UK knife article will boil your blood

[MercuryHayze]

Or surviving a Zombie attack

 

[FullerH]

I was given my first knife, a Barlow, shortly after my 7th birthday and I was taught by lecture and by example by both my old man and my 5 year older brother what to do with a knife and what NOT to do with it. I won't say that I never did anything stupid, but I never used one in a fight, for I knew them the be a deadly weapon in such usage, and I never endangered anyone with a knife or a firearm, at least that I know about.

 

[WadeF]

I don't know if anyone else pointed this out, but I find it amusing the Mayor trusts her daughter with a horse and not a knife. Isn't a horse just a tad bit more dangerous than a knife? A knife doesn't jump up and stab you on it's own as where a horse could decide to kick you across the barn for no reason. If you're responsible enough to handle and care for a horse a knife should be no big deal. I'm sure she works with other tools just as "dangerous" as a knife.

 

[socintel]

Well, that's their right isn't it? Just as it's our right to give our kids knives and teach them how to use them. We expect people to respect our rights so why don't you try and respect theirs? If they don't want their kids to have knives and don't want knives showing up in their children's hands without their knowledge then they have the right to be concerned about it.

Are these anti-knife parents dumb for being this way? In our eyes maybe they are, but it's their right to think whatever they want. Our kids will just be more capable and independant than their kids and may have a better shot of landing a job.

Their is a difference between one's "rights" and what is Right (morally)
and considering that it is right(morally) to train one's child how to properly
handle knives and firearms (as it is also within their rights legally). I see
no reason,that the opinion of those that are wrong (morally), but within their right(legally)should take precedence over those that are right (both morally and legally)

In other words Why should we withhold knives (as long as it does not create
unnecessary danger to the operator/bystanders) from (in this case a cracker),
Just because some parents wrongfully neglect to teach their children how to
handle knives and such, I think not.

I myself believe in an absolute truth (such as gravity,the fact that I am saying this and the fact that I just had pizza for dinner {trust me I can still feel it} If you dont then none of this really matters because you could just say that none of this ever even really happened!! ) anyway I think you get my point, Just hope you agree with me .

Also I hope you can figure out what on earth i'm trying to say!!

 

[TorzJohnson]

I remember when I was a kid, I put a quarter in a gum machine (the kind that give a trinket, not gum) and I received a small brass book. Well, I thought I really got gypped until I fiddled around with it and found out it opened up sideways and it was a lighter. I put some of my Dad's lighter fluid in it and torched many an army man with it. Good times. That was California, around '70... times sure have changed.

 

[WadeF]

Also I hope you can figure out what on earth i'm trying to say!!

I think I followed that. BTW, this is a fun little debate, so I don't mean to offend anyone.

I agree with you to a degree. I just don't think things like knives, or guns, or anthing that is potentially dangerous, should show up in items that a child may play with, with no warning to the parents. If someone wants to put knives in a party popper that's fine with me, as long as that's listed as a possible prize. The issue shouldn't really be about the knife, but that it contains a prize that some parents don't find acceptable (without a warning). If the knife was instead a plastic penis or some sex toy there would still be outrage about it being in a party popper, unknown to the parents. I'd like to hear the Mayor's daughter explain how she'd use that prize.

Instead of these poppers being pulled from the shelves they should just include a warning that they may contain a small knife and the poppers may only be purchased by an adult.

Unfortunately many parents aren't familiar with knives like we are. Educating their kids about knives isn't something they think about. So if their kid was given some party poppers and found a knife in one and by chance fatally cut themselves the parents would have a right to be upset. A knife may as well be a dangerous weapon in the hands of someone who doesn't know how to respect it or use it. Just like many other tools are VERY dangerous if they are used by someone unfamiliar with their intended purpose and operation. I'd be pretty pissed if my kid opened a box of Cracker Jacks and found a sharp chisel or saw blade inside with no warning available to me on the box.

 

[WadeF]

I remember when I was a kid, I put a quarter in a gum machine (the kind that give a trinket, not gum) and I received a small brass book. Well, I thought I really got gypped until I fiddled around with it and found out it opened up sideways and it was a lighter. I put some of my Dad's lighter fluid in it and torched many an army man with it. Good times. That was California, around '70... times sure have changed.

Haha, at least it didn't come with fuel and you had to get that from an adult, even if it was without their blessing. At that point it would be your Dad's fault for leaving lighter fluid accessable to you. If he gave you the lighter fluid he at least had a chance to decide if you should have a functional lighter.

 

[fulloflead]

I remember when I was a kid, I put a quarter in a gum machine (the kind that give a trinket, not gum) and I received a small brass book. Well, I thought I really got gypped until I fiddled around with it and found out it opened up sideways and it was a lighter. I put some of my Dad's lighter fluid in it and torched many an army man with it. Good times. That was California, around '70... times sure have changed.

Phuck. You're OLD.

 

[Keith Montgomery]

I don't think the important part of what is in that article is that there was a knife in a party favor. It is the fact that there are people so afraid of knives that they would teach their children to be just as terrified as them that is so pathetic.

 

[socintel]

WadeF,
I agree that their should be a "label of ingredients" on things of this nature

I dissagree in comparing Knives and firearms (our only means of real self defense) with objects that are totally perverse and have no place whatsoever on our planet (the key is morallity which is absolute).

Their is a legitimate (MORAL) reason for training a child how to use weapons,
Their is no reason whatsoever to train a child to use the perverted things which
you describe. As their is no legitimate (moral) reason to use them either

I also believe I am correct in believing that you do not condone the use of the perverted things which you described

So if their kid was given some party poppers and found a knife in one and by chance fatally cut themselves the parents would have a right to be upset

Who should be held responsible for this, If the parent had not been derelict
of their duty as parents it almost definatly woulden't happen.

And just a idea,
I would recommend that the manufacturer put a User type agreement
on the product, which could very simply state that they are not responsible for any misuse by the operator,which results in either, injury or death .

 

[WadeF]

Who should be held responsible for this, If the parent had not been derelict
of their duty as parents it almost definatly woulden't happen.

And just a idea,
I would recommend that the manufacturer put a User type agreement
on the product, which could very simply state that they are not responsible for any misuse by the operator,which results in either, injury or death .

So if you buy your kid some cupcakes at the store only to find out one of them had a chunk of glass in it which caused them to choke and die you're a bad parent? The point is these parents weren't expecting a party popper to contain a knife.

To expect all parents to train their kids how to safely deal with a knife and other weapons is unrealistic.

 

[tarmacky]

Why couldn't the cracker makers label their wares like is done at U.S. fast food joints with the kiddie meals;like"Not appropriate for children under x years of age",and substitute some thing more age appropriate.Or even better,make crackers for for different age groups,complete with proper novelty.

 

[brewthunda]

Just a bit more info on the Christmas crackers: We do this in my family. My mom picked up the tradition from her travels in New Zealand. They are not something that a kid would normally play with unsupervised. They usually are placed at each placesetting at a formal christmas dinner. The family then opens them all at once. In my family we all cross arms, holding one end of a cracker in each hand - and your neighbors on either side hold the other end of each cracker . . so you have this continuous chain of people crossing their arms and holding on to their neighbor's cracker. It's complicated and awkward and it never goes right . . but eventially they all go pop and people proceed to root throught the goodies that have fallen from each cracker.

Each cracker contains a dumb crepe paper hat, a rinky dink toy and a joke. The toy might be a ring, an army man, a plastic bird or a cheap magic trick or something. The joke is the most dangerous part. They're all thoroughly English jokes, but the look like they've been translated to Chinese and back.

What has 22 legs and 2 wings but can't fly?
A football team

What do you give a train driver for Christmas?
Platform Shoes!

Where does Tarzan buy his clothes?
At a jungle sale

Etc. etc.

The funny part about the knife story is that 1) Christmas crackers are played with only under heavily supervised conditions (your entire family watching), and 2) that's probably the best toy to ever come out of a cracker.

Here's a picture that I found on Google:

 

[socintel]

WadeF,

So if you buy your kid some cupcakes at the store only to find out one of them had a chunk of glass in it which caused them to choke and die you're a bad parent? The point is these parents weren't expecting a party popper to contain a knife.

To expect all parents to train their kids how to safely deal with a knife and other weapons is unrealistic.

First of all to (intentionaly) put glass in a cupcake is wrong (both morally and legally)
However a manufacturer of baked goods is required BY LAW to list the ingredients on the product/packaging. Also they are required to have a certain amount of quality control, If glass where to be put into cupcakes (unintentionaly),the manufacturer would be held liable

A cupcake is totaly different because it is a consumable, In the case at hand we are dealing with a cracker, something in which we put party favors/trinkets, the two are of a totally different nature

Also I disagree with you in that you think that it is unreasonable to expect parents to train a child in the basics of knife/firearm handling,as it takes very little time to train a child how to properly handle and care for a knife. as for firearm training this takes a little more time (try taking them to a range).

In other words their is no excuse for a parent to not train their child on these matters. after all this is part of being a parent (is it not)?

 

[fulloflead]

What has 22 legs and 2 wings but can't fly?
A football team

What do you give a train driver for Christmas?
Platform Shoes!

Where does Tarzan buy his clothes?
At a jungle sale

Etc. etc.

Hmmm. I learned something today.

You're right. The jokes ARE the most dangerous part...

or maybe it's the paper hat.

 

[WadeF]

WadeF,
Also I disagree with you in that you think that it is unreasonable to expect parents to train a child in the basics of knife/firearm handling,as it takes very little time to train a child how to properly handle and care for a knife. as for firearm training this takes a little more time (try taking them to a range).

In other words their is no excuse for a parent to not train their child on these matters. after all this is part of being a parent (is it not)?

I think it would be a good idea too, but we don't live in a perfect world and the majority of parents aren't going to think to train their kids how to handle a fire arm.

The point I was trying to make about the glass in the cupcake is that of course it shouldn't be there and no parent should be liable if their kid ate a cupcake with glass in it. Just like if a parent buys a party popper and doesn't expect there to be a knife in it they shouldn't be labeled as bad parents if their kid finds a knife in it and ends up hurting themself.

Another thing is, what if the kid gets the knife and then the parent decides they don't want their kid to have the knife. Maybe the kid has mental problems and can't be trusted, or whatever. They now have to upset the kid and take their prize away.

 

[spyder8]

a knife handgun rifle shotgun machinegun handgrenade or a freaking NUCLEAR BOMB will NOT kill a person if it is just sitting on a table!!!!!!! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL PEOPLE THIS!!!!!!

A SHOELACE (used as a garote wire) IN THE HANDS OF A VIOLENT PERSON IS MORE DABGEROUS THAN A PEACEFUL LAW-ABIDING PERSON SITTING ON 100LBS OF SEMTEX (high explosive) AND HUNDREDS OF FIREARMS

it's things like this that make it impossable to get ccw in illinois :grumpy: :grumpy: :grumpy:

 

[allyourblood]

i think some people's view of knives and their fondness for them is getting in the way of common sense.

i like knives, they're super-terrific, 100% happy time. but if someone gives me one of these Cracker-dealies, and it may possibly contain a real knife (or a hat pin, or a set of 6 sewing needles, or anything sharp), i better freaking know about it before i'm expected to open it.

put a knife in the thing all day long, or a loaded pistol for all i care. i just can't believe the company didn't put a warning ("potentially sharp or dangerous items inside") on the package.

also, people shouldn't have to train their 4 or 5 year old to expect a toy to have a fully functional knife, unless the product is unavailable to children, due to an age restriction.

abe m.

 

[socintel]

WadeF,

The point I was trying to make about the glass in the cupcake is that of course it shouldn't be there and no parent should be liable if their kid ate a cupcake with glass in it. Just like if a parent buys a party popper and doesn't expect there to be a knife in it they shouldn't be labeled as bad parents if their kid finds a knife in it and ends up hurting themself.

Another thing is, what if the kid gets the knife and then the parent decides they don't want their kid to have the knife. Maybe the kid has mental problems and can't be trusted, or whatever. They now have to upset the kid and take their prize away.

Once again as I have said before they should be required to put a "parental supervision recommended" label on it. Giving the responsible parent "NO EXCUSES".

As for taking it away from a (Immature/Mentally handicapped)(child/Individual)
that is another aspect of raising a child.
And while that may be tough, as the mature responsible parent you have an obligation to, well in harsh words (deal with it!!!)


BTW, I just wanted to say that it has been a pleasure to debate with
you but I have got to go.

 

[Will P.]

a knife handgun rifle shotgun machinegun handgrenade or a freaking NUCLEAR BOMB will NOT kill a person if it is just sitting on a table!!!!!!! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL PEOPLE THIS!!!!!!

A SHOELACE (used as a garote wire) IN THE HANDS OF A VIOLENT PERSON IS MORE DABGEROUS THAN A PEACEFUL LAW-ABIDING PERSON SITTING ON 100LBS OF SEMTEX (high explosive) AND HUNDREDS OF FIREARMS

it's things like this that make it impossable to get ccw in illinois :grumpy: :grumpy: :grumpy:

You sound a bit disconnected from reality.

Like it or not, companies are liable for their products. The mayor's fault lies in generalizing that all knives are evil.

I love explosives and guns and knives as much as the next man, but I can understand how parents would react badly to a pocketknife where they expected a child's toy.