TGTBT Matthew Danitz Custom Bowie

Both of you guys seem pretty amicable in general, and also with each other. Perhaps there could have been a way to find some resolution without going through the claims process.
Anyway, it’s an interesting post that is educational, and gives us pause to think about how to choose the best knife for each particular task.
 
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We all have the right to change our mind and Matthew now does not believe my use of the knife was reasonable nor did his offer to remake it constitute giving his word. Each maker has their standards and now I know.
 
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stonesell said:
Both of you guys seem pretty amicable in general, and also with each other. Perhaps there could have been a way to find some resolution without going through the claims process.
Anyway, it’s an interesting post that is educational, and gives us pause to think about how to choose the best knife for each particular task.
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Agreed... neither of us are likely happy that we crossed paths but, as a 50 year old dude, I get disappointed more than angry. As he said before he changed his mind, "Always so many things to learn Ha Ha." :p
 
It’s interesting that Matthew’s first inclination was for you guys to work together in an agreeable fashion. Something must have spooked him. Perhaps time and money constraints, which cause a lot of people to go back on their word.
 
stonesell said:
It’s interesting that Matthew’s first inclination was for you guys to work together in an agreeable fashion. Something must have spooked him. Perhaps time and money constraints, which cause a lot of people to go back on their word.
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That is part of why I offered to pay for the materials and 1095 stock. That is why I paid for and sent him two sets of scales for the replacement. That is why I told him to keep the extra cocobolo scales and G10 for spacer stock after the first build. That is why I did not get upset when he broke the first Nicaraguan Cocobolo I sent him for scales. Just figured he was a young guy and I thought it was great to see a young smith grow in his work.
 
You seem like a very fair customer to me Jason, and I would’ve liked to see him take care of you. He chose not to......I have a feeling he lost out on this deal, as you might have done more business with him.
Shame. Absolutely nothing more important than customer service......he failed.
Joe

Jason Burns said:
That is part of why I offered to pay for the materials and 1095 stock. That is why I paid for and sent him two sets of scales for the replacement. That is why I told him to keep the extra cocobolo scales and G10 for spacer stock after the first build. That is why I did not get upset when he broke the first Nicaraguan Cocobolo I sent him for scales. Just figured he was a young guy and I thought it was great to see a young smith grow in his work.
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palonej said:
You seem like a very fair customer to me Jason, and I would’ve liked to see him take care of you. He chose not to......I have a feeling he lost out on this deal, as you might have done more business with him.
Shame. Absolutely nothing more important than customer service......he failed.
Joe
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Thanks, I gave him two extra days past when EBay allowed escalation to their decision in hopes he would make it right. Even sent an email directly to him this morning before I submitted it for final resolution in hopes he would decide to work out a resolution. Will just have to let EBay decide. Life goes on and, for now, I will go back to my BK9 :thumbsup:
(Or my chef's knife... it was pretty impressive! LOL)
 
In my opinion (I am not a metallurgist although I have studied metallurgy as an apprentice) that is a heat treat related failure. 1095 properly hardened and tempered should not blow out a chunk like that! My guess would be that since it was heat treated in a propane forge it went too high in temperature for the quench and that resulted in an internal stress crack. Tempering would not fix that.

Just my 2 cents. Hopefully one of the resident metallurgists will chime in here.
 
Just another example of a knifemaker/craftsman that doesn’t have a great social game plan, when dealing with clients.
 
Jason Burns said:
While I agree, I sure am thankful for EBay! They decided in under ten minutes once I asked for them to make the final decision!:thumbsup:
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If Matthew was willing to admit that his approach lacks vision, he could respond here and probably get some honest advice. Business has to move forward. Communication is critical. Those of us that have succeeded in various businesses, know that your best investment is to go the extra mile for your clients.
 
stonesell said:
If Matthew was willing to admit that his approach lacks vision, he could respond here and probably get some honest advice. Business has to move forward. Communication is critical. Those of us that have succeeded in various businesses, know that your best investment is to go the extra mile for your clients.
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Such a true statement. It's amazing how little it takes to make a good impression. It could be as cheap as offering to pay for the $15 shipping fee. I took my car to a local shop to put a catch can on my Jeep; which typically costs $75. It took them 15 minutes and didn't charge me anything. That stuck with me for 4 years and now that I'm rebuilding my engine, that's the shop I went to. It didn't hurt that they are highly respected and know what they're doing, but I remembered them.

About the knife, a quick search showed that he makes kitchen knives though I'm not sure what percentage of his knife making is dedicated to kitchen knives. Those knives being brittle might be fine in the kitchen. It's possible he is used to heat treating for that purpose and not the purpose of a Bowie. I consider a Bowie knife to be a jack of all trades for outdoor purposes. You have a nice sticker and slicer while also being large enough to do some chopping. The only time I consider a knife to be misused is when it's used as a pry bar and that is all.

If he made a Bowie for you, it should have been made to be used as a Bowie should be used. I've watched enough Forged in Fire episodes to know that when they are tasked to make a certain knife they make it with its intended purpose in mind and heat treat/forge accordingly.

This could have been a win-win situation for everyone involved but at least you got your refund.
 
I think 1095 steel has an embrittlement region in the 400F region.

Matt-D said:
My regards to Ralph aka "tombstone" for sending me a link to this thread. Here are some pictures that were not included in the threads post. It was approximately two weeks before I received any news of failure. The bowie was returned for further inspection upon which I came to my conclusion and issued this response.

"Hey Jason, I received the Bowie knife. After further review and upon inspection I have come to the conclusion that this blade failure was due to exceeding its intended and designed purpose through extreme testing and use. After much thought & review I believe that I made this blade correctly and to the best of my ability and that it would’ve performed its intended purpose without issue e.g cutting, slicing & puncturing. I believe that the heat treat and grain structure are of a more than acceptable quality for this piece. Therefore I cannot in good conscience make a free replacement blade for what I deem to be a failure that is due to misuse and unintended use. Also note that I did not build this piece to be a chopper but a Bowie and Bowie’s are not at large designed to be choppers nor was I informed upon building this knife that it would go through an extreme chopping test.
I am willing to return this blade to you at my own expense with the handle wood you sent me when it arrives.
Thank you.
Matthew"

I also did my own tests with the blade in the condition it was returned in. My response to the buyer

"Some tests: I did some chop tests with the blade that was returned in the condition that it was returned in. First I chopped a dried poplar log in two. Then I chopped some green saplings. I finished by chopping a piece of antler in half. There were no chips or breaks. From this information alone I can determine that the heat treat was fine for this knife's designed purpose. If the heat treat was truly off, the blade would have broken in half at the first instead of having a large chip break off. If after this case is closed you receive a refund then business will be ended between us. If after this case is closed you do not receive a refund then I will as stated in my original message return this knife to you at my own expense.
Thank you,
Matthew"

There is no Hamon by the edge. The blade was treated (by the buyer) with apple cider vinegar to help protect from rust. With use the finish wears off.

As for asking to complete the transaction outside of eBay, I declined. Since the contact and transaction had been started through eBay I wished to complete it through that venue.

My heat treat.
1. Normalize several times after forging to relieve stress and refine grain.
1st cycle, 4-5minutes , 1600° -1650° F
2nd cycle, 4-5minutes 1550° -1585° F
3rd cycle, 4-5minutes 1500° F
4th cycle, 4-5minutes 1475° -1500° F
5th cycle, 4-5minutes 1400° -1425° F
6th cycle, 2-3minutes 1200° -1350° F

2. Quench in oil after 4-5 minutes soak time at 1475-1500 degrees Fahrenheit

3. temper two cycles, one hour each at 400-425 degrees Fahrenheit letting it cool to room between cycles.

Heat treating was done in a propane forge. Included are some pictures of the grain.

tempering was done in an oven that was temperature checked.

Edge thickness - 0.15-0.2"

Pictures.

Pictures from buyer after receiving it
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After being returned - Inspection and grain
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My test
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Matt-D said:
My regards to Ralph aka "tombstone" for sending me a link to this thread. Here are some pictures that were not included in the threads post. It was approximately two weeks before I received any news of failure. The bowie was returned for further inspection upon which I came to my conclusion and issued this response.

"Hey Jason, I received the Bowie knife. After further review and upon inspection I have come to the conclusion that this blade failure was due to exceeding its intended and designed purpose through extreme testing and use. After much thought & review I believe that I made this blade correctly and to the best of my ability and that it would’ve performed its intended purpose without issue e.g cutting, slicing & puncturing. I believe that the heat treat and grain structure are of a more than acceptable quality for this piece. Therefore I cannot in good conscience make a free replacement blade for what I deem to be a failure that is due to misuse and unintended use. Also note that I did not build this piece to be a chopper but a Bowie and Bowie’s are not at large designed to be choppers nor was I informed upon building this knife that it would go through an extreme chopping test.
I am willing to return this blade to you at my own expense with the handle wood you sent me when it arrives.
Thank you.
Matthew"

I also did my own tests with the blade in the condition it was returned in. My response to the buyer

"Some tests: I did some chop tests with the blade that was returned in the condition that it was returned in. First I chopped a dried poplar log in two. Then I chopped some green saplings. I finished by chopping a piece of antler in half. There were no chips or breaks. From this information alone I can determine that the heat treat was fine for this knife's designed purpose. If the heat treat was truly off, the blade would have broken in half at the first instead of having a large chip break off. If after this case is closed you receive a refund then business will be ended between us. If after this case is closed you do not receive a refund then I will as stated in my original message return this knife to you at my own expense.
Thank you,
Matthew"

There is no Hamon by the edge. The blade was treated (by the buyer) with apple cider vinegar to help protect from rust. With use the finish wears off.

As for asking to complete the transaction outside of eBay, I declined. Since the contact and transaction had been started through eBay I wished to complete it through that venue.
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First, I would like to say that your bowie design is very nice. It looks typical of the Bowie camp knife style I like. These knives were meant for hard use in the outdoors, hence why carbon steel is usually used. I have owned plenty of customs with that design, and have not had one fail doing exactly what the pics show. None of the work is abuse for a 1/4" thick blade. My 3/16" thick ESEE Junglas has done 20 times that amount of work with only coating wear. There is no doubt from the circular divot that it was a catastrophic failure within the steel. When you advertise your knives, you may want to consider indicating that they are art work and not for hard use. Or maybe state that your 1/4" thick camp knives are not for chopping with.
 
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