Shenanigans

Lot of smarter folks on this forum, so I'll hold off on providing any recommendation to changing the current process/format.
However, I'd like to point out one observation in hopes of providing some perspective. My humble view is that the issues we've seen this past week (1. non-sanctioned sales by a non-gold member, 2. frustration driven denouncement of FBF upon lost opportunity, and 3. violation of shark rules [though this may be contested by some] and the subsequent discovery of the forum's editing/time stamp issue) is a result of how popular FB knives have gotten during the past year, in which the demand greatly surpassed the availability.
Though I can honestly say FB is my favorite of all knife makers, I got into knives coming from the perspective of a bushcraft student (meaning, I like to try suitable knives for bushcrafting from various knife makers). Hence, my desire to procure FB knives has never reached those of many others, and I was able to observe the phenomenon from a relatively neutral perspective. So let’s look at the history, FBF same time last year was not the same as how it's been for the past several months. Back then, one could post "I'll take xxxx" within 5-10 minutes of the original posting by Andy, and have a pretty good chance of landing the purchase. Nowadays, it's not uncommon to see a handful of posts within a minute of the original post. The "competition" has gotten that much stronger. And it’s natural for this type of environment to further fuel that desire. And when such amp’d up desires aren’t satiated, we’re going to have people getting frustrated and inadvertently offending one another. I myself have recently experienced a spike in that desire, and decided to check myself starting this week. Not telling anyone to do this, but just trying to delineate how I perceive things have gotten a bit testy.
There’s also an upside to this spike in demand though (besides the obvious boost in sales). Just about all the new members have assimilated themselves with existing members, and I believe we created a pretty cool online community (I love reading through people's collections, what they're listening to, what they're cooking, etc.). Let’s face it, we know this passion of ours isn’t normal, and it’s great to share some thoughts with like-minded individuals.
Regardless of whether the format will change or not, my sincere hope is we can continue to respect and be cordial to one another. And for anyone who had any issue with Andy & co. through this debacle, let’s give them a break. They’re hard working artisans who now have to deal with the complications of a growing business, and there’s going to be some growing pains. For us, this is our hobbies and passions, for them, this is also their livelihood.
 
This is fascinating. It brings back memories of when I use to camp out in front of stores in order to get a front place in line to buy the newest "beanie baby". Only difference was that I bought them to flip.

Andy knows that I love the product. I imagine he's very happy with the vibe and interest shown. If only he could make a few dozen more every week, on the other hand, it seems the supply versus demand is about perfect.

Anyway, glad everything is sorted out. :)
 
I have a couple simple observations from a guy who is new to this forum, but not forums in general and I'm certainly not to new to tough decisions or sorting out conflict.

1) The rules state you should not edit your post. A post was edited. Call it cheating, call it a mistake, call it what ever you want, it was a willful violation of a stated rule and the post was correctly disqualified under the rules.

THAT is not what the rules say. It clearly says "avoid" and by using the terminology willful violation leads others to believe that user's actions were with intent to deceive or manipulate - something you do not know per se. Nor does the rules say anywhere his post will be disqualified. You made all that up under your own interpretation .. which btw, is not your decision to make.

I should probably stay out of this .. but some of you users are projecting your own interpretation of Andy's rules and trying to Mob Rule this forum. Kinda NOT COOL. I say let the man handle his business and his customers.
 
THAT is not what the rules say. It clearly says "avoid" and by using the terminology willful violation leads others to believe that user's actions were with intent to deceive or manipulate - something you do not know per se. Nor does the rules say anywhere his post will be disqualified. You made all that up under your own interpretation .. which btw, is not your decision to make.

I should probably stay out of this .. but some of you users are projecting your own interpretation of Andy's rules and trying to Mob Rule this forum. Kinda NOT COOL. I say let the man handle his business and his customers.

Word!
 
Can't wee all just get along! Please delete this thread so we can move on in life to more important issues...
 
It clearly says "avoid"

Actually, if you're major complaint is semantics, the last 3 fiddleback fridays posts have made absolutely no mention by Ken or Andy that people should "avoid editing". If we're "Following Andy's Rules", and not self governing, then they should be put in every single friday post. I think they aren't in there every week because it became part of the mob culture of this place. You don't edit.

I completely reject the notion that self governance (Mob Rule as you put it) is a bad thing. We've historically been the ones to catch non-gold members on selling. When the whole dragnet posting started, it was our concerns that brought it into the light. These discussions usually start with us, and at some point, Andy come's in to address the crowd and render a verdict. And I like that about this place. It's what happens when you have a well connected community. Look how many people reached out to Gordy when he lost out on another fiddleback friday (and we've all been there, Gordy). I don't want to lose that. I think that's part of what helped create this place. It's why we are having this discussion...because we all felt something was "wrong". Otherwise this place is just eBay.
 
Me and Andy have handled it, what's done is done. He said his piece, I've said mine. Amends have been made. Thank you to the others that participated. I'm not participating in this thread anymore from here out, I would suggest others let it go as well.
 
THAT is not what the rules say. It clearly says "avoid" and by using the terminology willful violation leads others to believe that user's actions were with intent to deceive or manipulate - something you do not know per se. Nor does the rules say anywhere his post will be disqualified. You made all that up under your own interpretation .. which btw, is not your decision to make.

I should probably stay out of this .. but some of you users are projecting your own interpretation of Andy's rules and trying to Mob Rule this forum. Kinda NOT COOL. I say let the man handle his business and his customers.

Fair enough. Andy said "avoid" and I said "you should not." I'm not sure there is a vast ocean between the two, but you are technically correct. As for my use of "willful violation," it doesn't speak to his intent at all. It's very simple in my mind, even as a lurker prior to contributing to this forum, it was very apparent that posts in FBF threads shouldn't be edited to get a knife. emoney, willfully chose to edit his post. Whether he did it dishonestly or not is not for me to judge, frankly I don't care. I don't know the man and most likely never will; his motives are quite irrelevant for me. What I tried to spell out for him is that his choice to edit a post carries consequences. One such consequence might be that people think he was trying to cheat. Whether he was or not is moot. He needs to understand that his choice lead others to judge; whether some are right or not to judge is likewise moot...it's a likely reaction and I don't think he should be so surprised or offended that some might draw such a conclusion.

If he simply stated, "you're right guys, I did edit it, I didn't do it with malice, I was trying to clarify which HB I wanted. Since there's no way to know that my edit was before anyone else claimed that knife, I understand I'm at the end of the line. Won't happen again, already looking forward to next Friday!" my guess is that nothing more would have come of this. Not understanding that his choice could certainly lead to people getting the wrong idea blinded him and made him to feel the victim of an unholy crusade that simply didn't exist. I was trying to point that out to him; it was a natural and even likely consequence of an action he willfully made.
 
Actually, if you're major complaint is semantics, the last 3 fiddleback fridays posts have made absolutely no mention by Ken or Andy that people should "avoid editing". If we're "Following Andy's Rules", and not self governing, then they should be put in every single friday post. I think they aren't in there every week because it became part of the mob culture of this place. You don't edit.

I completely reject the notion that self governance (Mob Rule as you put it) is a bad thing. We've historically been the ones to catch non-gold members on selling. When the whole dragnet posting started, it was our concerns that brought it into the light. These discussions usually start with us, and at some point, Andy come's in to address the crowd and render a verdict. And I like that about this place. It's what happens when you have a well connected community. Look how many people reached out to Gordy when he lost out on another fiddleback friday (and we've all been there, Gordy). I don't want to lose that. I think that's part of what helped create this place. It's why we are having this discussion...because we all felt something was "wrong". Otherwise this place is just eBay.

^^ all of that is just another example of a user projecting their interpretation of 'the rules' or trying to Mob Rule this sub forum with a consensus view.^^ I dont think you guys realize you're probably running off more of Andy's potential customers with that stuff. So .. you musta missed my point, let Andy deal with the business/customer semantics sir .... oh wait, he already did. :eek:
 
I dont think you guys realize you're probably running off more of Andy's potential customers with that stuff.

...Said the new customer.


The icing on the cake is how you are telling people to just shut up and let Andy run this place and you aren't doing that. You are interpreting the rules and telling the community your opinion. You are LITERALLY doing what you are yelling at others for doing


...and you are totally allowed to. That's my point. This is called a 'forum'.
 
Andy and co are great at customer service from what I've seen. I'm sure this issue will/has been be handled tactfully. Let's all go grab a beer gentlemen.
 
Some people need tougher skin. Shit happens, nobody got hurt, Andy is trying to make it work for everyone and there will always be people dissapointed with how Friday works out..

Pretty much sums up everything that needs to be said.
 
Hopefully this is the last post on this thread
1. Do I own my mistake? Absolutely, all my fault.
2. Do I think Hasco deserves the knife? Absolutely, without question
3. Was I mad I did not get the knife, itself? Not at all.
4. Was I embarrassed and angry that I was alleged a cheater? Yes
5. Do I need thicker skin? Yes.
6. Are decisions about how FBF is ran Andy's and Andy's alone. Yes.
7. Am I regretful of how this has turned out? Yes, it is out of hand. Andy and I are cool on my end, and really that's all this ever was about with me. It was an issue between me and FBF. The whole reason I was pissed is that it became public.
8. Do people need to move on? Yes, do it immediately.

Please,for the love of God, move on and let this die!
 
I am looking forward to these new knives ! I'd like to see a Shenanigan with brown canvas and a Rucus with osage !
 
...Said the new customer.


The icing on the cake is how you are telling people to just shut up and let Andy run this place and you aren't doing that. You are interpreting the rules and telling the community your opinion. You are LITERALLY doing what you are yelling at others for doing


...and you are totally allowed to. That's my point. This is called a 'forum'.

WTF? How bout you get a grip on reality. I'm not a new customer. I never told ANYONE (you included) to shut up, nor did I yell at anyone. My only interpretation of anything is examples of you running your suck like you own the place. You guys are offending people (me included) .. and that's not totally allowed.
 
I'm Switzerland in all of this (i.e. neutral); at the end of the day we're all "friends" here and share a common interest in Andy's work and a love for knife collecting. I think matters have been resolved by all parties; let's let this one go guys...seriously.

Unless Andy or Ken objects, I recommend the following: Mods, Please lock
 
Unless Andy or Ken objects, I recommend the following: Mods, Please lock[/QUOTE]

I second the motion! I also RECOMMEND that you send me your camp knife stat. . . . friend.;)
 
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