Shipping pocket knives USPS illegal

[OliverH]

Also an individual postal worker can not make up rules as they go along. It does not matter what an individual post office location has to say; they all must comply with federal regulations.

The postal worker described in the original post may have been working under this particular section. The relevant sentences are:

"Under DMM 601.8, postmasters have the authority to determine the mailability of restricted articles and substances. A postmaster who has determined an article or substance to be nonmailable has the authority to refuse the item from mailing."

Knives are on the "restricted article" list, so it looks like the regulations do leave room for local application of the regs. However, it still seems weird that they could claim that knives are per-se unmailable.

 

[colubrid]

So either superseding regs have come out not reflected on the website or some yokel is playing games I would have taken him off the assignment for in my station.

I spoke to the postmaster of that station. It is a large post office and i know the woman has been there at least 20 years.

The postal regulation does seem contradictory though since it has a section that says how knives etc. must be securely packaged so that they don't puncture the outer box.

It would seem that way to me to. But the poster they had with a picture of a pocket knife and the regs written next to it did not seem like a locale post office job.

I don't know if the post office will allow me to take a picture of that but i will sure ask tommorow when I go back. i will also take along the regs posted here and ask them why they contradict.

 

[Seals]

I've been through this with my local postmaster.She also showed me the regs book and offending passage.They turned me away because i had written "knife" on the customs form.They are all aware of what i am shipping and couldn't care less.But they let me know not to be too descriptive when shipping overseas or when answering the questions they always ask.I now write camping tools and never have a problem.

 

[CDHumiston]

I send and receive knives USPS two or three time a week. All the employees know exactly what I'm shipping and receiving. I have opened the boxes and shown the knives to a few of the ladies. They have NEVER questioned me or tried to stop me from mailing knives. I have received knives from Thailand, Checloslovakia (sp), Italy, and Germany. I have never had a knife lost or confiscated!

 

[elkins45]

I am not surprised that you had a problem shipping a gun of any type because that is definitely illegal. Regardless of whether you remove the bolt, firing pin or what ever the registered / serial numbered part of the firearm (receiver) can not be sent through the US Mail any time any where. You can easily verify this at any gunstore. Since the 1968 Gun Control Act not one of them has ever gotten a firearm sent through the US Mail, period. They must be sent by Fedex or UPS.

Not true. You are incorrect with respect to long guns. Go here and scroll down to Section 11: http://pe.usps.com/text/dmm300/601.htm#wp1103548


Some of the relevant text is quoted below:

Rifles and Shotguns
Although unloaded rifles and shotguns not precluded by 11.1.1e and 11.1.2 are mailable, mailers must comply with the Gun Control Act of 1968, Public Law 90-618, 18 USC 921, et seq., and the rules and regulations promulgated thereunder, 27 CFR 178, as well as state and local laws. The mailer may be required by the USPS to establish, by opening the parcel or by written certification, that the gun is unloaded and not precluded by 11.1.1e.

11.4
Legal Opinions on Mailing Firearms
Postmasters are not authorized to give opinions on the legality of any shipment of rifles or shotguns. Contact the nearest office of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms for further advice.

 

[De4thStr1ke]

This was not a case of an individual making up rules or the local post office.

the clerk got the regs and showed it to me. It clearly stated that no knives or sharp cutting tools. There was even a picture that showed a pocket knife and a round circle with a red line through it.

I asked about what "authorized parties" meant and she said it means manufacturers. So I was allowed to ship the knife back to the manufacturer which was written on the label (Spyderco on Spyderco way). You can ship to them but it is illegal to ship a knife to an individual. But again, they will not insure even if it goes to a manufacturer because a defective knife is considered broken and thus they will not insure even in the case of shipping to a manufacturer.

I will go back to the post office and see if they can make me a copy. It was in line with guns, ammo and other pictures that were displayed in color on the chart.

If you can get a copy please upload it here, I'd be interested in seeing it. My local post office hasn't given me any issues with it. They simply ask if anything is perishable, fragile, explosive, or potentially hazardous. Since all my knives are packed safely, I simply answer no, and I'm on my way.

It may be an old reg or something, and that guy is trying to be a stickler for the rules......

 

[elkins45]

duplicate

 

[JD Mandrell]

I've mailed knives more times than I can count, and several postal workers new I was, and nobody has ever remotely implied I couldn't.

 

[enderwiggin]

This was not a case of an individual making up rules or the local post office.

the clerk got the regs and showed it to me. It clearly stated that no knives or sharp cutting tools. There was even a picture that showed a pocket knife and a round circle with a red line through it.

I asked about what "authorized parties" meant and she said it means manufacturers. So I was allowed to ship the knife back to the manufacturer which was written on the label (Spyderco on Spyderco way). You can ship to them but it is illegal to ship a knife to an individual. But again, they will not insure even if it goes to a manufacturer becasue a defective knife is considered broken and thus they will not insure even in the case of shipping to a manufacturer.

I will go back to the post office and see if they can make me a copy. It was in line with guns, ammo and other pictures that were displayed in color on the chart.

He was still full of it. I've shipped many, many knives from eBay auctions to private buyers, and many of them were packaged in front of the postal employees.

Heck, I use a knife to cut the tape to package another knife in front of postal employees in three seperate post offices, and have never had a problem.

In Southern California.

It sounds like it's time for you to find a different post office.

 

[vjb.knife]

OK I read through a bunch of the regulations and I am not saying that I am correct on this because I am not a lawyer but I think that this is probably what is going on. First of all, Domestic mail regulations are very different from international shipping, so first to the DMM (domestic regulations). I believe that the governing reg is DMM 601.11 which is talking about knives that are defined as switchblades and the restrictions on them.

Shipping domestically of non- switchblade knives is covered in section 443.1 General
All sharp–pointed or sharp–edged instruments such as knives, tools, ice picks, razor blades, etc., must be securely packaged in a strong container as required in DMM 601.1–8. Sufficient cushioning material must be used to protect the sharp points and edges from cutting through the outer packaging during normal Postal Service handling.

When you try to ship a knife internationally it is a whole different bag of worms and is governed by the mail and import restrictions of the country that you are mailing the knife to. These laws vary tremendously and you are running the risk of getting your shipment confiscated in many cases depending on the country you send it to and how you fill out the customs form.

Like I said no promises here but this is the way I read it and how I intend to deal with it and always have dealt with it. For domestic shipments in the US I will send any type of 'non-switchblade' knife I want to and I am not worried about it in the least about them.

 

[colubrid]

He was still full of it. I've shipped many, many knives from eBay auctions to private buyers, and many of them were packaged in front of the postal employees.

Heck, I use a knife to cut the tape to package another knife in front of postal employees in three seperate post offices, and have never had a problem.

In Southern California.

It sounds like it's time for you to find a different post office.

I have shipped many knives through that post office. It only came up today because it was addressed to Spyderco. Otherwise i would not have to mention what is in the package.

the point is that it is illegal- at least that is what they told me and showed me on their poster chart. If you are going to break that law then you might as well ship ammo, snakes or anything else that they don't allow.

i doubt anyone has ever been charged because the whole thing seems ridiculous. Can you imagine granpa getting busted by the feds for shipping his grandson a swiss army knife at Christmas.

 

[Kiah]

I ship knives with insurance all the time. My postal workers are well aware and have never said anything except for one guy who wanted to know if I made customs.

As for guns. Long guns can be shipped via USPS to an FFL holder in any state or an individual without an FFL in the same state.

 

[Ken44]

Are you sure what he was showing you was for this country?

My rural postmaster knows I sell/buy alot of knives(he's been with PO 30 years), and helps me with the rules if I have to ship out of country.
He has pulled it up on screen and showm me I could send it to the countries before I would ship. Not long ago he advised me not to ship to Germany since I always put "knife" on claims form, and it said nothing that could be used as a weapon could be shipped there.

If he is showing me many countries that I can sell to, and has never said a thing about me shipping knives, I have to belive it is OK to ship knive's with usps. The two clerks at our rural PO went to school with me and I trust what they tell me as well.

 

[Mike Carter Custom Knives]

I would be very interested to get a definite official answer on this since I regularly ship knives via USPS.

At the very least it seems like a good excuse for them to get out of paying an insurance claim.

 

[jujigatame]

To the OP - is there another post office in the area you could use? What you ran into just seems so unreasonable and out of whack with normal PO experience, regardless of whatever printed regs they produced.

 

[Jaxx]

The folks behind the counter at my local PO always ask, "Anything liquid, perishable, fragile or potentially hazardous?". That's it. Being as I always wrap my outgoing knives pretty much as if they were going to be air dropped without a chute, I say no, because the only way they would be potentially hazardous to anyone during shipping is if any PO employee opened the box, cut through the packaging wrapped around each knife, pulled out said knife, removed the cardboard blade protector (on fixed blades), and jammed it into themselves. In other words, they'd have to really put some effort into making mine become a hazard. The folks at my PO all know that I'm into knives, and I've yet to have an issue about shipping over a package with knives incoming or outgoing to me that involved the USPS. :thumbup:

 

[colubrid]

To the OP - is there another post office in the area you could use? What you ran into just seems so unreasonable and out of whack with normal PO experience, regardless of whatever printed regs they produced.

Yes there is another post office i could use but it really doesn't matter if I use this one. As long as I don't label the box (KNIFE) or tell anyone what it is in the box. The only question they ask if there is anything pershible-liquid-fragile or hazardous. So it really is a mute piont. I will continue to use usps unless the buyer has a problem receiving through them or the community at large says it is a foupah because it will give us knife collectors a bad rep (the last thing this country needs is another reguilation) and if we ship illegally (via usps) that can be construed by some as consequences.


The way i see it is only way this has effect on us is that insurance is not valid when shipping a $100+ knife. That part DOES have an impact on us and is probably the most relevent part of this thread.

 

[markksr]

... is probably the most relevent part of this thread.

Actually, I think the most relevant part of this thread is that your Post Office has given you incorrect information but they had a poster so trying to convince you of this is a moot point...

 

[spidyman]

Never mind!

 

[Jaxx]

Actually, I think the most relevant part of this thread is that your Post Office has given you incorrect information but they had a poster so trying to convince you of this is a moot point...

I agree... Even if you are sending a knife back to the maker/manufacturer for repair, replacement, or return, the knife still has value, and should qualify for insurance and subsequently, a claim on this insurance if lost or stolen before reaching its destination.