Spyderco H1 Steel versus VG-10

M

Mud Shrimp Moe

Joined
Nov 6, 2011
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I'd like the forum opinions on the Spyderco salts versus their equivalents in VG-10. The Pacific Salt is quite similar to the Endura. The Atlantic Salt is quite similar to the 93mm Rescue, which again is about the same size blade as the Endura. The Salt 1 is comparable to the Delica. And so on.

I know the damage that salt water can cause to most metals as well as other materials. But I'm hardly ever around salt water. I am, however, around fresh water pretty often. I live in North Texas, where the humidity is light. I fish and hang around a lake some. But I don't swim with a knife. My knives could be used to cut bait or clean fish, but will always be cleaned afterwards. Given the tendency of H1 to scratch, could I be reasonable confident with using VG10 blades - about 90% not around water at all and 10% around freshwater? Or does it make sense to invest in the Salt equivalents of the Delica, Endura, Rescue, Dragonfly, etc? Will VG10 tolerate getting wet and exposure to foods, as long as it is cleaned reasonably well and oiled from time to time?
 
Mud Shrimp Moe said:
Given the tendency of H1 to scratch, could I be reasonable confident with using VG10 blades - about 90% not around water at all and 10% around freshwater? ... Will VG10 tolerate getting wet and exposure to foods, as long as it is cleaned reasonably well and oiled from time to time?
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I use a serrated H1 in and around water -- mostly saltwater. It cuts well. Scratching isn't a problem.

I have never seen rust on any of the many VG-10 folders I've had. Mostly their exposure to water is in outdoors stuff and cleaning. My opinion is that VG-10 would suit your needs just fine.
 
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IMO H1 is the best steel . All you need are sweaty pockets to make a supertseel rust. And in real life I want a knife I can use for every circumstance including food prep ect.

Not to mention it is nice not to always have to wipe down, clean and dry a knife before going to bed or whenever.

Blade is wet? No problem. Just stick it in your pocket and go. Never a worry.


I alo live in the sothern part of the US where it gets real hot and humid in the summer. Clothes get wet and knives stay damp all day. I also keep my knife on me when I go for jogging (in case of dogs) and in the gym while working out (had to use it there to from anything to cutting faulty equipment and opening protien shakes.)


The H1 Salts are just a better user blade IMO.
 
lava_lamp said:
I have never seen rust on any of the many VG-10 folders I've had. Mostly their exposure to water is in outdoors stuff and cleaning. My opinion is that VG-10 would suit your needs just fine.
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I have had rust on VG-10, S30V and every high end production knife like sebs, strider, benchmade steels ect.

I wish they would make some of my favorite designs in H1 steel.
 
I had used VG-10 around the fresh water and food preparation etc. a lot. Sousages, vegetables and even cuting lime and left it for a few days. Still no rust. I think the rust thing is a bit exagerated but I understand it if you use your knives around salt water etc.. Which I didn't yet. I think VG-10 will serve you better without you needing to bother for rust. It's a fine all around steel with very good corosion resistance. In my opinion of course ;)
 
colubrid said:
I have had rust on VG-10, S30V and every high end production knife like sebs, strider, benchmade steels ect.
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I have had some rust on S30V, but not on VG-10. It might be coincidence, but some of the differences are due to blade finish, I think. The VG-10 tends to be polished. The S30V where I have seen rust is mostly bead blasted (Strider, Lone Wolf) but I have seemn a few pinpricks of rust on my S30V military I often use for food prep (and wash after.)

It's a little off topic, but I don't buy bead blasted Kershaws with Sandvik steel. They tend to rust for me.
 
Ya bead blasting is a killer. So are the tiger stripes on strider SNG and SMF's.

Evrytime i see rust on a new knife. In my eyes..it just reduced its value down to a .50 cent dollar store knife and i don't want it no more.
 
Yep, VG10 will suit you fine. If you lived in high humidity or were around salt water a lot, then I would recommend picking up a Salt. Just make sure to wipe down your VG10 blades and you'll be golden. :thumbup:
 
the rust you see when you use a stainless knife daily is surface rust, it'll come off with the mildest polish, won't affect peformance, barely affect cosmetic if at all once cleaned.

VG10 is used in a lot of very high end and very expensive kitchen knives. it's used in pro environment. i have used some VG10 knives everyday making quite a lot of prep daily, cuting toomatoes and lemons ...they still function.
 
Get H1 if you want a serrated blade. It sharpens easy and will hold an edge much longer than VG10. I believe the edge of SE H1 is around 68 HRC. Lately I can't believe how amazing SE H1 is.

For plain edge, get VG10. VG10 is an excellent all around steel. I just purchased a very nice Shun damascus kitchen knife for my mother, and it uses VG10.
 
Thanks, everyone. I think I'll do as Handwrecker has suggested and look into a H1 SE knife but otherwise stick to VG-10. I should have mentioned that I recently bought a Spyderhawk, which is H1. It's a plain edge. I would have preferred SE, but I got a screaming good deal on the PE, so I took it. And I have several VG-10 models (2xD4, Endura 3 CE, Dragonfly2). I even have two Byrd FRN knives with 8cr13Mov steel in shipment. I've just really recently gotten the Spyderco fixation, so I've got several steels that are relatively new to me. I'm just anxious to see how each holds up to actual daily use of various types.
 
I really love this new H-1, USN Catcherman that I got a few weeks ago. I just wish I could get them to make that same blade in full Spyderedge with H-1. A full Spyderedge Catcherman even in AUS-8 is an awesome food prep, fishing/hunting/outdoor knife>> but in H-1 it would be the "Cat's Meow :cool:" A fully serrated Catcherman in H-1 would be like having a crocidile at your fingertips :D

As far as VG-10 having a corrosion problem I've yet to experience anything with VG-10 that one would deem troublesome. But ZDP-189 is one you really want to be mindful of. ZDP is one of my very favorite blade steels but it will corrode big time if you're not careful.

H-1 steel has many possibilities with food prep and outdoor cutlery and I hope we see the Salt Series continue to expand :cool:

The one Brother is spot on observing corrosion problems with a lot of the newer alloys> any steel with over 1.75% carbon or even close to that will get some rust or pitted corrosion if you're not careful. And the Corrosion you get with ZDP is far worse than surface rust>> please trust me on that one :(

I even wish that they would resurrect many of the older, discontinued models in H-1.
 
I fear the answer to this will be beyond my ability to understand. But here goes:

Why is a plain edge H1 blade softer/less-edge-retention-y than VG10, but a SE H1 blade actually has BETTER retention? This seems really counter intuitive.

I'm also aware that H1 work hardens. I don't understand the science behind that, but accept it as fact anyway.
 
H1 is work hardening steel as opposed to most knife steels which are hardened by heat treating. A lot of people have experienced better edge retention as they use and sharpen the knife more and more. Plain edge H1 is relatively soft as compared to VG-10 as it comes from the factory. Now serrating H1 is working it. Being a work hardening steel, the very edge is hardened by the act of grinding the serrations on it. As mentioned, the edges of the serrations are in the high 60's. IIRC, Sal has mentioned that CATRA testing has shown that SE H1 continued to cut longer than most of the steels they "CATRA'ed".
 
Thanks, singularity35. I've read about H1 SE before, but for whatever reason, I never read an explanation that was as concise and clear as yours. Makes sense now. Thanks.
 
singularity35 said:
H1 is work hardening steel as opposed to most knife steels which are hardened by heat treating. A lot of people have experienced better edge retention as they use and sharpen the knife more and more. Plain edge H1 is relatively soft as compared to VG-10 as it comes from the factory. Now serrating H1 is working it. Being a work hardening steel, the very edge is hardened by the act of grinding the serrations on it. As mentioned, the edges of the serrations are in the high 60's. IIRC, Sal has mentioned that CATRA testing has shown that SE H1 continued to cut longer than most of the steels they "CATRA'ed".
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That was a great explanation. Thanks!

Now i wish Spyderco would expand their H1 models. I am espcially hopeful for a Military in H1.
 
Agreed !!! Serrated h-1 is "Da Bomb" !!! Iv been carrying my salt 1 daily for the last month without having to touch the edge and it just keeps taking more . I also like serrated zdp-189!!!
 
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