The US Post Office and claimes for damaged merchandise.

Tom Lewis

Tom Lewis

Joined
Feb 24, 2000
Messages
1,951
About a month ago I used the US Post office to ship a Damascus knife to a customer. When he received the knife one corner of the shipping box had been crushed and the knife handle damaged. The customer took the damaged package and knife to the Post Office and was told that I had to file a claim. The Post Office kept the damaged package and the knife.
I had the package insured for the value of the knife, so I filed a claim with the Post Office for the damaged knife which was insured.
Last Saturday I received a form letter from the Post Office saying "Your claim has been denied because there was no visible sign of damage to the exterior or interior of the package."
What a rip off. I have a picture of the box that the customer e-mailed me and it clearly shows one corner of the box had been damaged. I doubt anyone at the claims department even looked at the box.
The letter also said If I wanted the knife back I had to go to the Post Office where the knife was held to pick it up. Does the Post Office expect me to drive several hundred miles to get my knife back"
The letter also said the knife would be discarded if kept over 60 days.
the letter also said I could appeal the decision which I am doing.
Has any one else had a claims experience with the Post Office?
What good is Post Office insurance if claims are handled in this manner?
 
Post Office insurance is no good, they rarely ever pay a claim. I get great service from the PO & ship all my knives with them, but I never use their insurance! I have separate insurance from Collectables Insurance. They are cheaper than the PO & they will pay a claim with very little hassle..
 
I have had a similar experience. On one of my lost packages, they denied the claim as they indicated they have no proof that the package was actually picked up by the USPS postal employee (even though USPS sent me an email indicating the package has been successfully picked up).....When I lived in IL, I had really good experience with USPS, maybe 1 out of 100 packages had an issue (double charge, did not pick up on time, did not ship on time, etc). When I moved to NJ, that default rate went up 10x.
 
Thanks, Don and bjansen.
Don, would you give more information about Collectables insurance. I used a search machine to find them, but there are several different companies by that name. I would like to start using Collectables insurance if I can find the company you use.
I have shipped hundreds of packages with the US Post Office, and this is the first problem.
I know several local Post Office employees, and they are honest people, but the claims department must be run by liars. The package is clearly damaged, but they say it isn't.
 
Tom, I sent a box with 10 ready blanks ( all they needed was handles) to a friend with whom I do collaborations and only 4 of those blanks made it to him. It was a nightmare trying to get anything done by the PO even though the box had been tampered with. I don't think they stole them but I'm sure there are a few blanks in one of their jeeps or the sorting floor. Long story longer, I never got anything resolved and just lost hours of time arguing with those guys. Now I pack everything as if it were going to be hit by an atomic bomb.
 
Tom, write to the Postal Inspectors at https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/

Ask them to verify the package that was held at the receiving office. Obviously, the paper-shuffling bureaucracy hasn't done that or they would know the package and contents were damaged. Inspectors are very hands-on.
 
Esav, thanks for the help. I went to the site you listed, but could not find anything there about reporting the US Post Office Claims department saying the package was not damaged, when it clearly was.
 
Receiver of damaged goods can fill out online forms OR go to the local post office and have a clerk fill out the paperwork. They will look at the box and not the damage on the box, interior packing materials and decide if the packing is sufficient.

Maybe have the receiver try this route.
 
My brother and I have had a nightmare with usps, as Don said, their insurance is a joke. I won't bore you with the details, but suffice it to say that I am also interested in the Collectables insurance Co.

Thanks

Pat
 
Luckily I have never had to try and use their insurance for a claim. I still buy it, because I don't think I ship enough for collectible insurance.
 
i ship alot and never pay the ins since you have to prove worth and replacement value. i hav ebeen lucky and only had some stuff missplaced (late delivery )
 
With any insurance involving large bureaucracy the claims are initially denied almost every time. I deal in jewelry appraising and hear the stories of insurance claims for mailed items often. They summarily deny the claim. I really believe they do this to make the fake claimants go away and also hope the minor claimants just say, "Forget it". If you appeal the decision, or take your claim request to a higher level, you have a much better chance of getting it paid. From what I have observed, legitimate claims get paid eventually, but it isn't an easy process.

In the govt. programs involving disability, the same rules apply. They automatically deny nearly every claim on the first pass. It doesn't matter if you are in an iron lung and have had both legs amputated, they will say you are not disabled. The person refusing the claim is not a doctor and probably never checks the claim out ( if he/she even reads it). He/she just stamps it DENIED, and send it back. If the claimant is truly disabled, he will appeal, and usually get another denial. The third level of appeal will almost always be approved....because an actual person will review the claim and a "judge" will decide if there is worth to your claim of disability. Again, this has become necessary because of the huge amount of phony disability claims.


How to make a claim much more likely to succeed:
Have good records - a detailed list of the exact contents should be in the box as well as you keeping a copy. A copy of the receipt should be in the box as well as a copy kept to prove what you sold the knife for.
Take photographs - A picture is worth a thousand dollars in this case. A clear photo of the package and items in it will make a claim much easier to process. The photo should show the receipt for the sale.
Use realistic valuation - Just because you think it is worth $500 does not mean you can get $500 in an insurance claim. If you sold it for $200, and claim $500, your claim will never be paid, as you have already committed a fraud. You can not claim more than the actual value...which is what you sold it for. If it was something you bought, keep records to show the value. Same for any special materials, like expensive handle materials. In some cases, especially gifts, you may only get the value of what you spent. Over-insuring is a red flag to the investigators handling a claim. An insurance claim ain't Pawn Stars...you don't start at $500, and when they say NO, then say, "Well, how about $300.....OK, $100 is the lowest I can take."
Pack it well - Sticking a knife in a cereal box with newspaper stuffed in is a sure fire way to have a problem. Boxes get tossed and tumbled in shipping. A loose knife will punch its way out of a box with ease ( especially if it is a cheap used box held together with tape). Use heavy duty boxes, and wrap/pack the knife well. Taping the knife to a piece of cardboard the sixe of the box prevents the knife from shifting around. making a foam cut-out to fit the knife is also a good method. Folding a batch of blades in layers of newspaper and securely taping up the bundle is how to get all ten blades to the HT shop. Using a box in a box is also a great way to ship heavier packages.
Keep tabs on your box - Tracking is the best way to spot a problem. If the tracking shows it still in the Tacoma processing center for three days, make a call. Check with the recipient when it shows as being delivered. If he says, "No it isn't here"...make a call right then. I like to ship by USPS Priority mail in the Priority boxes and use the tracking and automatic $100 insurance. I rarely buy extra insurance.

To date I have never had a package not show up. A few had to be tracked down, but they eventually got delivered. If it is really valuable, ship Registered mail.



Last week, I had a woman bring in a silver plated jewelry box for me to repair. The hinge pin on one end had just worked itself out. I tapped it back in and said, "That's all...no charge." She insisted that the shipping company had agreed to pay for the repairs as they had damaged it, and I should charge her $5. I explained that they did nothing to the box, and the pins fall out of these silver plated boxes all the time. She told me the shipper had agreed to pay the damages, and she had told them it was a platinum box. She wanted me to accept her $5 and write a repair ticket for $100 and say it was a platinum box. I not-so-politely showed her the door and asked her never to return. I only wish I had asked her the shipping company's name first, because I would have called them.
 
bladsmth said:
Last week, I had a woman bring in a silver plated jewelry box for me to repair. The hinge pin on one end had just worked itself out. I tapped it back in and said, "That's all...no charge." She insisted that the shipping company had agreed to pay for the repairs as they had damaged it, and I should charge her $5. I explained that they did nothing to the box, and the pins fall out of these silver plated boxes all the time. She told me the shipper had agreed to pay the damages, and she had told them it was a platinum box. She wanted me to accept her $5 and write a repair ticket for $100 and say it was a platinum box. I not-so-politely showed her the door and asked her never to return. I only wish I had asked her the shipping company's name first, because I would have called them.
Click to expand...

do you think maybe that waqs an insurance investagator setting you up ?
 
Tom Lewis said:
Thanks, Don and bjansen.
Don, would you give more information about Collectables insurance. I used a search machine to find them, but there are several different companies by that name. I would like to start using Collectables insurance if I can find the company you use.
I have shipped hundreds of packages with the US Post Office, and this is the first problem.
I know several local Post Office employees, and they are honest people, but the claims department must be run by liars. The package is clearly damaged, but they say it isn't.
Click to expand...

Here ya go Tom, http://www.collectinsure.com/

I went with this company when I started flying to shows and wanted my knives insured while in my checked luggage. With this insurance my knives are covered Everywhere... The yearly premium is less than the price I'd pay if I insure all the knives I ship with the PO.
 
Another reason I don't use USPS insurance, is an insured package has a huge target on it. Say something like; "I'm valuable-Steal Me!"
 
Thanks for the reference Don. Kevin Casey also recommended Collectibles Insurance, but it didnt really occur to me that it might cost less than the incremental cost of using FedEx over USPS and paying insurance on every package. Have you ever had to file a claim with them? If so, how did it go?
 
Travis Fry said:
Thanks for the reference Don. Kevin Casey also recommended Collectibles Insurance, but it didnt really occur to me that it might cost less than the incremental cost of using FedEx over USPS and paying insurance on every package. Have you ever had to file a claim with them? If so, how did it go?
Click to expand...

Travis, I've never filed a claim, but do know a collector who did, he got paid in less than 30 days.

You mentioned FedEx, I really do not like them or UPS for shipping knives. Had issues with both over the years and just keep using the PO with no issues. I ship most of my knives Express Mail, but less expensive ones go Priority. I also shipped over 20,000 lbs of W2 in 5 years through my little rural PO. Something around 800 boxes and only lost One... That's pretty good service... :)
 
It was after loosing my highest value knife to date through USPS (though I did get about 70% of the value back via USPS insurance) that I switched to UPS, then FedEx. I think I may switch back after this thread, and get some insurance through the folks you suggested. I called them and talked to their sales rep for a bit, then did an online quote for my location (Texas) and insured values (various). For those interested, there is a minimum threshold for the premium ($85 semi-annually) that covers up to $4200 of value (less value gets the same premium). These numbers are 1) a QUOTE (not a policy) for 2)MY LOCATION only and shouldn't be construed as anything else. I put them here in this thread just to give folks a ballpark idea. I figure my shipping cost would be about $5 per package lower if I was using USPS uninsured, so I need to ship 34 in knives a year to be cost neutral based on my cost assumptions and the quote. That isn't an apples-to-apples comparison though, because the product (insurance via common carrier or via broker) isn't really the same. Either way, if I lose one uninsured $400 knife every 3 years (so far this seems about average between my brother and I), I come out ahead with the insurance.
 
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