The ABS....still suckin' after all these years...

BenR.T. said:
I'll bring the cookies.
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can we have this party in Colorado, Alaska, Oregon or Washington state? Might make things more interesting and open some minds :)
 
Kohai999 said:
Just really read my "American Bladesmith", the Journal of the ABS, Spring 2016, Issue 46.

Have been an Apprentice Smith for about 8 years....C. Houston Price(RIP, amigo!) drafted me.

Sfreddo "International Master" Knife of the Year on the cover....check/crack on the Ironwood handle, which is not even mentioned as a material in the description. Rodrigo's gift is in steel pattern welding mastery, but he is severely handicapped when it comes to material selection, as in I have handled 4 knives in the last 18 months that have had shrinkage around the tang. Buy what you like, but stop giving flaws in construction a "bye"....this is solely an example, as this was the cover knife.....as a person, I have great respect and affection for Rodrigo.

In 1986 or 1987, I attended my first New England Bladesmithing Guild Ashokan Conference(the last one will be held this year, e-mail me for information if you don't have it). Two of my classmates were Hugh Bartrugh and Larry Fuegen. Phil Baldwin, Gary Barnes, Dan Maragni and Wayne Valachovich all gave seminars. Everyone there learned an awful lot about the forged blade and diffusion bonded metals. The (prevailing at the time, as explained to me) ABS attitude of "keeping secrets and disseminating misinformation" was discussed at length, and my young brain just sucked it up.

I don't pretend to know everything about knives in general and certainly not about forged blades, but do love them at a very primal level. My teachers/sensei over the years have been Phil Baldwin, Don Fogg, Dan Maragni, J.D. Smith, Jerry Fisk and Larry Fuegen, in that order. My love and respect for Larry is without peer, he is a friend and a mentor.

MOST of the GREAT makers of forged blades that I know who are alive in the USA give credit to each other for knowledge and information FIRST...before crediting Bill Moran, B.R. Hughes or the American Bladesmithing Society. I thought that the ABS would, after Bill died, move on and allow individual makers to shine, but since B.R. seems to have a lock on all ABS published lore and legend, it hasn't happened. Is this to the benefit of the American forged blade as it exists as a movement or thought collective? Not to me.

As a deeply personal issue, the absolute silence of the ABS as an entity concerning the loss of shop and beloved dogs of ABS MS's Adam and Haley DesRosiers and subsequent lack of hue and cry when E.R. Russ Andrews lost his shop as well speaks volumes to me about how little the individual accomplishments of the contributing members is valued and appreciated, unless directly beneficial to the ABS as a body.

Show me how I am wrong, demonstrate in deed and writing my lack of information, and I'll gladly retract....but call for my destruction on principle or lambast the words as heresy at your own risk of intensely illuminated dissection.

Hope everyone has a great Blade Show, and heartfelt apologies for not attending.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
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STeven,

I don't get it either, it has been my belief the custom knife makers in this country were a family. Coincidentally the DesRosiers had appeared on Handcrafted In America, the show on cable TV.
Doing a great deal to open eyes to the quality of (and time involved in doing so) a hand made knife.

On your mentors, Larry is a true artist and one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet.

Thanks,

Zane
 
Kohai999 said:
...In 1986 or 1987, I attended my first New England Bladesmithing Guild Ashokan Conference(the last one will be held this year, e-mail me for information if you don't have it). ...
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Busy weekend, and even though I am still in the road home, something I heard this weekend prompted me to dig into my old passwords list and dust off the one for this forum. Indeed the New England Bladesmith Guild’s Ashokan seminar was founded to offer an alternative to other sources of information such as the ABS and we pride ourselves in this effort, and hope to offer the same for many years to come. So you can imagine my shock and surprise when I heard at the Blade show that this September was Ashokan’s final seminar. I couldn’t imagine where this idea could have came from but was then told of this discussion, so I felt compelled to log on to correct this notion.

For some strange reason, that I still do not comprehend, while I do hold a position on the board of directors of the ABS, I am also one of three organizers of Ashokan and I can assure you that no decision about the future of the seminar would be made without my knowledge. Since the ABS has many representatives to speak for it, I will leave that discussion to you good folks, but since I bear more responsibility with Ashokan I am compelled to clear up the mistaken notion that the seminar is anything but alive and well with plans to be back next year.

My primary goal has always been to bring the best, fact based information to bladesmithing, a craft that has suffered under so much misinformation for too long, and that is probably why I have managed to find a position of responsibility in two organizations so different in their approach while sharing the same purpose.

Steven, I know you have the same fondness for Ashokan that I do so please help me my friend in clearing up this misinformation so that we can both continue to enjoy this oldest of alternatives to the ABS format, and I will owe you a drink around a fire in the Catskills.
 
Thank goodness! I have yet to attend ashokan but I am really looking forward to it one of these years
 
Kevin R. Cashen said:
My primary goal has always been to bring the best, fact based information to bladesmithing, a craft that has suffered under so much misinformation for too long, and that is probably why I have managed to find a position of responsibility in two organizations so different in their approach while sharing the same purpose.

Steven, I know you have the same fondness for Ashokan that I do so please help me my friend in clearing up this misinformation so that we can both continue to enjoy this oldest of alternatives to the ABS format, and I will owe you a drink around a fire in the Catskills.
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Hi Kevin,

I was told that the facility had been sold and that the new owners were likely to cancel any bladesmithing activity onsite.

Will redact for now, thanks!

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
This is a tough subject. I was at one time an apprentice smith with the ABS. I wanted to prove that the chop and bend tests could be done using stainless and had done it a couple of times in my shop. The board at the time took offence, they thought I was trying to prove somebody wrong, I was just trying to prove that it could be done. I thought the group would embrace modern alloys and forging them. All steels made for cutlery are forged and rolled into usable sizes for makers and manufacturers of knives. After that the board changed the bi-laws to make very clear that stainless had no place in the ABS. I had things to contribute to the group, or so I thought. At the time I'm pretty sure that I'd forged more Damascus steel than the whole ABS put together.

On the positive, I remember custom knives struggling in the late 80's. The 90's brought a renewed interest in knives and steel because of the ABS and forging and Damascus steel. Along with the testing of knives came a great interest in heat treating, sharpening, and experimenting to see what does work best. The knife makers guild was busy fighting over what a hand made knife was and was not. The ABS will probably never have that problem. Hats off to the ABS.

There are many smiths in the ABS that I have a tremendous respect for their work. The group as a whole could do more to acknowledge some of the other pioneering smiths who we all have benefited from. Daryl Meier, Bill Fiorini, Don Fogg etc. All steels benefit from proper forging, not just carbon steels. The ABS should expand their thinking at some point.

Hoss
 
Thanks for sharing your experiences, Hoss.

DevinT said:
The ABS should expand their thinking at some point.
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I think this is probably at the crux of 90% of the criticisms leveled at the ABS in recent years. Let's hope the ABS leadership one day recognizes that there's a much bigger world outside of their sometimes insular way of thinking. While it's great to preserve the history of the forged blade (and not just the "Bill Moran" version, by the way), it's also important to lead and move the craft forward.

Those who only look backwards will invariably get left behind.
 
Kevin R. Cashen said:
Busy weekend, and even though I am still in the road home, something I heard this weekend prompted me to dig into my old passwords list and dust off the one for this forum. Indeed the New England Bladesmith Guild’s Ashokan seminar was founded to offer an alternative to other sources of information such as the ABS and we pride ourselves in this effort, and hope to offer the same for many years to come. So you can imagine my shock and surprise when I heard at the Blade show that this September was Ashokan’s final seminar. I couldn’t imagine where this idea could have came from but was then told of this discussion, so I felt compelled to log on to correct this notion.

For some strange reason, that I still do not comprehend, while I do hold a position on the board of directors of the ABS, I am also one of three organizers of Ashokan and I can assure you that no decision about the future of the seminar would be made without my knowledge. Since the ABS has many representatives to speak for it, I will leave that discussion to you good folks, but since I bear more responsibility with Ashokan I am compelled to clear up the mistaken notion that the seminar is anything but alive and well with plans to be back next year.

My primary goal has always been to bring the best, fact based information to bladesmithing, a craft that has suffered under so much misinformation for too long, and that is probably why I have managed to find a position of responsibility in two organizations so different in their approach while sharing the same purpose.

Steven, I know you have the same fondness for Ashokan that I do so please help me my friend in clearing up this misinformation so that we can both continue to enjoy this oldest of alternatives to the ABS format, and I will owe you a drink around a fire in the Catskills.
Click to expand...

I joined this forum today to help dispel this rumor that Kevin Cashen responded to above, that the New England Bladesmith Guild Ashokan Seminar is coming to an end. It is not surprising that some information may have leaked out that fueled that rumor, but I am writing to present some facts, history, and current status of the organization and our relationship with the Ashokan Center.

The first NEBG seminar was circa 1980, two years before I joined the Ashokan Field Campus staff. During those early years, the program was run by Kent Reeves, the Ashokan Director, and I was his "Hey Boy", setting up forges and equipment and making sure the demonstrators had what they needed. After Kent retired in 1988, I continued to coordinate the facility and registration part of the program as an Ashokan employee, while Dan Maragni designed and coordinated the program that has evolved into one of the most prestigious blade seminars in the country. With the help of Tim Zowada and Kevin Cashen, that fine program has continued to thrive and grow.

With a change of ownership in 2008, a change of staffing at Ashokan soon followed. When my position as director ended in 2011, several other key positions involved with running the NEBG seminar were also terminated. It was lean times for Ashokan, with the cost of building a new facility straining the budget and remaining staff. The future of the New England Bladesmith Guild knife seminar and the Northeast Blacksmiths Hammer-Ins seemed to be in jeopardy. At that time I chose to continue to run the programs as an Ashokan volunteer, and the groups agreed to pay me the small administrative fee that had been going to Ashokan. This has proved to work out quite well. It is a boat-load of work, but this gathering of a community of craftsmen that I have come to know over the past 30 years has come to be like an annual family reunion!

The only small glitch we had recently was coming to an understanding with the Ashokan Administration about the ownership of some of the tools and equipment both groups share and store in the Ashokan blacksmith shop. That has now been resolved to the satisfaction of all parties, and my relationship with the current Ashokan administration is positive and mutually supportive. The blacksmithing class that is part of the school programs Ashokan offers continues to be one of the most popular, with a surge of interest from the current forging shows on TV.

In conclusion, the Ashokan Center welcomes both the business and the prestige to be the home base of two of the best blacksmithing seminars in the country. It is my intention to continue to run the programs as "The Registration Guy" as long as Dan, Tim, and Kevin keep designing the programs.

Speaking of such, I just received the program schedule from Dan for the Ashokan Sword seminar scheduled for September 16-18. The invitation will be out, the group website updated, and registration open within the next two weeks. Stay tuned for updates on this forum as well!
 
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Good to know, Tim!

The information was presented to me by someone who is generally quite on top of the facts, and it didn't occur to me that it might be incorrect.

Wulf said:
Thanks for sharing your experiences, Hoss.

I think this is probably at the crux of 90% of the criticisms leveled at the ABS in recent years. Let's hope the ABS leadership one day recognizes that there's a much bigger world outside of their sometimes insular way of thinking. While it's great to preserve the history of the forged blade (and not just the "Bill Moran" version, by the way), it's also important to lead and move the craft forward.

Those who only look backwards will invariably get left behind.
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So well written, Derrick!

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Thanks Tim and Kevin - I was just about to post what little I knew from speaking with the owners at the Blacksmith's gathering at Ashokan in the Spring.
I love and look forward to this meeting each year. You all should come (as long as you don't take my spot in Registration).
 
Tim Neu said:
I joined this forum today to help dispel this rumor that Kevin Cashen responded to above, that the New England Bladesmith Guild Ashokan Seminar is coming to an end. It is not surprising that some information may have leaked out that fueled that rumor, but I am writing to present some facts, history, and current status of the organization and our relationship with the Ashokan Center.

The first NEBG seminar was circa 1980, two years before I joined the Ashokan Field Campus staff. During those early years, the program was run by Kent Reeves, the Ashokan Director, and I was his "Hey Boy", setting up forges and equipment and making sure the demonstrators had what they needed. After Kent retired in 1988, I continued to coordinate the facility and registration part of the program as an Ashokan employee, while Dan Maragni designed and coordinated the program that has evolved into one of the most prestigious blade seminars in the country. With the help of Tim Zowada and Kevin Cashen, that fine program has continued to thrive and grow.

With a change of ownership in 2008, a change of staffing at Ashokan soon followed. When my position as director ended in 2011, several other key positions involved with running the NEBG seminar were also terminated. It was lean times for Ashokan, with the cost of building a new facility straining the budget and remaining staff. The future of the New England Bladesmith Guild knife seminar and the Northeast Blacksmiths Hammer-Ins seemed to be in jeopardy. At that time I chose to continue to run the programs as an Ashokan volunteer, and the groups agreed to pay me the small administrative fee that had been going to Ashokan. This has proved to work out quite well. It is a boat-load of work, but this gathering of a community of craftsmen that I have come to know over the past 30 years has come to be like an annual family reunion!

The only small glitch we had recently was coming to an understanding with the Ashokan Administration about the ownership of some of the tools and equipment both groups share and store in the Ashokan blacksmith shop. That has now been resolved to the satisfaction of all parties, and my relationship with the current Ashokan administration is positive and mutually supportive. The blacksmithing class that is part of the school programs Ashokan offers continues to be one of the most popular, with a surge of interest from the current forging shows on TV.

In conclusion, the Ashokan Center welcomes both the business and the prestige to be the home base of two of the best blacksmithing seminars in the country. It is my intention to continue to run the programs as "The Registration Guy" as long as Dan, Tim, and Kevin keep designing the programs.

Speaking of such, I just received the program schedule from Dan for the Ashokan Sword seminar scheduled for September 16-18. The invitation will be out, the group website updated, and registration open within the next two weeks. Stay tuned for updates on this forum as well!
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Tim, good to see you are here handling things, I will leave it in your capable hands. And let me say that Tim, Dan and myself are only able to put together the lineup of demonstrators because of the tireless work you have done for us in making it all happen all of these years. Thank you!
 
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