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Things have gotten stupid !
- Thread starter Boriqua
- Start date
Gollnick-
While I can appreciate you wanting to post examples to support your arguements, I have to point out that all 3 of your examples are full of errors...some of them serious.
In your first example of the overtime scandal...there have been *no indictments*, although the investigation continues, and therefore there have been *no convictions*...local or federal. As a result of the internal investigation, 2 sergeants were terminated and 1 probationary lieutenant was demoted. To claim that officers were convicted of federal crimes and are still working because of the union is completely untrue.
In your second example, in Washington County, you claim that the suspect escaped with the deputy's gun. This is completely untrue. The suspect had just been convicted of a sexual assault (not robbery) and was not handcuffed (violation of policy) but was wearing leg braces designed to limit the ability of a suspect to flee (they didn't work). It's true that the deputy didn't have a radio (violation of policy). He *did not* lose his gun. Also, the statements about this deputy falling asleep during trial were from previous trials and resulted in disciplinary action. Did this deputy screw the pooch in a major way? Absolutely! Was he fired? Yes. Was he given his job back? Yes. Why? Because of an independant arbitrator who ruled that it was excessive punishment. While I disagree with that decision, the arbitrator would certainly know more of the details of the allegations than you or I. He'd certainly know that the deputy didn't lose his gun, as you claimed.
As for the former portland officer who is serving a sentence in the state pen but still drawing disability...he is able to do that *entirely* because of the disability system in place at the time (which has long since been changed). There is nothing anyone can do about it, and it doesn't have anything to do with the union. It's a legal issue.
While your versions of these incidents are certainly more sensational, they are not factual.
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Be polite and professional...and have a plan to kill everyone you meet.
While I can appreciate you wanting to post examples to support your arguements, I have to point out that all 3 of your examples are full of errors...some of them serious.
In your first example of the overtime scandal...there have been *no indictments*, although the investigation continues, and therefore there have been *no convictions*...local or federal. As a result of the internal investigation, 2 sergeants were terminated and 1 probationary lieutenant was demoted. To claim that officers were convicted of federal crimes and are still working because of the union is completely untrue.
In your second example, in Washington County, you claim that the suspect escaped with the deputy's gun. This is completely untrue. The suspect had just been convicted of a sexual assault (not robbery) and was not handcuffed (violation of policy) but was wearing leg braces designed to limit the ability of a suspect to flee (they didn't work). It's true that the deputy didn't have a radio (violation of policy). He *did not* lose his gun. Also, the statements about this deputy falling asleep during trial were from previous trials and resulted in disciplinary action. Did this deputy screw the pooch in a major way? Absolutely! Was he fired? Yes. Was he given his job back? Yes. Why? Because of an independant arbitrator who ruled that it was excessive punishment. While I disagree with that decision, the arbitrator would certainly know more of the details of the allegations than you or I. He'd certainly know that the deputy didn't lose his gun, as you claimed.
As for the former portland officer who is serving a sentence in the state pen but still drawing disability...he is able to do that *entirely* because of the disability system in place at the time (which has long since been changed). There is nothing anyone can do about it, and it doesn't have anything to do with the union. It's a legal issue.
While your versions of these incidents are certainly more sensational, they are not factual.
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Be polite and professional...and have a plan to kill everyone you meet.
I can't believe the crap that I'm reading in this thread. How is what someone is sending in the mail "none of thier (the post office's) business"? They're the damn post office - of course it's thier business. There are specific regulations that make it their business. If you don't like the regulations it's time to set out to change them. That's what the AKTI is all about.
There are plenty of laws and regulations I don't like (paying taxes comes to mind) but I obey them anyway becasue I have to (and I don't want to pay a fine or go to jail).
There is no probem with being upset about these lame regulations. The problem is believing you are right by lying to get around them.
Who has written letters to the postmaster/senator/congressman to complain about this? If you haven't then you have no beef. If you have, do it again until you get some satisfaction.
Later,
MBS
There are plenty of laws and regulations I don't like (paying taxes comes to mind) but I obey them anyway becasue I have to (and I don't want to pay a fine or go to jail).
There is no probem with being upset about these lame regulations. The problem is believing you are right by lying to get around them.
Who has written letters to the postmaster/senator/congressman to complain about this? If you haven't then you have no beef. If you have, do it again until you get some satisfaction.
Later,
MBS
- Joined
- Sep 30, 1999
- Messages
- 4,229
I can tell you as a union member for 21 years(NY Photoengravers and Lithographers 1P) that they are still neccessary in some lines of work. In the printing industry if you work for a non-union outfit in the NY/NJ area, hope you have time for a second job, you'll need it to make ends meet.
The fact that unions protect their employees is important as a safeguard against unscrupulous employers making accusations without legitimacy just to downsize without having to pay unemployment. Our union members pride themselves on "a day's work for a day's pay". Can you be fired for stealing, insuboordination,poor performance,etc? Absolutely. There are procedures to follow but it definitely does happen. As a foreman I suspend people all the time if it's warranted.
I understand that in some proffessions maybe there is no need for a union, but in the craft trades in this area, you can't live without them.
As to the cases cited above, I doubt you have all the facts.
The fact that unions protect their employees is important as a safeguard against unscrupulous employers making accusations without legitimacy just to downsize without having to pay unemployment. Our union members pride themselves on "a day's work for a day's pay". Can you be fired for stealing, insuboordination,poor performance,etc? Absolutely. There are procedures to follow but it definitely does happen. As a foreman I suspend people all the time if it's warranted.
I understand that in some proffessions maybe there is no need for a union, but in the craft trades in this area, you can't live without them.
As to the cases cited above, I doubt you have all the facts.
Your right BigRott I was so angry it hadnt occured to me. I will do just that and write a letter to the Mailboxes etc I visited and to they're main office. I will post the letter and any response here.
As far as unions (a very touchy subject) I have mixed feelings. I have been on both sides as a union employee and non union supervisor in charge of union employees. I whole heartedly agree that unions are nessesary for the protection of many workers. Take a look at many of the Mexican imigrants doing laborer work in NYC and you can see what it could be like without unions. I see them getting berated, being forced to work under dangerous conditions with no instruction or saftey equipment, working 12-15 hour days and so on. If they get hurt they are just out of work. To bad!!
But in some ways it hurts its people and thier initiative. 15 or so years ago I was a Warehouse supervisor. One guy who made it through the probation period squeaky clean or so I thought was coming into work drunk stoned or both after probation. He had the nuts to go out at lunch and sit in the employee parking lot and drink a 40 and smoke a joint during lunch. I talked to him about it and it fell on deaf ears. Had he been an order picker I might not have been so upset but he was the Hi Lo driver. If you know anything about Hi Lo's they wiegh as much as three caddies and have two steel blades in front. After lunch he would drive this thing around the warehouse with his foot down as far as it would go. One day an order picker came out from between two aisles and the HiLo driver hit the cart the order picker was pushing. Turned it and the goods to splinters. All I could think was thank god one of those blades didnt puncture the poor guy picking the orders. I fired him on the spot. I wanted to beat him like a dog for endangering everyone else in the building (some 20-25 men) Two days later he was back on the job with his rep who asked if I gave him a breath alyzer(sp). Of course not! They then asked me how I knew then that he was drunk? Oh well.. I fired him because I was concerned for everyones safty and the union forced me to take him back.
My second story is is about incentive. I hired a guy that was just outstanding. Never late always produced and was just an outstanding employee. I felt he deserved more money than the guys I had to spend most of the day finding but ... you guessed it. I could not give him anymore than union scale. So why bust your a** if its not going to get you anymore than the bummiest guy in the place. Why work harder for the same money. My wife is a long time union member and like I said I would never advocate losing them but I think, like with all things, there is room for improvement. They could start with incentive raises.
Back to knives: Tallpaul I wasnt trying to disparage guns or gun owners but .. they are not in the same catagory with knives. I pay my dues to the NRA and believe strongly in the right to bear arms however a knife can be used in a variety of tasks of which only a few involve Death or injury. I can build shelter, cut my meat at the kitchen table, cut rope for the project in the yard,peal an apple, prune and so on. Sorry to disagree with you but a gun is not nearly as broad in its usage. A gun was designed and is used to Kill or Maim weather it is human or animal in the case with hunting. Although I have no problem with this its overall utilitarian uses are minimal. I find fifty times a day in which my knife is useful to me. Even when I carried a handgun outside of the range it was a hunk of metal. Therefore how can they be in the same catagory. As with the grandma story above or if I were sending a knife to my kid brother for a camping trip a knife has many more useful and completely innocent uses. What other general use tool will they decide has evil intent. I dont see a gun as a general use tool. You can only use it to punch holes in something.
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Alex
My Knife Page
[This message has been edited by Boriqua (edited 01-14-2001).]
As far as unions (a very touchy subject) I have mixed feelings. I have been on both sides as a union employee and non union supervisor in charge of union employees. I whole heartedly agree that unions are nessesary for the protection of many workers. Take a look at many of the Mexican imigrants doing laborer work in NYC and you can see what it could be like without unions. I see them getting berated, being forced to work under dangerous conditions with no instruction or saftey equipment, working 12-15 hour days and so on. If they get hurt they are just out of work. To bad!!
But in some ways it hurts its people and thier initiative. 15 or so years ago I was a Warehouse supervisor. One guy who made it through the probation period squeaky clean or so I thought was coming into work drunk stoned or both after probation. He had the nuts to go out at lunch and sit in the employee parking lot and drink a 40 and smoke a joint during lunch. I talked to him about it and it fell on deaf ears. Had he been an order picker I might not have been so upset but he was the Hi Lo driver. If you know anything about Hi Lo's they wiegh as much as three caddies and have two steel blades in front. After lunch he would drive this thing around the warehouse with his foot down as far as it would go. One day an order picker came out from between two aisles and the HiLo driver hit the cart the order picker was pushing. Turned it and the goods to splinters. All I could think was thank god one of those blades didnt puncture the poor guy picking the orders. I fired him on the spot. I wanted to beat him like a dog for endangering everyone else in the building (some 20-25 men) Two days later he was back on the job with his rep who asked if I gave him a breath alyzer(sp). Of course not! They then asked me how I knew then that he was drunk? Oh well.. I fired him because I was concerned for everyones safty and the union forced me to take him back.
My second story is is about incentive. I hired a guy that was just outstanding. Never late always produced and was just an outstanding employee. I felt he deserved more money than the guys I had to spend most of the day finding but ... you guessed it. I could not give him anymore than union scale. So why bust your a** if its not going to get you anymore than the bummiest guy in the place. Why work harder for the same money. My wife is a long time union member and like I said I would never advocate losing them but I think, like with all things, there is room for improvement. They could start with incentive raises.
Back to knives: Tallpaul I wasnt trying to disparage guns or gun owners but .. they are not in the same catagory with knives. I pay my dues to the NRA and believe strongly in the right to bear arms however a knife can be used in a variety of tasks of which only a few involve Death or injury. I can build shelter, cut my meat at the kitchen table, cut rope for the project in the yard,peal an apple, prune and so on. Sorry to disagree with you but a gun is not nearly as broad in its usage. A gun was designed and is used to Kill or Maim weather it is human or animal in the case with hunting. Although I have no problem with this its overall utilitarian uses are minimal. I find fifty times a day in which my knife is useful to me. Even when I carried a handgun outside of the range it was a hunk of metal. Therefore how can they be in the same catagory. As with the grandma story above or if I were sending a knife to my kid brother for a camping trip a knife has many more useful and completely innocent uses. What other general use tool will they decide has evil intent. I dont see a gun as a general use tool. You can only use it to punch holes in something.
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Alex
My Knife Page
[This message has been edited by Boriqua (edited 01-14-2001).]
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2000
- Messages
- 2,468
Alright Lifter! Don't let the antiunion retoric keep you down. What some uneducated souls don't know is that the job situation in many parts of the country sucks and it's damn hard to make a living. Sure the unemployment is low, but the reason is because lots of folks are working lower paying jobs than they were ten years ago. I personally have been a victim of this phenomena at times.
There is a younger generation of kids coming along with more liberal ideals and this country, which has been on a very conservative path for the last 20 years, is about to undergo some changes. It is going to shock a lot of folks who can't conceive of things happening in a business-as-usual manner but keep in mind that all political climates are cyclical and subject to change. Enough said, and I will not argue with anyone over politics, eat me. Just had to get that off my chest.
Viva La Revolution!
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Peter Atwood
email:fountainman@hotmail.com
There is a younger generation of kids coming along with more liberal ideals and this country, which has been on a very conservative path for the last 20 years, is about to undergo some changes. It is going to shock a lot of folks who can't conceive of things happening in a business-as-usual manner but keep in mind that all political climates are cyclical and subject to change. Enough said, and I will not argue with anyone over politics, eat me. Just had to get that off my chest.
Viva La Revolution!
------------------
Peter Atwood
email:fountainman@hotmail.com
dogboye
Gold Member
- Joined
- Nov 23, 1999
- Messages
- 7,147
To HELL with UPS! Take it to USPS, tell 'em it's a damn box o' CD's (if they even ask), and be done with it!
Did you know you can even ship snakes through USPS, as long as they are under 12 inches long (I think... maybe even longer), and not poisonous? IF they even ask!
Like I said, to HELL with UPS! I've had enough of them (before hearing this)!
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A dog at play has the mind of a wise martial arts master, a mind capable of perfect focus. - Marc Christophe
iktomi
Did you know you can even ship snakes through USPS, as long as they are under 12 inches long (I think... maybe even longer), and not poisonous? IF they even ask!
Like I said, to HELL with UPS! I've had enough of them (before hearing this)!
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A dog at play has the mind of a wise martial arts master, a mind capable of perfect focus. - Marc Christophe
iktomi
- Joined
- Oct 31, 1998
- Messages
- 3,036
I don't know anything about the cases Chuck sites.However;if it's true they haven't been charged or convicted of anything,The employer wants them fired?I'd say that theres a good example of why the Union is important.They want to destroy a man's career based on an unproven charge.I thought we were innocent until proven guilty?How about a suspension with pay,until the justice system has had a chance to run it's course or a temporary duty change?Why should the man be fired without any proof of fraud?
Let's see,ya we have OSHA,but since when is to much safety a bad thing?Okay,we have minimum wage?Try living on it sometime.A UNION has many jobs and does focus on the important issues,it's not just designed to be a thorn in managements side.We have an agreement with our employer,who has many times in the past tried to violate that agreement.Who,if not the UNION, has the ability to challenge these violations that occur often.If we can keep are side of the agreement,why then,does the company try to violate their word?In our local we don't support criminal activity or behavior that is unbecoming of a Union Member.If someone is caught red handed stealing and there is a believable case,our Union will not support or defend the member.I realize this is not the case everywhere,but the Union is entitled not to be perfect like every other organization in the world.Do I believe Union's still have a purpose?I sure do,at least as long as there are employers out in the world ho have no Integrity,or honesty.As long as there are employers who have no respect and appreciation for their employees,I will believe in Unions.Would you like to hear a quote from my last boss?
"The maintenance fuel/washbay personnel at this facility makes $13.50 an hour? Sheesh, back in Louisiana I could pay a couple of mexicans $6.00 an hour to do that job" Who do you respect now?The Union or the employer quoted above?I think we got slightly off topic here although the Union somehow was intergrated into the original topic.I don't feel I can bring anything further to this topic,I've said all I have to say on this subject,make your own judgement on what you feel about Unions.Best regards,Ralph
[This message has been edited by TOMBSTONE (edited 01-14-2001).]
Let's see,ya we have OSHA,but since when is to much safety a bad thing?Okay,we have minimum wage?Try living on it sometime.A UNION has many jobs and does focus on the important issues,it's not just designed to be a thorn in managements side.We have an agreement with our employer,who has many times in the past tried to violate that agreement.Who,if not the UNION, has the ability to challenge these violations that occur often.If we can keep are side of the agreement,why then,does the company try to violate their word?In our local we don't support criminal activity or behavior that is unbecoming of a Union Member.If someone is caught red handed stealing and there is a believable case,our Union will not support or defend the member.I realize this is not the case everywhere,but the Union is entitled not to be perfect like every other organization in the world.Do I believe Union's still have a purpose?I sure do,at least as long as there are employers out in the world ho have no Integrity,or honesty.As long as there are employers who have no respect and appreciation for their employees,I will believe in Unions.Would you like to hear a quote from my last boss?
"The maintenance fuel/washbay personnel at this facility makes $13.50 an hour? Sheesh, back in Louisiana I could pay a couple of mexicans $6.00 an hour to do that job" Who do you respect now?The Union or the employer quoted above?I think we got slightly off topic here although the Union somehow was intergrated into the original topic.I don't feel I can bring anything further to this topic,I've said all I have to say on this subject,make your own judgement on what you feel about Unions.Best regards,Ralph
[This message has been edited by TOMBSTONE (edited 01-14-2001).]
- Joined
- Aug 8, 1999
- Messages
- 5,094
Boriqua, go to your post office and ask to see the regulations concerning knives. What the regulations actually say is that they don't ship switchblades or ballistic knives. I know this for a fact because I had a run with a local postmaster here in Illinois when she refused to let me ship a Spyderco kitchen knife to my mother. I demanded to see the rules and I remember them saying that the restrictions did not apply to kitchen or common pocket knives. The postal employees are simply braodly interpreting the rules but they clearly allow for utilitarian knives to be sent through the mail.
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2000
- Messages
- 5,501
Uh, Bigrott and Anthony. I'm pretty sure the original post was about Mailboxes/UPS policies on not shipping knives. NOT the Post Office.
UPS is too much of a hassle for me to use either way. I prefer the US Postal Service. The last two knives I sold got to Illinois and California in just 2 days from the time I mailed them. And that's pretty much the norm for the US Postal Service. I know a lot of people get down on the Post Office, but they do a good job. And we all watch them like hawks because they are a part of the government. I just read on the notice about the price change on stamps that they get NO money from taxes, but are completely self sufficient from the charges for postage. Compared to the rest of the Federal Government (and I work for DoD), I say kudos to the Post Office.
Dean
UPS is too much of a hassle for me to use either way. I prefer the US Postal Service. The last two knives I sold got to Illinois and California in just 2 days from the time I mailed them. And that's pretty much the norm for the US Postal Service. I know a lot of people get down on the Post Office, but they do a good job. And we all watch them like hawks because they are a part of the government. I just read on the notice about the price change on stamps that they get NO money from taxes, but are completely self sufficient from the charges for postage. Compared to the rest of the Federal Government (and I work for DoD), I say kudos to the Post Office.
Dean
- Joined
- Sep 30, 1999
- Messages
- 4,229
Alex,
I do agree about the alcohol/drug thing being a problem but there are procedures for it here at the NY Daily News. If I smell alcohol or suspect drug use from someone, the first thing to do is call them in the office with their shop steward(as a witness and advisor for them) and another foreman(as a witness for me), and notify him of what my suspicion's are and that I will be documenting this incident. He then has the option of: 1)taking an immediate urine test at company's expense to prove his innocence,2)totally denying and ignoring it totally, 3)denying and making sure it doesn't happen again. My own desire is usually #3 as I never like to see anyone lose their job if it can be helped. The 3rd time this is documented the employee then has to take a urine test immediately and if they refuse, they are done. Things are done this way to protect an employee from being accused unjustly by someone who doesn't like him or just wants to get rid of him. Also, anytime there is any kind of accident or injury an immediate test can be given if suspected and if dirty, can be terminated.
As to paying above union wages, that can also be done. We have 6 month evaluations with bonus incentives in place.
In the NY/NJ area with the average house costing $200-300,000, cars over 20,000, and college expenses if you have kids, house taxes between 4,000-7,000, a person can't live on one of the non-union printing jobs available for $50,000 with no benefits.Not when you figure in these costs plus medical insurance, some kind of retirement plan,etc.
Back to the topic-I agree, you should ask Mailboxes headquarters what their policies are. Often employees broaden interpretations due to their own prejudices.
Sorry for the long post.
Dave
I do agree about the alcohol/drug thing being a problem but there are procedures for it here at the NY Daily News. If I smell alcohol or suspect drug use from someone, the first thing to do is call them in the office with their shop steward(as a witness and advisor for them) and another foreman(as a witness for me), and notify him of what my suspicion's are and that I will be documenting this incident. He then has the option of: 1)taking an immediate urine test at company's expense to prove his innocence,2)totally denying and ignoring it totally, 3)denying and making sure it doesn't happen again. My own desire is usually #3 as I never like to see anyone lose their job if it can be helped. The 3rd time this is documented the employee then has to take a urine test immediately and if they refuse, they are done. Things are done this way to protect an employee from being accused unjustly by someone who doesn't like him or just wants to get rid of him. Also, anytime there is any kind of accident or injury an immediate test can be given if suspected and if dirty, can be terminated.
As to paying above union wages, that can also be done. We have 6 month evaluations with bonus incentives in place.
In the NY/NJ area with the average house costing $200-300,000, cars over 20,000, and college expenses if you have kids, house taxes between 4,000-7,000, a person can't live on one of the non-union printing jobs available for $50,000 with no benefits.Not when you figure in these costs plus medical insurance, some kind of retirement plan,etc.
Back to the topic-I agree, you should ask Mailboxes headquarters what their policies are. Often employees broaden interpretations due to their own prejudices.
Sorry for the long post.
Dave
- Joined
- Jun 27, 1999
- Messages
- 804
I sent the pass around knife to Kit Carson last week from a mailboxes etc, and they had no problem with it. I even showed it to the guy when he asked how it was packed so for so he would know to best pack it further. They packed it up for me very nicely, insured it, and shipped it for me, knowing exactly what it was. Shipped Fedex, of course. I don't trust UPS, either.
I'd ask to see that policy, too.
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Oz
"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken!"
http://www.freespeech.org/oz/
I'd ask to see that policy, too.
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Oz
"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken!"
http://www.freespeech.org/oz/
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2000
- Messages
- 269
This reminds me of a problem I had with UPS a few monts ago...At the time I really didn't think much of it but after reading all these posts!!!! I was coming home from work and noticed my Local UPS guy stopped at the Deli a few blocks away from my house... Knowing that my package was do that day (I checked the web site from work) and not wanting to wait another 3 hours ( they usually get to me around 7p.m. I stopped and asked about it... The driver said he had no package for my address... I rushed home and when I checked the UPS ite again it said my package had already been delivered??? AFter searching the neighborhood for the truck the driver was able to locate my package very quickly the second time... When I asked he why the tracking page on the web site said it was delivered he said "Man those computers mess things up all the time" Happy to have my package I let it slide.... Now I don't think I will ever use UPS again!!!
Gollnick
Musical Director
- Joined
- Mar 22, 1999
- Messages
- 29,258
I have a good friend who I pay to hit me, kick me, and attack me. Sometime, I say "Guru, it's a good thingk I pay you monthly," because sometimes he works me just a little bit hard or insists on pushing me beyond what I'm comfortable with. But, I know that he does it for my own good. It may seem strange, but sometimes attacking someone can be for that person's good.
Contrary to what some have suggested, I am not anti-union. Unions have been very important in the history of American industry and I think they still have an important roll to play today.
If some of the details of the cases I cited were in error, I am sorry. But, those errors point out an important fact. Sometimes, people don't get all the details. Sometimes, as a story is told from one person to the next, details get distorted. This is why it's so very important for an organization such as a union to present a clear message in what they say and do. Unions have a problem right now in that the majority of people are pre-disposed to accept negative images of unions.
Right now, unions are at a crossroads. In hitting them, kicking them, attacking them, in pushing them and maybe taking them beyond their comfort zones, I hope to encourage them to make good choices. I hope that those of you who are reading here who are in positions of any importance in any union will take a very close look at where your unions is going, what it's doing, and what future that holds.
You can say what you want to about SS, OSHA, and other government programs and regulations (most of which, BTW, are a result of union efforts and represent a success for unions since they extend some protections and benefits, if only minimal and sometimes questionable, to non-union employeers and employees), but these laws and programs are increasingly taking over the functions and causes that unions have traditionally championed.
Where there are still employeers who maintain unsafe sork environments, who are not providing sound retirement options for employees, who are discriminating, or otherwise mistreating their employees, Unions have an obvious roll still to play.
I strongly hope that unions will remain a part of American industry since I do believe that they can play a strong and vital roll. But, as these other issues become resolved, what will the ongoing roll for unions be?
Will it be to defend incompetent, slothful, and even criminal "workers", or will it be to work with employeers to make America the most productive country in the world while still providing the best work environments and the highest standards of living?
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Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com
Contrary to what some have suggested, I am not anti-union. Unions have been very important in the history of American industry and I think they still have an important roll to play today.
If some of the details of the cases I cited were in error, I am sorry. But, those errors point out an important fact. Sometimes, people don't get all the details. Sometimes, as a story is told from one person to the next, details get distorted. This is why it's so very important for an organization such as a union to present a clear message in what they say and do. Unions have a problem right now in that the majority of people are pre-disposed to accept negative images of unions.
Right now, unions are at a crossroads. In hitting them, kicking them, attacking them, in pushing them and maybe taking them beyond their comfort zones, I hope to encourage them to make good choices. I hope that those of you who are reading here who are in positions of any importance in any union will take a very close look at where your unions is going, what it's doing, and what future that holds.
You can say what you want to about SS, OSHA, and other government programs and regulations (most of which, BTW, are a result of union efforts and represent a success for unions since they extend some protections and benefits, if only minimal and sometimes questionable, to non-union employeers and employees), but these laws and programs are increasingly taking over the functions and causes that unions have traditionally championed.
Where there are still employeers who maintain unsafe sork environments, who are not providing sound retirement options for employees, who are discriminating, or otherwise mistreating their employees, Unions have an obvious roll still to play.
I strongly hope that unions will remain a part of American industry since I do believe that they can play a strong and vital roll. But, as these other issues become resolved, what will the ongoing roll for unions be?
Will it be to defend incompetent, slothful, and even criminal "workers", or will it be to work with employeers to make America the most productive country in the world while still providing the best work environments and the highest standards of living?
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Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com