Thoughts on using Rocksteads with ZDP 189 in the Electrical trade.

[dan35]

There is a reason Rockstead offers blades in YXR7. Its made for some hard use. YXR7 is very close to a matrix steel with little carbide.

ZDP-189 has near 32% carbide. That's a lot. Its great at cutting softer materials and holds a great edge and edge aggression but its not engineered for a lot of lateral pressure in a cut.

 

[Alpha556]

https://imgur.com/a/AoxBOxW

Its hard to capture in the pic but you can see towards the tip end the very apex of the edge has broken off in a couple spots.
This was dropped on concrete so in guess it could have been worse.
Rockstead edges are so perfect that any slight damage is readily apparent.

Don't think I'll be sending it in tho. I might sale it for a heavily discounted price or try trading it. If anyone has a spyderco paysan and wants a rockstead I'm your man.

 

[CPP]

i had the same happen to mine and was able to sharpen it out

 

[Murdamook]

.

According to knife steel nerds Rex45 is tougher but zdp189 has better edge retention. They must be expensive steels because you don’t see either one very often.

Rex45 is pretty regularly compared to M4, which is known for great edge holding and toughness. ZDP is an extremely high hardness steel that’s real advantage is edge holding capability.

 

[Murdamook]

Does Rockstead run their ZDP that hard? I'm learning new things here.

In order to get peak ZDP, it is run very hard. Spyderco is high 60s IIRC. Rocksteads are run at 65-67 HRc according to the Google machine. This makes the edge apex pretty fragile.

 

[DocJD]

do something that will surely damage the blade,

I don't know your working conditions or how public it is , but I used to "lose " a lot of nice pens , penlights etc ,at various jobs until I learned to buy then cheap in bulk.

I'd just use a regular electricians knife or other decent cheap beater and keep the nice expensive ones out of sight .

 

[3D Anvil]

It's a personal decision, but I don't think the edge would get messed up unless you drop the knife on something harder than ZDP-189. Maxamet has similar qualities to ZDP and I've seen a video (Swiss knife maker ... can't find it now) where the guy literally hammered a Maxamet blade into a brass rod and it did little to no damage to the blade. Then he did the same thing with a steel rod and that caused some minor chipping. OTOH, I accidentally smacked a Maxamet blade into a porcelain tile and it did chip the blade. Had similar happen with 20cv, so....

 

[tiguy7]

Both Spyderco and William Henry make ZDP-189 knives. I have been EDCing a ZDP-189 W/H for over 20 yrs with no chips, but my usage does not include general construction.View attachment 1733342View attachment 1733343

 

[Murdamook]

It's a personal decision, but I don't think the edge would get messed up unless you drop the knife on something harder than ZDP-189. Maxamet has similar qualities to ZDP and I've seen a video (Swiss knife maker ... can't find it now) where the guy literally hammered a Maxamet blade into a brass rod and it did little to no damage to the blade. Then he did the same thing with a steel rod and that caused some minor chipping. OTOH, I accidentally smacked a Maxamet blade into a porcelain tile and it did chip the blade. Had similar happen with 20cv, so....

Again, this isn’t how things work. He won’t be stabbing anything directly into anything. There’s a reason that high hardness knife steels aren’t used as camp knives. The high Rockwell rating makes the blade significantly more brittle. If it were just a matter of hardness making the knife stronger overall, then why would companies even bother using steels like Cruwear or 3V? Because lateral stress placed on thinly-ground, high hardness steel causes chipping. So, you take a hunk of Maxamet and chop into a tree, something significantly softer than Maxamet, they put lateral or twisting stress on the blade, it will fracture or chip out. OP is using the blade for wire stripping, cutting, etc. There’s a not-insignificant probability that the knife endures some focused lateral stress at the apex. When that happens, ZDP will chip out. How frequently do you cut things with any knife that has a higher hardness than steel? Probably not often. But you still see chips on blades all the time.

 

[3D Anvil]

Honestly, I don't think I've ever chipped a blade on something softer than steel, but I'm not putting my EDC knives to very hard use.

Someone posted a video above of a couple guys torture testing a Rockstead knife. I don't think it chipped from batonning it through multiple logs, although they did break the tip when they hit it with the baton. They did chip the blade when they used it split a bunch of bricks, so I'd avoid that for sure. lol

 

[MrStabby7]

In 10 years would you rather have a nice knife that you've never used or a battle scared knife and lots of memories of enjoying it?

 

[TimmyJ]

I bought this Rockstead Chi in YXR7 second hand. It had some small scratches to the blade and had been sharpened. I got it for a great price and have used it as a work knife for almost 5 years. No chipping at all, but lots of scratches to the blade, chips in the DLC and the ray skin is worn.

 

[LimpCroissant]

It's a personal decision, but I don't think the edge would get messed up unless you drop the knife on something harder than ZDP-189. Maxamet has similar qualities to ZDP and I've seen a video (Swiss knife maker ... can't find it now) where the guy literally hammered a Maxamet blade into a brass rod and it did little to no damage to the blade. Then he did the same thing with a steel rod and that caused some minor chipping. OTOH, I accidentally smacked a Maxamet blade into a porcelain tile and it did chip the blade. Had similar happen with 20cv, so....

I saw that video too. Pretty impressive considering all the rumors I heard of how brittle it could be.

 

[Black Oak Bladeworks]

I have no experience with Rocksteads. I would say if you want to use do it though! Personally I find the most satisfaction from using knives to do what they where designed for. You never really know how well it works until you test it. And its not hard to resharpen it if it chips or stop using it if doesn't work well. Just my 2 cents.

 

[murat1983]

According to what you said, you bought several, do not mind using it in your job and actually want to use it in your job. Then what is the purpose of this thread? Just go ahead and use it.

 

[JPD61]

Still a flex thread until we get a home address and a safe combination. Ya know, just to prove you exist and have suitable storage.

I don't know your working conditions or how public it is , but I used to "lose " a lot of nice pens , penlights etc ,at various jobs until I learned to buy then cheap in bulk.

I'd just use a regular electricians knife or other decent cheap beater and keep the nice expensive ones out of sight .

I have some key lanyards that I use when I'm at work. Clips to my belt loop, and to the pocket clip. Hasn't failed me yet, but it would really make me sick k to lose one.

 

[Ajack60]

I have some key lanyards that I use when I'm at work. Clips to my belt loop, and to the pocket clip. Hasn't failed me yet, but it would really make me sick k to lose one.

Chances are, you're not going to lose a thousand dollar knife. I make damn sure I know where it's at all the time. I crawled under a house today, my CRK stayed in the truck. I took the Spyderco with me.

 

[Bluearcflash]

Mora makes a cheap nice stripping knife that works great and is very easy to keep sharp. Worth the $12-13 I paid for it

 

[JPD61]

According to what you said, you bought several, do not mind using it in your job and actually want to use it in your job. Then what is the purpose of this thread? Just go ahead and use it.

The purpose was to possibly run across someone who had actually used one to strip back cable , etc. Earlier in the thread I stated that I did not want to do something that would definitely damage the knife.

 

[murat1983]

The purpose was to possibly run across someone who had actually used one to strip back cable , etc. Earlier in the thread I stated that I did not want to do something that would definitely damage the knife.

Depends on how you define the damage. If the chipped edge is a damaged knife for you, then yes it will get damaged. If what you meant as damage is the broken blade, no then the task you are talking about will not break your knife unless you try to baton through a thick armoured underground electrical cable.

I had some site experience as an electrical engineer and used my S30V knife on my leatherman to strip some thin electrical cable and after some use, I started to get microchips. Not because of the wire itself, but mostly you need to strip the cable by putting it on a stable surface, so most of the damage to the knife is sourced from unintentional contact between the edge and supporting material (mostly concrete). But this did not bother me much as I could sharpen it easily, which I do not think is the case for a Rockstead.

I understand your enthusiasm of wanting to use your expensive knives, we are all like you, trying to cut something with our precious knives whenever we find a chance, but there is a saying, right tool for the job. And the Rockstead is not the right tool for cable stripping. You might consider getting yourself a good quality multi-tool, such as Leatherman Charge TTi. In my experience, my Charge TTi proved to be the most useful thing I can have on me on site. It saved my life on a couple of occasions where I got locked up in a cable storage warehouse at 45 degrees celsius where the door handle was broken from inside. I used the pliers to get a hold of the lock mechanism to rotate it and open the door. These were the times when mobile phones were not as popular as it is now and nobody knew that I went to the warehouse to load the truck with cables and I was alone. I am not saying I would be dead if I did not have my multitool, but I will certainly have some unpleasant time in a hot warehouse without any water.