stainless better than S30V?

I highly recommend CPM 154. It's tougher then S30V. I waiting on the new CPMS 35VN to work with. This steel is suppose to be a real good one.
Scott
 
Knife Outlet said:
Better is a dangerous term. All alloys have plusses and minuses. That's why there are so many alloys available. Everything is a compromise. You just need to decide where you want to compromise.
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Yes and what I find disturbing is many discussions concerning steel types seem to center around

"ABC steel is better than XYZ steel"

without describing why. I would really like to see more experts describing the different uses that various alloys excell in.

For the layman claiming he/she likes a particular steel I would like to read more detail about the type of use they put their knives to. This would give people an idea from a practical users standpoint as to the advantages and disadvantages of different alloys.

This may actually lead to a concencus of some sort which would be nice.;)

Then there is the standard industry marketed hype that serves to confuse more than educate.

Living in a city I don't get as much opportunity to use various steels hard and I definitaly don't rely on them as much hunters, campers, etc... I just like them and wish. Knife laws are getting draconian here (NYC) so I am even more limited.

I don't have a backyard to do things like battoning and throwing. Using a knife in a public park or whittling on my stoop can cause panic followed by a massive sheeple stampede :eek: which could get me in the slam.

Maybe I should take up indoor whittling I don't know.

I would love to hear both good and bad experiences with different alloys being used for various tasks.

In this thread that would be is there a stainless or near stainless alloy that takes a finer edge, holds that edge longer, and is easier to sharpen than S30V.
 
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eyeeatingfish said:
How about BG-42?
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Is there a stainless or near stainless alloy that takes a finer edge, holds that edge longer, and is easier to sharpen than S30V ?


I am not sure I know of any that meets all three of the OP's criteria.

Correct me if I am wrong BG-42 from what I have read and from my totally non expert feeling of the edge with my fingers tell me it takes a finer edge, and may hold it longer, but I am not sure BG-42 is easier to sharpen.

The OP may have to accept a compromise. Although the OP clearly described what he is looking for I would be curious nevertheless as to what type of materials he wants to cut with it and how much use he intends to put his knife through. Any other intended uses described would be helpful to the experts here as well.

Furthermore fearless, unbiased, uncrompromising input from experts here would be helpful.
 
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Chewy1 said:
The subject says it all. A recent thread (or four) asked about the preferred blade steel for a pocket knife, and S30V was coming out a clear front runner. My question is, in your opinion, what's better than S30V, with 'better' being defined as edge holding, fine-ness of edge, ease of sharpening.
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CPM S30V has bit better then average edge holding being entry level PM steel, there are many steels which holds edge way better.

This is list of stainless steels which shows better edge holding test results then CPM S30V heat treated by Paul Boss (average CPM S30V show bit lower results):

Carpenter Tool Steel - XHP
Yuna Hard II ZDP-189 (second run)
Spyderco CPM S90V
Buck BG42
Buck CPM154

Thanks, Vassili.
 
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Knife Outlet said:
Better is a dangerous term. All alloys have plusses and minuses. That's why there are so many alloys available. Everything is a compromise. You just need to decide where you want to compromise.
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And that's why I didn't throw out my favorite stainless steels: 13C26 and AEB-L. They excel at making me happy. Others' results vary.
 
Well the OP asks what's better in terms of edge holding AND ease of sharpening. That's the trick. The steels that are better than S30V AND still stainless are usually harder to sharpen. I would say pick from ZDP-189 or S90V, although you will have more variety in the former than the latter.

IMO if you're simply looking for a high end folder you can't do much worse than the Stretch in Carbon Fiber and ZDP-189.
 
Buffalohump said:
Well the OP asks what's better in terms of edge holding AND ease of sharpening. That's the trick. The steels that are better than S30V AND still stainless are usually harder to sharpen. I would say pick from ZDP-189 or S90V, although you will have more variety in the former than the latter.

IMO if you're simply looking for a high end folder you can't do much worse than the Stretch in Carbon Fiber and ZDP-189.
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I have no problem sharpening any steel. This is not matter of steel but proper sharpening method and tools. So far I had only problem with CPM S110V to make it hair whittling sharp - all other steel need same amount of work to sharpen - does not really matter is it CPM S90V or 420HC. I would say cheap soft steel is harder to sharpen because of huge flapping burr problem - in this terms ZDP189 need less time.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
is there any knife similar to the Bayley S4 / Martin BT / Red Scorpion Six ASK6 that is made with CPM 154 steel?
 
nozh2002 said:
I have no problem sharpening any steel. This is not matter of steel but proper sharpening method and tools. So far I had only problem with CPM S110V to make it hair whittling sharp - all other steel need same amount of work to sharpen - does not really matter is it CPM S90V or 420HC. I would say cheap soft steel is harder to sharpen because of huge flapping burr problem - in this terms ZDP189 need less time.

Thanks, Vassili.
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Yes that is probably true but only if you are vigilant in maintaining an edge and have good sharpening skills. If for some reason or another one is unable to sharpen it and the knife gets very dull they are going to spend quite a bit of time bringing back the edge.

This is even worse if the person does not have a lot of sharpening experience and he/she is not using a top quality sharpening stone.

The funny thing is I have found I can sometimes freehand a better edge on a knife and quicker too with coarse DMT diamond hones than with an edge pro apex alone. Of course I can finish to fine edge with the apex. Maybe it's my skill but I think it's only because the diamonds cut the harder steel better.

I have never sharpened CPM S110V but if I find D2 and BG-41 difficult to do a tiny re-profile on as well as get shaving sharp, I can only imagine how hard CPM S110v would be. Are there any types of exercises one can do to improve their angle holding ability when sharpening. I ask because you seem to be quite fond of putting keen edges on your blades.


I could never get my Ontario RAT (RC-3 knockoff) D2 razor sharp. I bought this one before the RAT cutlery (now ESEE cutlery) Ontario cutlery wars by the way.
 
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The exercise that I finally had to do was called getting a DMT Aligner kit. I bought a Queen Congress with 4, count them 4, D2 blades that all came dull as butter knives. I started out to convex them, but gave up and bought the diamonds. Now, it's all I use because I can whittle hair without even thinking about it.
 
greater said:
Yes that is probably true but only if you are vigilant in maintaining an edge and have good sharpening skills. If for some reason or another one is unable to sharpen it and the knife gets very dull they are going to spend quite a bit of time bringing back the edge.

This is even worse if the person does not have a lot of sharpening experience and he/she is not using a top quality sharpening stone.

The funny thing is I have found I can sometimes freehand a better edge on a knife and quicker too with coarse DMT diamond hones than with an edge pro apex alone. Of course I can finish to fine edge with the apex. Maybe it's my skill but I think it's only because the diamonds cut the harder steel better.

I have never sharpened CPM S110V but if I find D2 and BG-41 difficult to do a tiny re-profile on as well as get shaving sharp, I can only imagine how hard CPM S110v would be. Are there any types of exercises one can do to improve their angle holding ability when sharpening. I ask because you seem to be quite fond of putting keen edges on your blades.


I could never get my Ontario RAT (RC-3 knockoff) D2 razor sharp. I bought this one before the RAT cutlery (now ESEE cutlery) Ontario cutlery wars by the way.
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I think it make sense to learn how to sharpen and get some tools which are not really expensive, then limit you scope of steels, because of this. After all this trouble with sharpening is not steel to blame and in many cases are result of absence of skills, so one who do not know how to sharpen may have troubles with any steel not only top.

To learn to sharpen you need a day or two or three and then pick any steel you want, because there is no steel which hard to sharpen if you know how.

Even CPM S110V is not hard to sharpen, but hard to sharpen to be able to whittle hair because Nb carbides seems to be harder then Cr oxides from polishing paste, but it still very very sharp and can chop free hanging hair and of course shave arm - be scare sharp hair popping sharp - whatever-sharp...

And it is only high vanadium abrasive resistant steels (which seems to be dead end for cuttlery applications in edge holding and already hit the limit on CPM S90V/CPM 10V) are may be bit harder to sharpen - other types of steel high carbon stainless like ZDP-189 and CTS-XHP are as easy as good carbon steels like 1095 and holds edge as good or even better.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
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