Sebenza worth it?

[coiledwire]

Oh, and show me another maker that gives a lifetime warranty, blade replacement, and spa service for when this gets worn like an old, trusted shoe.

 

[Hairlesstwinkie]

Oh, and show me another maker that gives a lifetime warranty, blade replacement, and spa service for when this gets worn like an old, trusted shoe.

Strider, Benchmade, and Kai would do everything except the spa.

Nice Sebenza by the way. I like my Sebenzas, but I don't think they're worth the price tag brand new. I'm more ok with paying the closer to $300 secondary market price for an used one. They're good knives that are very well built with excellent quality that's close or at least on par to midtech and sometimes custom levels. I'm just never truly satisfied with the S35VN ran by CRK.

 

[ijha]

The main reason why I paid more than $350 for my Sebenza is the bushing system. And I am ready to pay the same amount if Spyderco or Benchmade make a knife

with a same quality bushing system. Unfortunately they don't make one. Para2 and Native 5 are advertised as if they had the bushing system. However, people in

this forum know it is not actually the bushing system. You tighten the pivot, you can't open the blade. Sebenza is not like that as you may know. You tighten the pivot

screw all the way down, you still open the blade without any effort. Isn't this amazing? Simply speaking, I would pay $100-200 more rather than hassling with sweet

spots and loc-tites.

 

[rexromic]

Well I'll try to help out by giving my worthless thoughts on the subject.
I was a Benchmade kind of guy, I liked the looks of their designs and loved the axis lock( still feel that it's one of the best locks ever ). One day I went over a friends house to bs, drink beers, and check out his knife collection. In that collection he had 13 Sebenza's, I had no idea what they were and because they didn't have that "tactical" look that I was so fond of I didn't really check them out, I spent my time looking over 50-60 other knives that he had on display. On my next visit I looked them over and was amazed by the "feel" of the Sebenza's, there was no slop or wiggle, the lock up was perfect, the sound of it locking up was impressive,the blade grinds were perfectly even, both sides of the blade the same, the edge was down the middle, and was the same height on both sides. The knives were all perfectly centered as well. As I went through the various Sebenza's I noticed that this wasn't just a single perfect knife, but that EVERY ONE of them was perfect.
I was completely amazed, I had never seen a knife so perfectly made before, let alone seen knives from a company that could do it every time. We talked about the company and my buddies love of CRK Knives over some beers and I was impressed by the quality of what they were making but was put off by the price- I had never before spent more than $185 on a knife and I thought that was a lot at the time.
The 3rd time I was over his house wheeling and dealing knives I didn't pick up a knife that wasn't a CRK, I was hooked, even though I'm not very savvy with a computer and didn't even own one at the time, that night I used my phone to buy a Small Classic with high carbon ladder Damascus. It's been downhill for my savings account ever since.
I still find a knife here and there that I enjoy that isn't a CRK but a CRK has been in my pocket for the last 7 years or so and I don't think that'll change anytime soon.
To me they're worth every penny, I hope that if you give one a chance that you'll feel the same way; the good thing is that if you don't the secondary market is quite strong and you should be able to sell it quickly to recoupe your funds.

:thumbup:

 

[jhawk66901]

I have bought several Benchmades over the last few years and a few Spydercos in addition to having other knives of other brands. My latest purchase is a Spyderco Southard. And that will be my last purchase until I buy a CRK...not sure which one yet but it will be a brand new CRK. There are several reasons why I won't hesitate to buy a Sebenza or other once I'm able to in the next couple of months. One is that I've held them before and know that they are well built and just plain beautiful to my eyes. Another reason is that while my Spydercos or Benchmades can be fixed on warranty, they will still have scratches and signs of wear, which is fine, but it can build up over the years. I know that I will have more confidence carrying and using a Sebenza everyday knowing I can send it in for a "spa" after a few years than I do my other knives. And to me it's better to have one $450 knife I'm using like I should everyday without thinking about it, than to have several $100 knifes I might worry more about scratching up. Lastly, though I am not currently a member of the CRK owners community, I do frequent this forum and appreciate the strong sense of community among CRK owners. And yes, I know other owners of other brands have a sense of community, but the overall value of these knives, and the sense of community make me look forward to joining the ranks.

 

[alwayscarryaknife]

I have bought several Benchmades over the last few years and a few Spydercos in addition to having other knives of other brands. My latest purchase is a Spyderco Southard. And that will be my last purchase until I buy a CRK...not sure which one yet but it will be a brand new CRK. There are several reasons why I won't hesitate to buy a Sebenza or other once I'm able to in the next couple of months. One is that I've held them before and know that they are well built and just plain beautiful to my eyes. Another reason is that while my Spydercos or Benchmades can be fixed on warranty, they will still have scratches and signs of wear, which is fine, but it can build up over the years. I know that I will have more confidence carrying and using a Sebenza everyday knowing I can send it in for a "spa" after a few years than I do my other knives. And to me it's better to have one $450 knife I'm using like I should everyday without thinking about it, than to have several $100 knifes I might worry more about scratching up. Lastly, though I am not currently a member of the CRK owners community, I do frequent this forum and appreciate the strong sense of community among CRK owners. And yes, I know other owners of other brands have a sense of community, but the overall value of these knives, and the sense of community make me look forward to joining the ranks.

I hope you come here and show off your CRK when you pick one up. There are some great folks around here.

 

[jhawk66901]

I hope you come here and show off your CRK when you pick one up. There are some great folks around here.

I absolutely will.

 

[Cowboy1629]

I have bought several Benchmades over the last few years and a few Spydercos in addition to having other knives of other brands. My latest purchase is a Spyderco Southard. And that will be my last purchase until I buy a CRK...not sure which one yet but it will be a brand new CRK. There are several reasons why I won't hesitate to buy a Sebenza or other once I'm able to in the next couple of months. One is that I've held them before and know that they are well built and just plain beautiful to my eyes. Another reason is that while my Spydercos or Benchmades can be fixed on warranty, they will still have scratches and signs of wear, which is fine, but it can build up over the years. I know that I will have more confidence carrying and using a Sebenza everyday knowing I can send it in for a "spa" after a few years than I do my other knives. And to me it's better to have one $450 knife I'm using like I should everyday without thinking about it, than to have several $100 knifes I might worry more about scratching up. Lastly, though I am not currently a member of the CRK owners community, I do frequent this forum and appreciate the strong sense of community among CRK owners. And yes, I know other owners of other brands have a sense of community, but the overall value of these knives, and the sense of community make me look forward to joining the ranks.

Good for you, I'm looking forward to your first purchase. I'm sure it will be a good one if you have done your research on this site. Make sure you post some pictures on here when you get it.

 

[SoCal_kid]

Yes. It is awesome. It is worth it. IF you can afford it. I spend my free time fondling mine. there are lesser knives that will scratch the itch. It is just not the same though. If you dont like it, you can sell it and recoup the majority of your money. Consider the money you lost as a rental fee. Once you get one, youll want to buy friends for it to play with. That is the hardest part for me. Not having the whole lineup at my disposal. O well, motivation to accomplish things and award myself with more steel goodness

 

[erdoc8921]

My first sebenza was a 21, with computer generated graphics. I liked it, but ended up selling it. Then I regretted doing that, even though I wasn't real excited about the standard blade. I eventually found myself remembering the high quality of the knife and the smooth action, so I bought a large 21 insingo, then a small carbon fiber insingo. I am currently waiting to get a 25. I have owned Benchmades, Bark River Knives, a couple of protechs, a couple of microtechs, several different Busse-kin knives. CRK is superior to all those brands hands down, in terms of fit and finish, function, resale value (Busse is a very close second, as is microtech), and overall quality of experience with the knife.

 

[kwazyjuice]

I have an 0560 and a Sebenza 21 and 25. Objectively, the Sebenza's are built better and that is a fact. What people dont understand when they get into the Sebenza price range and higher is you are not paying for more performance, you are paying for more work done by the maker. Closer tolerances, better fit and finish, lavish inlays, hand grinding, and attention to detail are what you are paying for. Not to mention the time it takes to manufacture. Even more true in the full custom world. You have to be someone who enjoys the artistic value and engineering quality in higher end knives to appreciate what a Sebenza has to offer. If not, you will be disappointed.

Very well said my friend

 

[marthinus]

My standard reply to this question:

Another thing to remember is that the Manufacturing Quality award that CRK has won so many times are not chosen by a panel, it is voted for by fellow knife makers. Even Bob Dozier, a very established maker in his own right has CRK pocket knives and I love his motto of : if it feels like climbing through a barbed wire fence, there is something wrong. Slim, sleek and simple knives.

[video=youtube;nI_73zvGx5Y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI_73zvGx5Y[/video]

A few weeks back, in this thread, someone asked if there was a Spyderco which could compete with the Sebenza. Sal eventually chimed in. His post was primarily a response to someone's skepticism regarding the origins of the framelock. He noted that he had, in his personal collection, a Chris Reeve knife with an earlier lock of Chris' called the "Lock 45". He further noted that it dated back to the 1970's and was the predecessor of the Reeve Integral Lock. That lead to someone asking what it looked like, at which point he suggested sending it to me to be photographed. He also noted in a later post that it was a small knife. It arrived a couple days ago and he wasn't kidding about its size. For the benefit of those who like "dimensional data" it weighs 1.375 ounces (40 grams) has a closed length of 2 13/16" (71 mm), a blade length of 2 7/32" (57mm) with a 2 1/16" (52mm) cutting edge, and is 5/16" (8mm) thick. For those who find photographic comparisons easier to visualize, the first photo below shows it with a Kiwi and my LH Mnandi.

Beyond that, it's an intriguing design. The action is glassy smooth and the lock up is rock solid despite the fact that the blade is only supported from one side. The small thumb stud and smooth handle, thin on the off side, make it difficult to open, but might be less of a problem for someone right handed and with better motor skills. No clip, that was probably not even a gleam in Sal's eye yet. I'm assuming the handle is titanium anodized to a bronze hue but that, and any other questions regarding it would best be answered by Sal, or someone intimately familiar with Chris Reeve's early knives.

Closed, lock side:

close up, to show one of the two ball bearings:

The balls do not serve as detents, just to smooth the action. Only friction holds the blade closed.

Another close up, note the angled locking surfaces on the blade...

Lock side view, half open. You can almost see the lower ball bearing:

Top view, almost fully open:

Fully open, lock side:

Finally, the design does have one peculiarity, you can fold the blade in the wrong direction, at least until the thumb stud makes contact with the frame...

Paul

My Personal Website - - - - - - A Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting - - - - - - Kiwimania
Dead horses beaten, sacred cows tipped, chimeras hunted when time permits.
Spyderco Collector # 043 - - WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!
It's easy to grin when your ship comes in and good fortune and fame are your lot, but the man worthwhile is the man who can smile with his shorts twsited up in a knot. - Morey Amsterdam

Well, I cannot speak for Chris Reeve Knives, but I will offer an opinion.

I've known Chris and Ann for many years. We worked together when Chris was in South Africa.

A CRK knife is not a custom knife, nor is it a production knife. They are in a class by themselves. They've taken many years to develop their reputation.

Each piece is custom made by skilled custom makers. CRK tolerances and standards are the highest I've seen in processes like surface grinding and heat treat. There is a limit to their production capacity.

Chris is pretty anal on quality. "Quality is time. = Time is money". He pays his craftsmen a fair wage, and he charges a fair margin, he gives the world a product like no other. Chris and Ann work hard and they make a good living. "Enormous profits" is an inside joke that Chris and I laugh about. Frankly, I think they'd feel guilty if they made too much money.

The "Market" will determine if his business strategies work, regardless of what they are. If they don't work, adjustments are made....that's how businesses survive.

BTW, the flip side of a "bargain driven" market is manufacturers are forced to import product (export jobs) from China to compete in the need for the "lower price". More complications.

sal

Hi Dulleddown,

More profit is usually associated with higher price. That's normal. Profit is usually a percentage of sales price. To think that a high priced auto should garner the same proft as a low priced auto is not in accord with business. It might be the same percentage, but being more expensive, it will be more profit.

Unless you are a manufacturer, familiar with close tolerance manufacturing of heat treated steel & Titanium parts, you are not likely to be able to see all of the differences between one of Chris' knives and others. For example; CRK keeps 0.0005 tolerance on surface grinding. That's one sixth the thickness of a hair. Do you have the knowledsge and equipment to discover that tolerance?

In the end, it's all about trust. CRK took many years to build and maintain their repuation. Built with consistent focus. Even those trying to make a "cheaper" version must "leave out processes" or "soften their tolerance", or they will cost as much.

Rarely do you pay for the "name". That's a bullshit sales pitch made up by the ignorant claiming to offer the same for less. Money valuation between countries might offer a "deal" for a while until the money value balances, but all in all, you will get what you pay for.

sal

-----------------------------------------------------

Just because you can't see the difference doesn't mean it isn't there, it just means you can't see it.

Hi GWLee,

The benefit of tight tolerances is usually for long term durability as well as smooth function. Long term durability is difficult to determine in a short term decision. That's why reputation is important.

sal

Nice video.

High dollar knives are high dollar because they cost more to make. It might be materials (Titanium, unubtanium, etc.), it might be tolerances (Chris' has lotsa zeros after the decimal before hitting numbers), it might be labor (carving, engraving, etc.).

Sometmes those differences are difficult if not impossible for even the trained eye to detenct, generally impossible for a new student.

Just because you can't see the difference, doesn't mean it isn't there, sometimes it just means you can't see it.

sal

At the same time there are many people that feel the knife is not worth it, I did until I read Sal Glesser's comments and bought one myself after 3 years of saving (the knife was later taken in a mugging) and I was UTTERLY UNDERWHELMED when I bought it, even though I handled it before hand I just felt like owning something of true quality for the first time in my life (like a good quality car/suite/watch/camera). Until I used it non stop, on the farm etc and everything just started "flowing" and making sence. I replaced the stolen knife with an Insingo. I will always have a CRK and they retail for around $625 here. They are, for me at least, worth it and my personal connection, what the Sebenza has meant in my life, makes it special for me.

I have rambled a bit, but I hope some of what I have said has helped you to form your own opinion on the matter.

 

[goldie]

I need to rant about how many is this worth it threads ive seen? how come no one asks if a shorogorov is worth 3 times the original price ? Or is a Curtiss,el patron or bodega worth it ? in my opinion,after seeing this current trend of knives going for much more than they should be( i know,supply,demand,all that crap, i dont care anymore) the sebenza & zaan is the bargain of the century,especially if found on the exchange.I have a shirogorov,bought it before it tripled. its a nice knife,but its no better than a sebenza or umnumzaan.the blade is nothing more than a triangle,no grind lines or anything. People are fooling themselves if they think they are getting better knives than the seb or zaan for twice or triple the money. What turned me off off the Begg knives is the reality show that i didnt know existed,found it last week on youtube .you dont see anyone on the reeve shop tour video riding bicycles in the shop, blowing horns & acting like a moron,melting stuff in the tools used to anodize. after seeing that,do i want to spend 1200.00 on a knife made by some clowns ?whether or not it was embellished for tv,i dont want to see it. This i hope can put better in perspective not only the quality knife you get for the money with crk,at least he's not running around his shop with underwear on his head acting like a fool....

 

[MiG Angel]

Btw, you'll get one answer in this forum, and a slightly different answer in the General forum. Ask a bankruptcy lawyer what to do, and he'll say file bankruptcy. Ask a heart doc what to do, and he'll say do a stress test. Ask Sebenza question in the CRK forum, . . . .

I feel like going to my psychologist and asking, "him why do people ask obvious questions in forums?"

 

[JNewell]

I feel like going to my psychologist and asking, "him why do people ask obvious questions in forums?"

...or, asking the IT guy: "why is it that no one ever uses the search function?"

 

[pvicenzi]

Is it worth it? No matter what knife this question is asked about, only the purchaser can answer it. Everything from a $10 Opinel to a high dollar custom can cut things. How much an individual should spend depends on the answer to many questions. What are you going to cut? Are exotic materials important? Is good service important to you? How about fine engineering and design? Tolerances? Will your kids have to go without shoes if you buy the expensive knife. Is your house paid for? Is your job on shakey ground? And perhaps the most important question of all: will the purchase result in marital problems? My job is solid, I like fancy inlays, tight tolerances, and excellant service. My house is almost paid off and my job is on solid ground, aqnd I am single. Therefor for me, the Sebenza is most definately worth the price.

 

[goldie]

^ good input, schultz !

 

[Maxx71]

Is it worth it? My first knife (ever!) is a Sebenza 21, Large Insingo and it will arrive at my doorstep tomorrow from Monkeyedge. Without ever seeing it in person, I'm sure it will be worth it. I've done the research and anywhere I go, the concensus is clear and overwhelming--Sebenzas are the standard and is legendary. I've decided not to make the same mistake I made with collecting cameras. I've always ended up with the best for the money but found myself spending so much during the learning process. So, in looking for my first EDC knife, i did my research and decided to fork up the money for a knife that thousands have eventually ended up with during their search.

 

[Nikkogi]

OP, you are the only one who can answer that question as everyone has a different value system.

In my view, CRK knives are absolutely worth it. For me, the biggest advantage to CRK knives is they can be refurbished to look like new so easily. I have a small sebenza that I carried for about a year and a half straight and it showed signs of carry. In around 3 weeks, I got back what looks like a new knife to the naked eye. Also worth noting, is you have a cutting tool that will last a lifetime. Included in the price is customer service, pride of ownership, design, workmanship, and so on. I remember hearing Jaimie Hyneman from Mythbusters say "simpler is always better". A Sebenza is simple elegance that just works for me.

 

[Davor]

I have two folders, a regular sebenza with BG42 blade and a mnandi. I carry both and had no regrets paying for them. I still handle them daily. Like most sebenza owners have said its worth it. The fixed blades are also nice, but thats for another thread.