Small Inkosi Pocket Clip Issue?

Here's my original email:


I have noticed that the pocket clip on my newer CRK folders are different from my older ones(early/pre 2017). The tip or lip of the clip seems to flair out more and then dip back down parallel with the handle. Is there a change in the manufacturing process that could have caused this? Do you guys still have any of the "old" style clips that are available? I much prefer the older style, and I believe a lot of other people do as well as there is a thread going on at Bladeforums about this. I could try bending a clip to make it seem like the old style, but if I mess it up, I wouldn't want to have to buy a new clip and it be the "new" style, putting me back at ground one. The attached photo shows the difference between the "old" clip (left) and the "new" style clip (right). Thanks!

-Attached was the photo that I asked to use from HST.
 
Reply from Matt at Customer Service:

[My name]

The clips we use are one of the only things we don't manufacturer in house(with the exception of the Mnandi/Hawk Style clip). There hasn't been a design change, but from time to time the die that is used to make these wears out. When this happens we have a new one made and it will cause slight variances in certain parts of the clip profile. This variance has been the case for the entire time that we've made these clips as we've had to have many new dies made over the years. All this to say, there isn't an old or new style clip so to speak, all of the clips we've got in house right now will have been made in the same batch and would have the same profile. Over time the profile will change slightly until we've got to have a new die made again, at which point people may notice and start a bladeforums thread regarding this:)

Let me know if I can do anything else for you.

Best Regards,
Matt
 
If they know this is happening why can’t they bend it before attaching it themselves instead of asking customers to do so?

One of the clips I received was beyond ridiculous. I guess tolerances/ uniformity doesn’t apply to clips.

I’m not very impressed with the attitude adopted by CRK.
 
The store that I bought my knife from has contacted CRK directly and they are shipping me a new clip directly, Ill report back with what that clip looks like
 
Scotcha said:
If they know this is happening why can’t they bend it before attaching it themselves instead of asking customers to do so?

One of the clips I received was beyond ridiculous. I guess tolerances/ uniformity doesn’t apply to clips.

I’m not very impressed with the attitude adopted by CRK.
Click to expand...

Having just returned from CRK, talking with Matt and Tim and one or two of the fit department people there are some things to note.

1) The clips have changed a few times over the years (HST brought up one of the changes with the U bend which was the most recent)
2) They are made by a 3rd party as noted earlier
3) The dies can and do wear, but it's a gradual wear and not something that happens instantly
4) Out of all the parts on the knives, the clip has the loosest of allowable tolerance
5) The clips are blasted in a fixture that causes this condition- They are normally fixed to a more normalized condition at the fit bench when assembled.
6) There could have been someone that assembled or shipped some of the clips out in the after blasting condition.

So, in essence, it's not really a change, but I do know that there have been complaints on the clips not fitting heavy carhart type pants which end up bending the clips when they catch on something. Probably if anything, there may be a small change to allow for a tiny bit more space to accommodate.

My copy and paste of Tim's response probably didn't help with this comment. Tim and I have a pretty open relationship. Personally, I didn't see anything wrong with it..but I am hardly an ideal person for being politically correct all the time. Tradesman are kindof like that I suppose.. But to an extent, I was right that Tim didn't really look at the pictures last night until he had a message that was passed on to him. Summarily dismissed concerns? Not really.. just a poorly worded email from myself to Tim.

Hope this helps.


Bill
 
Why can't a CRK employee or Tim Reeve just reply here themselves? It'd be a lot more up-front than second-hand info.
 
brownshoe said:
Why can't a CRK employee or Tim Reeve just reply here themselves? It'd be a lot more up-front than second-hand info.
Click to expand...

I just did- That is one of the reasons why I was chosen to be a mod of this forum. Proximity and an understanding of their products.
Tim is very active on the facebook pages for those that don't know.
 
bhyde said:
I just did- That is one of the reasons why I was chosen to be a mod of this forum. Proximity and an understanding of their products.
Tim is very active on the facebook pages for those that don't know.
Click to expand...

Sorry didn't know you were an employee. For some stupid reason, I've gotten the impression over the years you were not an employee.
 
brownshoe said:
Sorry didn't know you were an employee. For some stupid reason, I've gotten the impression over the years you were not an employee.
Click to expand...

I am not on their payroll to be clear..Perhaps at some point in the future.
 
The last 3 CR knives Ive purchased brand new this year have a much more pronounced bow in the clip than my 2015 Small 21. I thought the first was a defect and ordered another. It was slightly better but ended up bending it to my liking. After seeing the next two knives arrive this way I just assumed its the way they are made now. But I definitely like the sleeker "flatter" clip.
 
The thing that made me love CRK is all the pedantic details that went into every knife, the change to the clip is not a “slight variance” as stated by Matt, it is quite dramatic and being that the clip plays a role in the ergonomics of the knife l’m surprised at how flippant CRK are about this change. I really doubt Chris Reeve would have accepted or ever settled for anywhere near this much variation between dies...in fact any machinist worth their salt would not have signed off on that new die so I put this down to a terrible oversight by someone rather than a acceptable variance.
 
Jimbo75 said:
The thing that made me love CRK is all the pedantic details that went into every knife, the change to the clip is not a “slight variance” as stated by Matt, it is quite dramatic and being that the clip plays a role in the ergonomics of the knife l’m surprised at how flippant CRK are about this change. I really doubt Chris Reeve would have accepted or ever settled for anywhere near this much variation between dies...in fact any machinist worth their salt would not have signed off on that new die so I put this down to a terrible oversight by someone rather than a acceptable variance.
Click to expand...

#5 and #6 of my research above specifically address the issues you are talking about.
Since the company is around ~45 employees, I doubt even Chris would be able to address #5 and #6 with the growth at the company. He simply is not capable of checking 100% of all knives or parts being shipped.
A new die would not would not have so much variance,..especially when you consider that there are 3 companies using the same clip. The difference I think is that the other two companies coat their clips rather than to send them out as raw titanium. (at least from what I see of their products) So, they are in effect using a stock clip. The issue really is that they are being sand blasted and warped off of the blasting fixture and slipping by some people at the fitting bench who may not be quite experienced.
For sure, this has been brought to CRK's attention and they are addressing it accordingly with some discussion of an inspection fixture to check this.
 
Received my replacement and it's is the exact same shape as the one in my OP, just wanted to follow up.

At this point I am used to the original one so not really worried about it. However, if I could get my hands on one of the flatter ones I would like to
 
My Inkosi, born 5/17, came with its clip like the OP. IMO, it is a part of the knife that is a lesser issue, and being handy, making a fuss never crossed my mind. I taped up the jaws of two pairs of pliers, removed the clip & bent it to my liking, which is the lowest profile possible while still being able to clip on to a pair of double duck carrharts. Then again, NO knife really comes from the factory with a perfect clip, and slight modification is normal for me. It could be worse... a Spyderco steel spring clip will snap like a tortilla chip if you try to bend it.
 
archieblue said:
My Inkosi, born 5/17, came with its clip like the OP. IMO, it is a part of the knife that is a lesser issue, and being handy, making a fuss never crossed my mind. I taped up the jaws of two pairs of pliers, removed the clip & bent it to my liking, which is the lowest profile possible while still being able to clip on to a pair of double duck carrharts. Then again, NO knife really comes from the factory with a perfect clip, and slight modification is normal for me. It could be worse... a Spyderco steel spring clip will snap like a tortilla chip if you try to bend it.
Click to expand...

Pretty much how I see it right here. I don't mind modifying the clip to my liking and have bent a few of them accidentally to around 45deg when they have caught onto seatbelts etc..They bend back just fine.
I did talk to Tim earlier this week about the clips and this particular "issue". There was a decent percentage that went out the door this way, but from my understanding, they are now being bent back to shape after the sandblast operation to what we have become used to.
 
I guess I never bought a CRK with any issue with the pocket clip ... but many people complain a clip is to tight it wears my jeans pocket to much ... then they complain the clips got to much bow it will catch on things ...

I mean come on these knives are the highest quality controled production knives you'll find and no matter what the clip is some will like it some will find fault ... but it's a very easy simple fix ... and if you need a new one CRK is great to replace it ... think this may be blown a bit out of proportion ...

if you have issues a simple call to CRK to express your concern and I bet they will take care of you ... if several calls were made over one issue I'm sure it would draw attention ... but you can't expect to post here and CRK to have any chance to address any issue ... their customer service is as good as it gets ... give them a call be civil and I'll bet they take good care of whatever issues you may have.
 
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