Substituting other knifemaking tools with a dremel?

Dremels are not very useful for knifemaking. You CAN use them for all kinds of things but they really don't work well for most of them. The dremel is a tool of last resort. If there is no other tool that will do the job, then and only then is it an appropriate job for a dremel. Otherwise, use the right tool.


If you want to make knives on the cheap then get yourself a cheap drill press, a high tension hacksaw with bi-metal blades, a couple of good files, and some clamps to hold your work down. With just those simple tools there is literally NOTHING you can't make.
Last summer I made a framelock folder using only those tools and documented the whole process just to prove that it could be done. You can read the whole thread here: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/879116-Frame-lock-WIP-how-to

With thin stock like what is usually used for knives, surface grinders make stock PARALLEL and to a given thickness throughout, not necessarily straight. My magnetic chuck can pull a noticeably warped piece of 1/8" stock down flat only to have it spring back when I turn the magnet off.
 
Noctis3880 said:
...as I would assume that the dremel could do it much faster.
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That's simply not true. I speak from experience. A mill bastard file will remove steel as quickly as a Dremel-type tool, with far more control.

If your hands aren't steady, power tools will not help that, they will only make it easier to make bigger mistakes, faster.

To put it very bluntly, you are getting way ahead of your knowledge and your skills. Start small and simple.
 
I always find these types of discussions interesting. Someone comes on with an idea that others have tried, and asks for opinions. Opinions are offered. Some folks trying to be helpful say only positive things about how the idea might work. Others trying to be helpful relate their experience, having attempted the same thing. Still others trying to be helpful do their best to dissuade the person from doing what they know won't work.

As I watch the dynamic, I also pay attention to how the original poster responds. Some respond mainly to those that agree with them. Some argue with those that disagree with their idea. Some are polite, some aren't.

And, I pay attention to how I respond to the discussion. Sometimes I'm detached. Sometimes I get annoyed at the OP for disregarding the sound advice they asked for and were given. Sometimes I root for them because they are following a muse (however deranged the muse may seem).

In this particular case, I think it likely that the original poster was seeking validation more than advice, so I've become detached. I do, of course, have experience using a Dremel in knifemaking (e.g. my caduceus knife), but I don't get the sense that's what the OP is trying to accomplish. I also don't get the sense that the OP is even considering diamond burrs yet.

So I'll keep reading for a while. It will be interesting to see how this progresses.
 
If you are working with real thin steel (i.e. 1/16") I think a dremmel might work out well. One problem you will have is the dremmel has very little torque. In trying to cut thicker pieces of metal it will bind up easily. I have used a dremmel for grinding the inside curves on a knife but they are a little crude and need to be finished with something else. You won't save any time over other tools on thicker steel. A 1x30 belt sander works much better on shaping the knife and handle and costs about the same as a dremmel.
 
tryppyr said:
I always find these types of discussions interesting. Someone comes on with an idea that others have tried, and asks for opinions. Opinions are offered. Some folks trying to be helpful say only positive things about how the idea might work. Others trying to be helpful relate their experience, having attempted the same thing. Still others trying to be helpful do their best to dissuade the person from doing what they know won't work.

As I watch the dynamic, I also pay attention to how the original poster responds. Some respond mainly to those that agree with them. Some argue with those that disagree with their idea. Some are polite, some aren't.

And, I pay attention to how I respond to the discussion. Sometimes I'm detached. Sometimes I get annoyed at the OP for disregarding the sound advice they asked for and were given. Sometimes I root for them because they are following a muse (however deranged the muse may seem).

In this particular case, I think it likely that the original poster was seeking validation more than advice, so I've become detached. I do, of course, have experience using a Dremel in knifemaking (e.g. my caduceus knife), but I don't get the sense that's what the OP is trying to accomplish. I also don't get the sense that the OP is even considering diamond burrs yet.

So I'll keep reading for a while. It will be interesting to see how this progresses.
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Hmm, probably what I was doing as the dremel appealed to me for convenience. Yet a knife has yet to replace prybars so I don't necessarily feel a dremel will replace dedicated tools.

Though that type of behavior is probably one of the motions a lot of people go through on these boards to justify or encourage a new knife purchase, so you'd have to blame the entire forums for that habit:D.

Now with the drill press, what type of bit would I use to drill holes in the handles? I found a 1/2" carbide bit, but I'm not sure the $120 price tag for the single bit would be the most cost efficient for the task.
 
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Noctis3880 said:
Now with the drill press, what type of bit would I use to drill holes in the handles? I found a 1/2" carbide bit, but I'm not sure the $120 price tag for the single bit would be the most cost efficient for the task.
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So long as you control the speed of the drill effectively, you don't NEED carbide bits. They do last longer and are more reliable, but I got along fine with high speed steel bits (albeit burning up a few before figuring out I needed to slow the drill down).

In my case, the Companion brand table top drill press I'm using cost me $30 at a sidewalk sale at Sears a couple of years ago. The drill bits have come from a number of places, but until last year I hadn't bought any carbide bits at all... just standard HSS stuff from Home Depot and Harbor Freight for about $3 - $5 per bit on average.

The Dewalt high tension hacksaw from Home Depot was about $30. I don't remember what I paid for my vises, but frankly I couldn't make a blade without them. Even small vises that attach to a work surface using clamps is better than nothing, and those are relatively inexpensive.

The Dremel I use is one of the later models that has the Flex Shaft attachment, and I use it that way exclusively. It cost about $130, if memory serves, and I feel I get my money's worth... bit I almost exclusively use them with various diamond burrs I bought at Harbor Freight. Mostly I use them to convert a series of three or four small round holes into a single rectangular slot (used to put guards and bolsters on hidden tang knives). I got the set of 50 burrs for $20 (less 20% with the coupon) at HF.

If portability of the tools is really your main problem, you should consider a rolling tool chest, which doubles as a movable work surface as well. They can be had pretty inexpensively if you shop around, and they allow you to have the right tools on hand (instead of trying to find the most portable tools, which don't really work well for the task at hand). Most of the rolling chests include a large space at the bottom suitable for storing bigger things like a real drill.
 
Hand files, a range of abrasive cloth/papers from 60 grit - 12000grit (mirror polishing) an angle grinder and a drill press. Get the ultra thin cutting disks <1mm thick to rough cut out your shapes, drill press to do straight pins and hand files for bevels and finishing. You could get adecent drill press and angle grinder for the cost of your Dremel and is much better suited to the job.

EDIT: Cobalt bits will drill most stuff that's annealed or up to about 55hrc. We have a good source of cheap Carbide bits, they are called masonary bits over here. They work really well on hardened steel (actually probably a little bit better than the proprietary (expensive) drill bit.
 
Dremels are not made for this kind of work and burn up quicklyStart with a drillpress, a hacksaw and a belt sander/grinder, if you want a handheld grinder get a flexshaft machine with a footpedal. Harbor freight has a junky one that will get you started cheaply, Foredom makes the best ones, and I have a Foredom unit I have used for 25 years and with minor maintenance it is still good

-Page
 
I've got a buffer and a crappy Craftsman angle grinder already(no cutting wheels). Is it recommended to use the grinding wheels on the buffer? It doesn't have any guards, and I find myself wondering if having the wheel shatter to pieces is a likely occurrence. I also figure maybe 8" wheels would get me close to a FFG and I could use the Worksharp after heat treat to make both sides meet at an apex.
 
tryppyr said:
So long as you control the speed of the drill effectively, you don't NEED carbide bits. They do last longer and are more reliable, but I got along fine with high speed steel bits (albeit burning up a few before figuring out I needed to slow the drill down).

In my case, the Companion brand table top drill press I'm using cost me $30 at a sidewalk sale at Sears a couple of years ago. The drill bits have come from a number of places, but until last year I hadn't bought any carbide bits at all... just standard HSS stuff from Home Depot and Harbor Freight for about $3 - $5 per bit on average.

The Dewalt high tension hacksaw from Home Depot was about $30. I don't remember what I paid for my vises, but frankly I couldn't make a blade without them. Even small vises that attach to a work surface using clamps is better than nothing, and those are relatively inexpensive.

The Dremel I use is one of the later models that has the Flex Shaft attachment, and I use it that way exclusively. It cost about $130, if memory serves, and I feel I get my money's worth... bit I almost exclusively use them with various diamond burrs I bought at Harbor Freight. Mostly I use them to convert a series of three or four small round holes into a single rectangular slot (used to put guards and bolsters on hidden tang knives). I got the set of 50 burrs for $20 (less 20% with the coupon) at HF.

If portability of the tools is really your main problem, you should consider a rolling tool chest, which doubles as a movable work surface as well. They can be had pretty inexpensively if you shop around, and they allow you to have the right tools on hand (instead of trying to find the most portable tools, which don't really work well for the task at hand). Most of the rolling chests include a large space at the bottom suitable for storing bigger things like a real drill.
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I'm trying to keep away from Sears and Harbor Freight. Sears because they overcharge a lot and their tools are crappy, and Harbor Freight because a lot of reviews of their cheaper belt sanders weren't good.

Could you lock the rolling tool chest in place? It wouldn't do me well to try and saw something that rolls around:D. Also would be nice if there's space to stick a padlock on there, which would let me keep it outside rather than lugging it back in the house, as the back door is slightly elevated from the ground and I would have to lift it in and out.
 
They do have wheel locks, and you can put a padlock on it. Almost all include a bar that blocks the drawers from opening until you remove the padlock.

I wouldn't mount the vise to he tool cart... I'd mount it on something stationary (and higher than the work surface of the tool cart).

Where you get your tools is your business. I wouldn't rule out any source without checking them out first. Pretty much EVERYONE'S stuff is coming from China these days. My HF 1x30 sander has held up quite well so far, as has my $30 drill press from Sears. They aren't ideal tools by any stretch, but they work.

And as an aside. a buffer-cum-bench grinder won't be useful in grinding bevels. It's primary use will be in profiling.
 
All of my first knives were profiled with a Dremel tool- about 20 blanks. Most were contoured and buffed with the dremel as well. It can be done, it teaches a lot about patience, and is acceptable if you already have a Dremel. It is by far not ideal, and a drill press is needed, but if all you are looking for is some way to constructively kill some time go ahead. I spent 6 hours total drilling out the profile of an integral hatchet out of 1/4" O1, a big waste of time but it can be done and at least now I have the blank ready. A few essentials in my mind: Drill Press, Vice, High tension hacksaw, Dremel, files. Stocking up the Dremel can be pricy- watch for sales! I've found that for my uses the cheapest cutoff disks were the best value. Face shield and goggles, dust mask and I don't worry about the discs shattering- they will, might sting a bit, then you replace it and move on. Many of the designs I tried first would not fit well into a 2" piece of steel so I bought 6X36" slabs. Due to this I wanted to save as much material as I could so the Dremel was able to get into tight curves so I could put as many designs in there as I could. Much less metal waste than I have had with the drill and hacksaw method, and gives a much nicer finish to the cut ends.

These were all primarily done with a Dremel tool and 4X36" Sander to bevel/blade finish other than hand tools. They won't compete for ABS awards, but they were fun to finish while recovering from broken legs, and they started the fire for the future- if I was willing to put in the time with crappy tools and still have fun I am willing to do so my whole life if need be. Plus they all cut!
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I think it is easy to look at what the professionals do, what they have and think that we need the same in order to make knives. If you want to be a full time professional maker then perhaps, but to have fun while contributing to the history of knifemaking then all we have to do is put an edge on a suitable piece of steel. How we do it is limited by imagination, funds and life! But there are ways to do it if we want to, have fun at it, and perhaps get better with time. It shouldn't cost as much as some say to light the fire so to speak. Try and make a knife any way you can (without ignoring sound advice like start with quality known steel), and see if you like it before spending dollars needlessly on something that may never again be used in the next 20 years.

Over the last year I've come to grips with the fact that it will be a while before I can make knives with any regularity again, and as a result of that it will take a while before I can upgrade from my 4x36" grinder, craftsman drill press and Dremel tool and hand tools. I'm okay with that, I've collected what I have piece by piece, I've learned little by little, and after a lifetime of knifemaking/modifying/dreaming I may or may not have a fully developed shop- but I will keep making. After making my first couple of batches I started to stress myself out that I wasn't good enough that I needed the tools, that I had to........... Then I realized that all I had to do was relax and have fun. I'm not an ABS mastersmith, so why hold myself to it. I am discovering my style, what I like and dislike, and enjoying the ride. Now I can look at my own work and appreciate it, but not have it compete with the masterpieces I see here, and be content. I see room for improvement and and much more importantly time for it as well.

Hope I wasn't detracting from the thread too much. Yes, you can substitute a Dremel, it isn't ideal or maybe even smart in some cases, but it can be done.
 
Okay, I think I'll hold on the Dremel until I need to engrave something:D, and for nothing else.

This will just be a side hobby. I figure since a $1000 custom made knife never scratched my knife itch, I might as well see if I can try making some knives for the price of a Large Sebenza. I already have too many(CRK and knives in general).

Also, what do I do if the piece comes warped? Chuck from Alpha Knife Supply says it's a common occurrence, though I don't have a surface grinder to grind it straight, and last I checked, they don't come cheap. I've had a piece of M390 surface ground for the custom, though it did cost $50 after shipping.
 
Had a field day at Lowe's:
-Skil 10" Drill Press
-1/4" and 7/16" Cobalt drill bits
-Cutting fluid
-Nicholson bastard, half round, and rod files.
-Dewalt high tension hacksaw with 10 bi-metal replacement blades.
-Vicegrip

Now I just need drawing supplies, the steel, and a wood workbench to mount the vicegrip on, which surprisingly both Lowes and Home Depot didn't have, so I'm not too sure where to get that.
 
Noctis3880 said:
Now I just need drawing supplies, the steel, and a wood workbench to mount the vicegrip on, which surprisingly both Lowes and Home Depot didn't have, so I'm not too sure where to get that.
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My Home depots have wood and they will do the cutting for you if you go in with a list and a plan.

I believe you can build a better bench than you can buy anywhere.


There are free plans here, all 2x4" plywood and screws.
 
Noctis3880 said:
Now I just need drawing supplies, the steel, and a wood workbench to mount the vicegrip on, which surprisingly both Lowes and Home Depot didn't have, so I'm not too sure where to get that.
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I'll be happy to send you a piece of Aldo's 1084 and a block of stabilized wood to get you started. Just PM or e-mail me your shipping address if interested.

- Greg
 
Knife makers seem to be a very ingenuitive lot, and I've seen quite a few make some fantastic pieces with EXTREMELY limited space and tools. You're only limited by imagination and ambition.

A buddy of mine makes his knives in something like an 8x10 tool shed in his back yard. As you can imagine, he can really only fit only the most basic tools in there (along with a couple bicycles, his mower, and whatever other odds and ends he's forced to store in there).

I've seen guys set up a little "shop area" on the small fire excape/balcony area of their apartment, as well as areas like a bedroom or kitchen table, or like in your case, a small courtyard/backyard.

Then there are some who have friends that are kind enough to lend the use of their own shop space and tools....

Where there's a will, there's a way. You'll figure something out that suits you.
 
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