Start with blanks or jump into forging?

J

J.E.Hixon

Joined
Jun 24, 2016
Messages
15
Hi everyone, I am pretty new to the forum. I have read and learned a ton from the posts here already. Also there are some members here with incredible skill in making knives, the pictures of knives made by you guys make me envious of their owners!

Here is my question and a bit about what I have: Should I start with blanks and start grinding to start with, or jump onto the forge and start learning to shape my knives?

This is a loaded question I do realize, as there are some knife makers that create amazing work and never shape with a forge. But forging is what really sparked my interest to start with and it is something I have already had a small taste of. My father in law had an old coal forge and anvil laying around that he gave me. Without any knowledge of anything, I pounded out a couple RR spikes into something resembling a knife and ground them with an angle grinder. They are rough and crude, but it was a lot of fun. Now, after months of research, I realize that the forging part is a relatively small part of making a knife. I can have blanks cut from any material with a water jet relatively cheaply (connections through work.) Not going to lie, I have the knife itch real bad and want to make something that is actually functional.

My equipment is very limited:
Cheap 4"x36" belt sander (not the best thing for grinding knives I know, but it is all I have.) 2"x72" Is the goal, but just not feasible for now.
angle grinder
Bench grinder
Vice mounted to heavy fabrication table.

Sorry for the excessively long post to ask a question. :D
 
Start with stock removal. That's what I did. You can make really nice knives with really high end steel. All you need is a belt grinder, angle grinder, vise, lots of belts, and send your blades off for heat treating (or HT yourself if you can). I have made over 10 knives now, which are starting to look pretty nice. I have since made a legit belt sander, but I did the first ten with just a Harbor Freight 1x30 sander. Get GOOD belts.
 
Hi JE,
I am also a newbie. I love the forging so that is what I do on every knife. If you want to make really good knives, do what the pros do, buy some good steel and do stock removal. Heat treat isn't guessing and the final result will be as good as you can do. I also have the 4x36 grinder and it can work ok. Shim up the belt with something the exact width of the belt 1/4" or so. Really helps getting the plunge lines to look good. Have fun!!
 
If you want to make the prettiest looking knife the fastest, you're best chance is probably going to be stock removal. That said, both disciplines lend themselves well to the other in certain regards, so why not learn a little bit of both to start, and see what you enjoy?
 
It's an interesting problem. I built a forge before I had a grinder, because it was the hot work that really appealed to me. Then I finally got a decent grinder. And then I started to get more into sharpening.

Now, after 4 years, I think I did the whole thing completely backwards. A more proper education probably would have been to get some good knives, use them, study what's good about them, and learn to sharpen well. Then, with a better understanding of knives, start to grind. And then, finally, start to learn to forge. The problem is, since forging is always what has appealed to me most about the craft, I'm not sure I would have stuck with it until now if I had done it that way.
 
Think long and hard if you want to be a blacksmith.

That will answer your question.
 
AVigil said:
Think long and hard if you want to be a blacksmith.

That will answer your question.
Click to expand...

Unless, like me, knives (and some tooling) are the only things he's interested in forging! : )

It's hard to explain - forging is my favorite part of knife making, but I have zero interest in architectural or ornamental blacksmithing.


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I got a forge because I was advised to learn to heat treat on my own (carbon steels).
I also enjoy the forging aspect, have no desire to be a blacksmith, too difficult :-)
 
The forgeing interests you, keep doing that!
you already have a forge and anvil, get some knife steel.
 
HSC /// said:
I got a forge because I was advised to learn to heat treat on my own (carbon steels).
I also enjoy the forging aspect, have no desire to be a blacksmith, too difficult :-)
Click to expand...

To late, if you are forging knives you are blacksmithing.

You may not be proficient in all areas of smithing, but you are smithing when you forge a blade.
 
AVigil said:
To late, if you are forging knives you are blacksmithing.

You may not be proficient in all areas of smithing, but you are smithing when you forge a blade.
Click to expand...

Gotcha. I guess I sort of draw a distinction between blacksmithing and bladesmithing, which, to me anyway, are distinct things, but with a lot of overlap.


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You need to learn the skills of blacksmithing first before you can be a bladesmith.
 
AVigil said:
You need to learn the skills of blacksmithing first before you can be a bladesmith.
Click to expand...

Yeah, definitely the basics. But you could be an advanced bladesmith and still be weak in a large number of blacksmithing skills (joinery, chasing, raising, etc. are fundamental for a blacksmith's work, but not needed in bladesmithing). Anyway, that's why I draw the distinction, not that it really matters.

So for the OP, I'm just saying, you can certainly start with bladesmithing if that's what draws you to the craft, but you'll probably have a much faster learning curve if you start with grinding. I would highly recommend taking some classes. And, if you do want to forge, take an intro blacksmithing class before you take an intro to bladesmithing. The New England School of Metalwork is great for both.


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Even the most skilled bladesmith still takes his forged blades to the grinder to make them into knives. The better his grinding skills, the better his knives look. I recommend learning to make knives by filing or grinding first, and then specializing in forging once those basics are mastered. If you plan to forge, learn the metallurgy of bladesmithing, as it greatly controls the final quality of the knife.
 
Thank you all for the great input! The more I think about it, I am not sure I can totally put the forge away. But It seems pretty universal that learning to grind is the biggest thing. I think I will get a few blanks cut out and make a couple of finished knives, and along the way tinker with YouTube videos and the forge.

Stacy- Yes there is so much to learn about metallurgy, My dad is a machinist, and has been for nearly 40 years, that leaves me with a great source of knowledge. He hasnt done much heat treating, has always done that out of house. So that being said, what is the easiest metal to get the right heat treat and temper on? 1095, 1085, something else altogether. My plan is to make a couple hunting knives, nothing fancy.

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1084 ... it is the eutectoid. Heat it to 1450-1550F and immediately quench in a fast oil ( canola will work).

1095 requires more control and a soak time.
 
Great- 1085 it is. Any good way to control temperature other than color? I will be using a propane forge.

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