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smelting

B

Brax

Joined
Jul 10, 2006
Messages
41
was wondering about smelting my own metal from scrap. My famaly is generaly into potery and might be able to make me disposable crucibles and molds for next to nothing from there scraps. was wondering if this would be a good or bad idea:confused: :confused:
 
I have been smelting my own steel since last Nov. It is a great way to learn metalurgy and have an authentic steel for for repro knives etc. Quite a few bladesmiths are doing it. Smelting with thermite is a neat experience and a hell of alot of fun to watch.

I do know a couple people that make thier own crucibles. For thermite you have to make your own crucible to contain 6000 deg.
 
Not to be a schmuck (or at least more than I really am always), but I think it's Thermit NOT Thermite. Thermite is a different animal entirely, if I'm not mistaken.
I could be wrong, but I remember reading about someone being taken to task for confusing the two.

For the record, they seemed to describe identical things to me, so take this with a grain of salt!

Can anyone confirm any of this?
 
One spelling is the process and the other is a brand name of commercially prepared thermite. Thermit is the registered trademark. In my book they both mean the same thing. There are alot of products where the brand name is also the universal description of it. Whoever it was that made a big deal out of it has there skivies on way too tight.

This was the last charge I did. You can see the molten iron pouring out the bottom after it melted the metal tap at the bottom of the crucible. A smaller SiC crucible catches it and it then cools slowly since the catch crucible is insulated in vermiculite.

thermitephoto.jpg
 
Thanks for the clarification, Mr. Finnigan! I suspected it was semantics, but sometimes people can be touchy.
 
thanks that is also a wonderful and informative forum. my grandfather was a jewler and used a torch for a great many things... including looking for gas leaks in the gas lones but that is a nother story. i was wondering if this little thing would do the trick for at least a bit.
http://www.portable-heat-tools.com/...Product/37fd63000465d7c1ef11fcf9fb7c20eb.html
then after that be good for othjer things once i manage to get a bit better set up
 
Very interesting Mr. Finnigan,what was the final product (what was it similar to 10XX ?) of the pictured "charge" ??? And is it in the form of bar stock ; a lump to forge into a given shape ; or a Blade shaped mold ; etc. Sorry to ask such basic questions but Brax & you have peaked my interest .Thanks
 
Brax said:
thanks that is also a wonderful and informative forum. my grandfather was a jewler and used a torch for a great many things... including looking for gas leaks in the gas lones but that is a nother story. i was wondering if this little thing would do the trick for at least a bit.
http://www.portable-heat-tools.com/...Product/37fd63000465d7c1ef11fcf9fb7c20eb.html
then after that be good for othjer things once i manage to get a bit better set up
Click to expand...

Brax,

A smelt usually takes LOTS of charcoal or LP and at least a few hours. No offense intended, but a torch like that might be suitable to light a piece of paper to get your smelting fire going but wouldn't do you any other good in smelting.

-d
 
Those would not be enough for steel. It takes an amazing amount of heat to get steel or iron ores to melt and seperate. The first few smelts I did were in my forge and afterwards it looked like someone detonated a nuke inside it.
 
You should have been at Harley's hammer in this spring. Crucible steel was smelted from iron ore using charcoal as fuel.

They also made blister steel in a can which was a new one on me
 
well i was actualy thinking on starting simple and melting things like broken drill bits, saw blades and the like for learning the mecanics of bladesmithing while dweling in an apartment
 
I have to check this out! I know a bit too much about thermite for someone who has yet to find an excuse to use it, this looks like a good oppurtunity :)

In retrospect, why do I need an excuse to play with thermite?!
 
There are many factors, techniques, types of equipment, supplies etc in smelting. It can get as involved as knife making. I have been developing an electro arc smelting process over the last few months. It is faster, cheaper and much more consistant then using charcoal, propane, thermite etc. As of right now I can get the C very close to my target. That has always been the wild card, controlling the carbon content. You either end up with too much or too little.

The last thermite smelt yielded a button that was in the 1% C range but that was tested just by spark testing which is only a ball park fiqure. The charge was done to test a new ultra high temp refractory I have been tweaking and playing with.

Be prepared to waste alot of supplies, equipment and time when you get into the whacky world of home smelting. But in the process you will learn alot about iron, steel and alloying. I don't regret any of the failures I have had or the wasted resources. Since last fall carbon steel alloys have become much less mysterious to me.

Give it a shot and don't be afraid to experiement a little. The "Bloomers and Buttons" thread over on Fogg's forum has some good info. There is some proprietary info that some smelters won't divulge so don't be putoff off by that. I would rather fiqure it out myself because odds are I can probably find a shortcut or improvement instead of just copying someone else's work.
 
Ive watched Jesse smelt ore into iron and carborize what he wanted to use for cutting edges and pattern welding.Planning on running two viking age smelters this weekend.There are few things much more cooler..Fogg will be on hand, we look to have a fantastic weekend.
Edited to mention what you sound like you are wanting to do is melting as in crucible steel.Not smelting as in using a furnace.Ask Greg over here for melting advice.
http://p222.ezboard.com/fprimalfiresfrm24
 
That sounds like it's going to be cool, I wish I was there to watch. It is facinating to see a white yellow liquid almost as runny as water cool and in just a few minutes be solid iron or steel. Then to see it worked into a blade or edged weapon/tool kicks it up another notch.

Is anyone going be snapping pics?
 
Hi

check this link out..
Kustaa has documented his process..... it'll give you an idea about the trials and errors that can be expected...
http://www.sparetimelabs.com/furnace/furnace.html

now this is cast iron.... you'll need a higher temp for tool steel...
- and a blower will make life much easier


i'd love to try thermite and reduction with charcoal.... sounds like a supertime :D

Greg
 
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