Tell me about Damasteel...

[Steven65]

What is the performance like among the lower end types? Stuff like you see used by Kershaw and Boker.

If it is heat treated to the correct spec (and there is no reason to believe it is not) it should be every bit as good as the most expensive custom.

 

[Larrin]

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Kershaw in Damasteel, though I don’t pay attention to every single product in their line.

 

[dirc]

Kershaw usually uses Alabama Damascus - not damasteel... it is nice stuff (with nice component steels) also, not as 'picture perfect' as damasteel

 

[HSC ///]

I just made my first Damasteel blade. I like it and I'm not a big fan of stainless.
It processes well in HT and grinding. A mirror polish is suggested to get the best etch contrast.
Then a muriatic acid etch brings it out. It is pricey as a material. It takes a nice edge and as mentioned seems to be an excellent slicer.

 

[Mikael W]

Damasteel takes a keen edge and hold it for a long time.
It's expensive but of very high quality and stainless.
The cutting edge benefits from being polished and the targeted HRC is around 60-61.
Knifemakers Kaj Embretsen and Pär Björkman has been involved in the development of Damasteel.
Embretsen does incredible folders more in the Artknife discipline, while Björkman offer blades for custom makers.

I have one with a Björkmanblade that was a 50th anniversary gift from my family.
It has my name on it in nickelsilver, hammered into the handlespacers of birchbark.


Regards
Mikael

 

[Mo2]

At 64-65hrc it can perform extremely well. Otherwise it's very similar to RWL34 in performance.

As for how it's made, I assume they just take two blanks of different powdered steel and forge them together in various ways like they show in the damasteel vids they have on social media. The two steels have a similar profile for ht, so it comes out perfectly fine. Correct me if I'm wrong here.

Its no that easy apparently...

As far as composite products consisting of two or more stainless steels having different chemical compositions are concerned, the possibility to use forge welding, however, is limited because it from technical reasons is difficult to bound stainless steels of different types together through forge welding, for example martensitic and austenitic stainless steels.

Method relating to the manufacturing of a composite metal product comprising at least two stainless steel materials having different chemical compositions, which are bonded to each other through compaction treatment at a pressure exceeding 600 bar and a temperature exceeding 1000° C., at least one of said at least two stainless steel materials prior to said compaction consisting of a powder, wherein said at least two stainless steel materials are arranged in a capsule, the air is evacuated from the capsule, and the capsule thereafter is closed and subjected to said compaction treatment for the achievement of a consolidated body, said at least two stainless steel materials being arranged alternatingly in a plurality of layers in said capsule prior to said compaction treatment, and wherein said at least two stainless steel materials include a first and a second stainless steel, which first and second stainless steels have different compositions, while one of the first and second stainless steels can be colored through etching substantially more than the other of the first and second stainless steels, and wherein said consolidated body is forged or hot rolled into a blank, further wherein said blank is formed into the shape of a strip, which is cut into two halves along its center line and that the cut strip is formed into wherein the edge is made of a material adjacent to the cutting line of the strip, said material consisting of a material from said homogeneous core of said first stainless steel material, which consists of a hardenable, martensitic, stainless steel.

They then continue on about the Hip processing of the steel, much like how powdered steel is made to begin with, but instead of just making one steel they are basically binding two steels using this process... In simplicity terms.

The patent Larrin posted is very interesting
https://patents.google.com/patent/US5815790

 

[Eli Chaps]

Damasteel has a patent on their process where you can read a little bit more: https://patents.google.com/patent/US5815790

Thanks Larrin! It's been a while since I checked into the patents. I think the one I read might have been a different one. It was pretty vague. I'll have to give this one a read.

 

[Kaizen1]

Hey now

 

[vanadium]

Damasteel has a patent on their process where you can read a little bit more: https://patents.google.com/patent/US5815790

I didn't scrutinize every word of this, but it reads like a patent covering any HIP of multiple layers of powder steel. Good grief.

 

[Larrin]

I didn't scrutinize every word of this, but it reads like a patent covering any HIP of multiple layers of powder steel. Good grief.

That’s patents for you.

 

[dirc]

thanks for the info on this thread btw... I've seen these before, and thought it wasn't real dama... it looked so clear and perfect on boundaries that I thought it was some kind of junk which used either paint or some other trick to produce such visuals

I still find it hard to believe it's legit - it just doesn't look real

 

[vanadium]

I still find it hard to believe it's legit - it just doesn't look real

People have different attitudes about what makes "real" damascus.

Technically all pattern-welded steel isn't "real" Damascus (with a capital D) steel, because the real thing (now more commonly known as "bulat" or "wootz" to differentiate it from today's stuff) was formed by dendritic processes inside the crucible, in a process that was effectively lost by the beginning of the 20th Century. Later pattern-welded steel was designed to imitate the old material in appearance only. The original stuff can be seen in middle eastern swords and daggers produced prior to the industrial revolution.

Likewise you can argue about A.J. Hubbard "precision engineered damascus" not being real because it was too precise, or David Thompson damascus not being real because it didn't involve any folding, or Devin Thomas damascus not being real because it's made with powders.

Personally I think that antique wootz and bulat steel, and modern steel with rich dendritic carbide formations of chatoyant appearance (Verhoeven, Pendray), and modern highly-engineered layered steels (Hubbard, Thompson, Thomas, Damasteel, others), and various fully-dense steel products made from fine alternating layers, all deserve to be called damascus at this point.

If you have any doubt that Damasteel is a pattern-welded combination of two different materials, just dip a piece in some acid.

 

[rogerxd45]

From what I understand, Damasteel is the user's version of damascus. RWL-34 and some other low carbon, high chromium powder steel turned... into more powder? And then that makes Damasteel? I don't entirely understand the process... but I've read it is VERY similar to CPM-154 in this form? I just aquired my first Damasteel folder (Reate J.A.C.K.) and I would like to learn. I don't actually plan on using it. I'm just curious. I've found a couple other threads, but they aren't super informative.

i have two reate damasteel knives a k1 and a k3 and you should absolutely use them, i carry mine all the time however since i got my g&g deadlock OTF ive been using that pretty much every day but some times im in the mood for a flipper and carry one of my reate which have some of the sharpest edges of all my knives. i dont know if its the steel that makes them so awesome or just the geometry reate used but both are crazy sharp and just need a stopping now and then to keep them that way.
ill try and post some pics later

 

[Sonnydaze]

When Dave Ferry from Horsewright posts his thoughts and great pics, it makes sense to pay attention...
that is...if you're interested in learning and perhaps owning a great knife from a VERY talented maker...
He never fails to impress me, and I have owned a few of his wonderful "creations" in steel and leather.
I am wearing a custom leather belt from him now...the only belt I ever wear.

 

[Horsewright]

When Dave Ferry from Horsewright posts his thoughts and great pics, it makes sense to pay attention...
that is...if you're interested in learning and perhaps owning a great knife from a VERY talented maker...
He never fails to impress me, and I have owned a few of his wonderful "creations" in steel and leather.
I am wearing a custom leather belt from him now...the only belt I ever wear.

Thank you sir! Glad that belt is working out. It's a cool one.

 

[ElementalBreakdown]

I have used Damasteel many times to make knives. I do not know how their steel is made but I can say that it makes excellent knives that excel at slicing. Sharpness is a relative thing and certainly hard to define but I think some of the sharpest "feeling" knives I have ever made are out of Damasteel or Devin Thomas's stainless damascus.

I can tell ya when ground and prior to etching, Damasteel looks just like this blade:

If ya squint hard enough and hold your head just right and the light is hitting it just right ya can make out the pattern. Damasteel, like other damascus when used in a knife has been etched. You simply won't see the pattern otherwise. The blade above in my pic, is not Damasteel, its a high carbon damascus but ya get the idea. In above, out of the ferric chloride below:

Like WValtakis states there often is no topography on Damasteel. This is true with other stainless damascus steels I've used as well. They simply etch differently than high carbon damascus. Even with high carbon you often will etch 2, 3 or more times to get topography and this can be done with stainless dammys as well.

Damasteel Sonoran Camp Knife:

Damasteel Poco:

Damasteel El Toros:

None of these had topography but all have certainly been etched.

Damasteel engraved Rodeo:

This one did have some topography.

Anyhoo, its spendy, but a great steel for making knives, very, very, sharp and slicey knives.

As far as a using steel, any quality damascus works there, so I'm not sure what is meant by that. The Rodeo above belongs to a working horseman and the others pictured above have hunted the world.

Regular plain jane high carbon damascus can and certainly does work. I've made and sold many, many knives to working cowboys made from high carbon damascus and these knives are used and used hard:

Some of the finest craftsmanship I've seen. The scrollwork is beautiful. El Toro scales also something unique!

 

[Horsewright]

Some of the finest craftsmanship I've seen. The scrollwork is beautiful. El Toro scales also something unique!

Thank you! Mostly playing with different steels these days.

 

[K.O.D.]

I've been meaning to pick up one of your knives Horsewright . I'm not much of a fixed blade guy, but they are so nice I need one anyway...

 

[ElementalBreakdown]

I hear that Niagara is going to run some more CPM-MagnaCut late summer or early fall. Any chance you would try it out? I would be happy to help find the best person to heat treat if you don't do that.
I wasn't keen on another fixed blade, but if you also build flippers then both the Rodeo and the El Torros have scales that go beyond just the materials. The Rodeo reminded me of an old growth pine forest, or without too much stretching of the imagination, crucifixes sitting on top of Golgotha.

Have you ever posted any threads or videos about learning how to do the scrollwork?