo
P.S. The knife has in no way been cleaned by me and never would be... a simple wipe with a cotton cloth has brought the gold to its lustrous best.It remains totally original and has never been sharpened and very little use if any.
 
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