Ultimate quench oil for 5160

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Daniel Fairly Knives

Daniel Fairly Knives

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I know we have had a lot of talk about quenching lately but I want to know! What oil is the right speed for 5160 steel?

It seems fast oil may be too fast and medium speed may be too slow.

I have 11 second and 28 second oil but I will buy another oil if it is better.

I have used fast oil with success and always test my knives but it seems it could cause undue stress in the steel. 28 second oil works as well but I am worried it might not get my steel to potential. What should I do! :eek:
 
I think as long as you have control of your temps, you will get better results with the fast oil. Not that this beats having the optimum oil for the steel.... but between the two you have, I would choose the faster with a longer soak in the low austenitizing range.

ETA: Thanks for that TTT chart link, Page. It seems my above advice would be a little on the extreme side, compared to just sticking wth a slower oil. Incidentally, I am all out of 5160 stock and was thinking of ordering more... but am now questioning the "long-soak-low-temp-fast-oil" alternative. Is it too risky with 5160?
 
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Rick Marchand said:
I think as long as you have control of your temps, you will get better results with the fast oil. Not that this beats having the optimum oil for the steel.... but between the two you have, I would choose the faster with a longer soak in the low austenitizing range.
Click to expand...

I have a digitally controlled kiln and have been soaking at 1525F for 5-10 minutes after a short preheat at 1250F.

Do you think something more like 1500F would be a better temperature with the faster oil? Would the faster oil give you "more conversion?'

Thanks for taking the time to help me out Rick!
 
That is my line of thinking but I have dropped the ball in my interpretation of metallurgical principle in the past, often enough.:(:rolleyes: Really, Daniel... my way is just compensating for not having the proper oil and after seeing the chart, I'm questioning whether it is too risky. I'm interested in what the guys with the big minds have to say. Page?
 
Rick Marchand said:
That is my line of thinking but I have dropped the ball in my interpretation of metallurgical principle in the past, often enough.:(:rolleyes: Really, Daniel... my way is just compensating for not having the proper oil and after seeing the chart, I'm questioning whether it is too risky. I'm interested in what the guys with the big minds have to say. Page?
Click to expand...

Thanks again Rick! I do tons of reading almost daily about heat treating but there is so much to learn, I have only seen the tip of the iceberg.
 
Here is a generic chemistry of 5160

http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/5160.asp#chemistry

Looking at the IT-TTT on Kevin's site you want to go from 1300 to 800 or less in ten seconds or less to obtain 100% conversion of available austentite to martensite if I am reading the chart correctly, AAA should be fine, my opinion is that Canola may cause stresses since it doesn't slow down as much as the steel is starting to distort as it changes crystalline volume during the phase changes, that said it should give you conversion, just might give you pings as well.

http://www.cashenblades.com/steel/5160.html

Here is the hypoeutechtoid section of the relevant sticky

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/673173-Working-the-three-steel-types.

-Page
 
I quench 5160 in 11 second oil all the time and have never cracked a blade. I stress relieve at about 1200 then Austenitize at 1525 and soak for 8-10 minutes. I also use it for 52100. I know its a little fast for both steels but I've never had a problem.
 
I use Houghton Quench K, which has a 7-9sec speed but says it's engineer to control distortion...... too fast?
 
Daniel, I have been using 11 sec. Oil on my 5160 as well. Am looking forward to reading more in this thread. unfortunately the TTT diagrams are still too confusing for me to fully grasp. I recently have had some ping issues with my 11 sec. stuff.
 
darrin sanders said:
I quench 5160 in 11 second oil all the time and have never cracked a blade. I stress relieve at about 1200 then Austenitize at 1525 and soak for 8-10 minutes. I also use it for 52100. I know its a little fast for both steels but I've never had a problem.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input Darrin! Much appreciated.
 
sunshadow said:
Here is a generic chemistry of 5160

http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/5160.asp#chemistry

Looking at the IT-TTT on Kevin's site you want to go from 1300 to 800 or less in ten seconds or less to obtain 100% conversion of available austentite to martensite if I am reading the chart correctly, AAA should be fine, my opinion is that Canola may cause stresses since it doesn't slow down as much as the steel is starting to distort as it changes crystalline volume during the phase changes, that said it should give you conversion, just might give you pings as well.

http://www.cashenblades.com/steel/5160.html

Here is the hypoeutechtoid section of the relevant sticky

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/673173-Working-the-three-steel-types.

-Page
Click to expand...

Thanks for the links Page, I am going to go and reread all of that stuff. It seems a little more sinks in every time. :D
 
RyanW said:
Daniel, I have been using 11 sec. Oil on my 5160 as well. Am looking forward to reading more in this thread. unfortunately the TTT diagrams are still too confusing for me to fully grasp. I recently have had some ping issues with my 11 sec. stuff.
Click to expand...

Those charts are so arcane! ;) :D :D :p
 
Either way. It's not difficult to harden and I've never seen one crack from a fast oil.

If you use a fast oil with an interrupted quench, should be close to ideal... but a slow oil would also be fine.

Parks #50 is the only one I can think of that might be too fast. Canola should be fine with the interrupt. I have heard of folks quenching it in water, but wouldn't recommend that.
 
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Right now I'm using Parks 50 with 52100 and CruForgeV. The only problems I've had thus far are some warpage on second and third quenches with 52100, and some unplanned reverse sori on a large 52100 blade. After reading about thin CruForge blades cracking in P50, I'm not pushing it too far.

I do plan to get a slower oil for deep hardening steels, which is why I came in to read this thread. Maybe I'll get McMaster 28 sec.
 
I might go with the same game plan as you Salem.... but first... I want to see what it takes to crack blades in my HQ-K.
 
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