Urban survival knife?

Cool. Thanks for the clarification cmdionne. I agree with your south of Saginaw decision. I have my boundries too.
 
You might laugh but in my book bag I keep a Cold Steel GI Tanto. Mainly because I want to have a (literally) sharpened prybar/chisel to force doors or hack away at anything I need to in the event of an earthquake.

The GI tanto is ugly and not as thick as some of the serious prybar knives, but it's cheap and lightweight and I don't really want to carry my Scrapyard all the time in case of an obscure emergency, as it's pretty heavy.

Of course in a pocket etc I have a Vic Farmer and generally a Gene Ingram Lacer on my belt.
 
Picking a knife for urban survival, you may want to keep one thing in mind. The leagality of possesing it in an urban area.

Since I live in the outskirts of the Washington D.C. suburbs, and spend time in D.C. as well as frequent trips to N.Y. city via rail from D.C. one thing has stood out. Because of the threat from terrorisim, and the increased scope of homeland security, I have seen bag searches at random in both the N.Y subway system as well as the D.C. metro rail system.

A city being a city, it's not a good idea to have some mall ninja tactical fixed blade in your bag if you run into a random check in one of those cities. At the least, you will be hauled in for some serious questoning "downtown", with possable charges against you. I've run into security checks at both Union Station and Grand Central Station, and various stops in Washinton and New York.

Again, a city being a city, you will not need a fixed blade knife. If some disaster happens, short of bio or nuclear, and immediate evacuation is not needed, there is a zillion places to find shelter to get out of the elements. You will need a good sharp small cuttiing tool for odd things from food to plastic packaging, or cutting cordage from any of the window blinds/curtains/shades. Something sharp enough to cut and lift sections of carpet from the floor to pad a make shift sleeping area. Heck, any of that can be done with a Stanley utility knife or a sak.

For most of my D.C. and NYC travels, I've used a Victorinox farmer, and it doesn't hardly get a second glance from either Metro or subway security personel. Only once it got a comment, and that was one cop remarking how handy sak's were. And in a crunch, the saw on the farmer is invaluble.

With one sak in a pocket, and a second back up in a pack, you'll be set to handle most of what comes along. If you think you may need to pry up something, carry a large screwdriver in a daypack. It's alot better prying tool than a knife, and easier as well as cheaper to replace.

What you will need more than anything is cash. In Downtown NY on 9-11, the ATM's didn't work, but alot of stores were still open away from the immediate disaster zone. it was cash and carry. No checks, credit cards, or ATM withdrawls.

More important that a fixed blade knife will be bandanas for dust mask use, leather work gloves, good shoes you can walk a long way in, and a couple bottles of water in your pack.

If you're caught in an urban disaster, it's because you were in that city for either buisness or turisim. In other words, just going about your buisness. In that case, be sure you're within the local laws.
 
RescueRiley said:
JK ewok...the blade is smll enough to be sheeple friendly, but the blade is robust enough to be super sturdy, that and a leatherman wave are my edc and the whole thing will fit into your pocket, there is always a rat izula, or a becker necker as well... I think if you put some scales on the bk-11 and took the coating off you'd have a real dandy.
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RR...do yo have a pic of that EWOK? You keep talking about it, but I can't find a pic...

Hi-Jack over
 
Fonly said:
well, I got the MAC-1:O

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That looks like a good choice for your requirements.
I've got a few of the CountyComm breacher bars that I carry & they really do keep you from beating on your knife at times.
It's the one at the right side in the pic:
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They're also good for digging rocks/fossils out of the mud.
Won't get it as sharp as the one you bought though.

Cliff
 
If I need a knife bigger than my Fallkniven U2 or the LM Fuse I just bring my Fallkniven H1.
We dont have those confusing "concealed weapons" antics here.
Big fixed in backpack with camping gear, OK.
Big fixed in backpack with pipe bombs and balaclava, verboten.
 
ROCK...that is why I bought, and will suggest to the OP, the Gerber Hinderer. Sure, it may be a little high for someone not necessarily in the SAR, etc fields, but it is a damn tough hunk of steel and can be played off easily as a 'rescue tool' of 'precautionary measure.' Nobody would say 'boo' at someone carrying one in the care as a just in case measure I don't think.
 
I've been kicking this idea around too about a good small fixed blade. I really like Busse's Game Warden. If I get one I think I'd get a kydex sheath that can be configured for both neck carry and belt carry with a tek lok.
 
Fonly, those look pretty nice.

I've had my Camillus Becker Necker tucked in my jacket pocket for a couple years now and wouldn't trade it. I hear the new Ka-Bar ones are good, too.

Sorry to drift, but has anyone reviewed the two versions side-by-side?
 
I'm not sure how important a fixed blade knife is for urban carry but that's, of course, your choice. Other than my SAK Classic which I've carried an example of for over 30 years I've replaced (for regular carry) my Buck 501 with a mini-Griptilian. Thumb stud, plain MDP blade. It clips to my pants pocket and will do any urban task my Classic won't that I'm likely to need.

Living in Idaho is a wonderful thing for freedom loving citizens.
 
DaleW said:
The conversation leans to self defense. IMHO, just putting up a fight is going to deter a lot of one-on-one confrontations. It gets down to a paper-scissor-rock game. The one person I know who was mugged was grabbed by three guys with a baseball bat, which you can't do much about-- they came up behind him. Even a gun would have been useless and they frisked him, so they probably would have gotten the gun too.
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Of course there was something he could do. I mean, was he dealing with ninjas? When I was a Courier, I went to Shock Trauma in Baltimore to pick up a set of kidneys that they just removed from a deceased car accident victim and they generally had to go across town to Johns Hopkins for tissue typing, etc., and because we did so much organ and blood pick-ups and deliveries, I was allowed to park out front. I watched this guy in a lab coat walk across the street without a care in the world at night. He was looking at the road and was almost hit by a car for his trouble. I followed him in through the vestibule area and walked up to the guard behind the desk and just verified where I had to go and I asked him, "Who is that guy?" Turned out the guy walking across the road that was almost hit by the car was a top-notch trauma surgeon.

In an OR with a 9mm round in your chest, you want that guy, but some of these people even though they deal with the remnants of violence in their every day life, it's their business, they have their head up their ass, they have blind spots in life because they have no personal awareness. This is the same type of lifestyle that allows three guys on a city street to walk up behind someone with a baseball bat, of all damned things, and have a successful robbery.

Remember the thread, "Redundancy: Cautionary or Paranoid?" Nothing would have helped your friend because he was every bit as careless as a person that enters the woods without basic essentials for survival...you know, then they have to be "rescued." I cited the defensive driving model for living your life in whatever environment you find yourself in. We would criticize someone who ignored all of the warning signs of an impending bear attack like being in close proximity to a bear cub. Yet, when it comes to being basically surrounded by predatory human beings, we give people a pass all of the time.

If people are not going to cultivate the mindset that they are basically living in an environment filled with land sharks, then they shouldn't be carrying any type of weapon because it's pointless and a liability to everyone around them.

Now, walking around a corner and being confronted with three guys and they have any number of various weapons is another story, you maneuver around them and then you act accordingly based on their actions in the situation.

Urban survival has a lot of different skills, it's like walking down a trail and not paying attention to sounds that might signify that a bear is close by or not paying attention to the fact that you have a bear cub 30 yards in front of you...where is the mother?

I wrote this short article...probably around 2000? Don't remember, a few helpful tips and tricks can be found there: http://www.donrearic.com/environment.html


I don't carry a firearm, but it is the first thing that comes to mind for urban self defense. Handling situations like roving gangs of teenagers is the most difficult situation I can think of and a firearm would be my weapon of choice there -- I can't run very fast!
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It's not always wise to turn your back and run when confronted with one attacker, let alone several. The concealed handgun is the King of Street Self-defense even though edged and impact weapons are definitely viable alternatives even though they will leave you at a disadvantage in some circumstances.

Other than that, pepper spray comes to mind-- no contact, works past arm's reach, cheap and light. Your local laws may vary.
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If you carry it, you should consider it only as a means to use unarmed combat on an attacker because you can never rely on it actually stopping a violent attacker. If it does, great!

All of your further thoughts on civil unrest and disaster situations with tools to confront those problems are great.

Rupestris said:
- 750.227. (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk,
stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of
any length, or any dangerous weapon, except a hunting
knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about
his or her person, or whether concealed or otherwise in
any vehicle... except in his or her dwelling house [or]
place of business... (3) A person who violates this
section is guilty of a felony...


The way it was explained to me was, "adapted and carried as such" means one would have to be hunting in order to make it legal. If you aren't carrying it as a hunting knife, you shouldn't be carrying it.

Of course the person that explained it to me could be misinterpreting it. I'll look further into it.
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It's always a can of worms with these laws. A lot of people in law enforcement would consider something like an Al Mar SERE 2000 to be double edged because it has a swedge.

What is "concealed?" Depends on who you talk to. The pocket clip being visible in some places means it's not concealed but arguments have been made against that as well.

cmdionne said:
You're right, if you're carrying one CONCEALED it must be a hunting knife adapted and carried as such. This is an affirmative defense, meaning the burden to prove this fact is on the defendant and not the prosecution. However if the knife is not concealed, you're good to go.
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I think what the original poster was pointing out was the fact that you're still going to get hassled by a lot of law enforcement personnel anyway, even if it is legal.

Several friends and family members are LEO's and I've been told that knife charges are usually secondary to other offenses. Just never refer to your knive(s) as weapons or say they are for self defense. They've all told me not to worry about the knife I was carrying as long as I wasn't committing any crimes.
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Yes, and that tells you the truth of the situation people in many jurisdictions face, self-defense is legal only if you use government approved devices. In some areas that don't have "shall issue" concealed carry permits, that means you basically have the right to use your bare hands against knives, clubs and guns. The country is littered with a hodge-podge of vague and stupid laws scribbled by control freaks and idiots.

If you carry a knife and you cannot say you carry it for self-defense they are basically telling you that self-defense is illegal, especially in areas where it is impossible to obtain a handgun permit. If really had the right to defend yourself, you should be able to do it with whatever you have at hand. Since self-defense is supposed to be legal, why should it matter if you are carrying some type of knife that is otherwise legal? The information you have been given is correct and it's sad, i.e., even if you are carrying a "legal knife," if you should make the mistake of telling the TRUTH about self-defense being one of the reasons why you carry it, you might get arrested.
 
I guess this one would be my urban survival knife. It is always on my belt or in my pocket, along with a SAK farmer, or multitool. :thumbup:

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You know, I was kinda suprised, I thought Id open this up and see a bunch of FBMs or
BK9s. Truth is in an urban situation, more then likely your survival knife is gonna be the one you have on you. At least untill you can get to your good stuff.;)
 
The legal limit in Chicago is 2.5 inches so I got a couple of fixed blades made just for Chicago.
The 2nd from the right is an Anza and is a tank.
The third from the right is a forged blade from Colin Cox and is like a surgical instrument. :)

fixedblade.jpg
 
I would vote for a RAT RC-3 as the ideal fixed knife for urban survival, though I'm not a fan of carrying fixed knives in the city.
 
I find my Busse game warden does it for me,but i have been in some areas where i would have liked to have my Battle Mistress along, G.M
 
Couple of things in Canada there is not limit on blade size.
However a knife cannot be carried for self defense, that's why it is always a tool.
Pepper spray is legal to carry for use on dogs, but not people.

Fonly
Doesn't Calgary have a bylaw against having knives visible when you carry them (including a clip when pocket carring)?
 
Two county sheriff's deputies told me that if you could sit with a fb in your pocket without doing yourself an injury, you were good to go, as neither the county nor the state statutes addressed that. One municipality within that county, however, says no fb - no folders 3" or longer - and no knives or CCWs whatsoever within 1,000 feet of a school. You must be cognizant of all laws within the local area in which you travel. 'Ignorance' is no defense.

A great deal in a PSK knife for urban use, although as delivered, it's sheath is a nightmare, is the Gerber LMK II - and they can still be found at a decent price. Of course, smashing through windows/windshields - cutting through door panels - may be a good capability to have - if it weren't in your BOB in the trunk when you needed it to exit your sinking car. My son gave me one, so I must find a use for it! I wonder what a vehicle search that finds that - or even the mini-crowbar - could result in, charge wise. Of course, as the old adage goes, a good DA could indict a ham sandwich (The last one I had from a sandwich shop should have been!).

Stainz
 
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