yeah, I kinda just had it propped like that for the picture. I have it in a pair of vice clamps and that's how it set down. I've been trying really hard to get it even before quenching. I'm not really sure how good of a job I do. What is the result from over heating and then quenching? Super hard steel?
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Sunday project. Fathers day knife
- Thread starter syvmn
- Start date
Something a bit odd happened with the HT. I'm not sure if this is normal but I really don't remember seeing it in the last few that I did. A bunch of little "flakes" came off the knife when I dipped it into the canola oil and when I started polishing up the knife after tempering some more of the little "flakes" were still on the knife and chipped off as I rubbed 400 grit oven it. I'm not sure if this is just scale from the HT process or what. here are pictures of the one side that I went at for about 5 minutes with 400 grit and the other side that I haven't touched yet. You can see the pieces of "flake" that I'm talking about near the bevel/spine.
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- Dec 25, 2004
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Overheating is not a good thing for steel. Mostly grain growth thus brittleness happens. I may be wrong about your process as I didn't try that method, I would recommend to make a basic single - or more brick forge for future HT's. without the direct flame contact with steel you will have much more evenness in an insulated environment. I did some HT on my propane forge before, the blade is in a black iron pipe, it really does the trick...
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No way i did mean that. I had no intention to discourage you instead i think you did great. I have no way to understand how your HT has been without a close inspection. All I meant that a more even heat setup will be very beneficial for your operations.
Your blade is very well made, grinds are high and even, profile, design is very good. I only think if you do that good in shaping job a good HT equipment will be a good addition to your shop as it will determine the performance of your knife. You may understand if you have screwed the HT if you make a temporary edge and sharpen it. Test the edge with brass rod test. If it chips at some places on the edge the tempering temp may be too low try to temper it again about 400 F, after you test the edge again. Even after the second tempering the edge chips and crumbles again grain growth might be the most possible reason. You may eliminate the grain growth by successive normalizing steps. You might want to read all threads on this issue by Mr. Kevin Cashen...
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I don't know that this one is lost at all. You can easily re-set grain size with a good stress relieving and a few normalization cycles (non-magnetic with a cool back to black heat). Try and lower your temperature high-point each time you normalize to refine grains with the last cycle cooling all the way to room temperature. From there you can re heat-treat.
That being said, it's hard to say without seeing it in person if you overheated it. A brief second or two of overheating shouldn't cause too much grain growth (though it can happen very quickly once it starts). If you kept the blade for the most part evenly heated, you will probably be ok. The flakes are completely normal. Most will flake off as you agitate in the quench, the rest pretty much wipes off.
--nathan
That being said, it's hard to say without seeing it in person if you overheated it. A brief second or two of overheating shouldn't cause too much grain growth (though it can happen very quickly once it starts). If you kept the blade for the most part evenly heated, you will probably be ok. The flakes are completely normal. Most will flake off as you agitate in the quench, the rest pretty much wipes off.
--nathan
Yeah most of it flaked into the canola oil. I was just surprised. I think I will try and make a 2 brick forge to use from this point on.
My method for heat treating is to get the color across the blade as even as possible, test with a magnet and keep heating until the magnet doesn't stick to the blade, then I keep it out of the flame until the magnet reattaches, heat some more till it doesn't, pull it out till it does, put it back in the flame till it doesn't and then right into the oil. I do it in and out of the flame a few times just so I have a good feel for where the non-magnetic point is, and when I am comfortable with the non-magnetic-ness that it is at I plunge into the canola oil. If I was above temp it should have been too much.
I sanded the blade and back portion of the tang down to 400 and wrapped and then roughed up the tang with 150 grit and grinded a hollow area in each side for the JB weld to grab.
My method for heat treating is to get the color across the blade as even as possible, test with a magnet and keep heating until the magnet doesn't stick to the blade, then I keep it out of the flame until the magnet reattaches, heat some more till it doesn't, pull it out till it does, put it back in the flame till it doesn't and then right into the oil. I do it in and out of the flame a few times just so I have a good feel for where the non-magnetic point is, and when I am comfortable with the non-magnetic-ness that it is at I plunge into the canola oil. If I was above temp it should have been too much.
I sanded the blade and back portion of the tang down to 400 and wrapped and then roughed up the tang with 150 grit and grinded a hollow area in each side for the JB weld to grab.
Got my holes drilled in one side of the scales. I have to run but hopefully I have both scales drilled tonight for shaping later tonight or tomorrow. Man I'm getting down to the wire on this.
Does anyone know of a good sheath maker that would make me a simple leather sheath quickly if I ship them my knife. Again, not looking for anything fancy at all, just something to hold the knife and be functional. Thanks!
Does anyone know of a good sheath maker that would make me a simple leather sheath quickly if I ship them my knife. Again, not looking for anything fancy at all, just something to hold the knife and be functional. Thanks!
Looking good so far, keep the pics coming.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=651083&page=3
......and you turned ken down....
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=651083&page=3
......and you turned ken down....
GAH! I wish I could so incredibly much you don't even know. I just don't know where to begin with bolsters. I wish I could take him up on his offer for a knife in the future but I realize it was just for a fathers day gift. I think once I figure out how to make a bolster I'll call him up and PAY him for his art.
Got the scales mostly finished today, they are clamped to the knife and should be ready for finishing up tomorrow once things set up. I decided not to do the cross out of the pins after all. I messed up one set of scales trying to get the holes in the right places and decided just to go with the four pins. Next time when I have more time to screw around I'll try out some more fancy stuff.
Scales set overnight and I came home today from work and messed around with them for an hour or so. After sanding down to 1000grit I threw some tung oil on them.
I think this turned out really well. I wish I could have made the cross pattern in the scales but I think that is going to have to wait for next time when I can get a few tools to do it right. There are definitely some things I can fix the next time around but for now I am quite happy.
Next is to figure out how to sharpen it correctly and then try out making a sheath. I found out that the lady I live with used to do leather working and so she has some stuff lying around. We shall see how that turns out.
I think this turned out really well. I wish I could have made the cross pattern in the scales but I think that is going to have to wait for next time when I can get a few tools to do it right. There are definitely some things I can fix the next time around but for now I am quite happy.
Next is to figure out how to sharpen it correctly and then try out making a sheath. I found out that the lady I live with used to do leather working and so she has some stuff lying around. We shall see how that turns out.
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I think you just nailed it ... Great gift knife for sure. It would be complete with a sheath..
One thing I comment on, tang sides need to be sanded down. It wont take too much time but it will increase the value regardless of the minimal work. Sorry for my complaints
all I think that you have a great talent and you can do better already if you spend a little more time on this. With the scratches at the tang the knife doesnt show itsself..
Keep up the good work and most of the time dont wait the next project to improve the work, mostly it is possible to finish a knife better than it is now and it doesnt require much time or investment but just a little more patience
One thing I comment on, tang sides need to be sanded down. It wont take too much time but it will increase the value regardless of the minimal work. Sorry for my complaints
all I think that you have a great talent and you can do better already if you spend a little more time on this. With the scratches at the tang the knife doesnt show itsself..
Keep up the good work and most of the time dont wait the next project to improve the work, mostly it is possible to finish a knife better than it is now and it doesnt require much time or investment but just a little more patience
No no, I want you guys to criticize me as much as possible. I knew I should have spent more time getting the scratches out of the tang I just got excited I guess. My problem at the moment is that my sandpaper for my 1x30 goes 80,120,400. Its difficult going from 120 up to 400 especially when the 400 gets gummed up with the micarta. I know its just excuses though. Maybe I will go back and clean it up a bit.
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I really like that knife. It looks good but, it could look better if you just spend a little more time hand sanding to get all the scratches out. I know the feeling of just wanting it done but, you'll be much happier if you take the time to clean it up. Hope you don't take that the wrong way.. You did a great job and I enjoyed following your progress.
Well just to let everyone know I finished the knife up a bit more hand sanding and then worked on a sheath. I started out with leather but had a really had time. I think the leather I was using was really old and when I put it in water one edge of it just dissolved away and shrank up ruining the sheath. I got stuff for a kydex one and just went with it. I think it looks pretty decent even though it took me a full 12" x 12" piece to figure out what the crap I was doing... ;o)
I hope all of you enjoyed watching me fumble through my first knife. I want to really thank those of you that helped me out through this. I honestly feel like this was a team effort and not something I just did on my own. I look forward to working on some more knives in the future.
Thanks again!
I hope all of you enjoyed watching me fumble through my first knife. I want to really thank those of you that helped me out through this. I honestly feel like this was a team effort and not something I just did on my own. I look forward to working on some more knives in the future.
Thanks again!