USPS Insurance Dealings

heefageLA

heefageLA

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Ok guys. I have a bit of a rant here.

Not sure if this even belongs here, but yall need to be informed in case a similar situation occurs.

I just sold an Ontario Bagwell Bowie 'Hell's Belle' on ebay. It sold for $480. That price is not what I paid for the knife, but it is a collectible so the price is purely subjective.
I put $800 worth of insurance on the knife so both parties would be covered if a claim was filed. I explained the reason behind the $800 worth of insurance to the cashier in case she thought I was trying to make a profit from the lost or damaged package.

She proceeded to inform me that USPS decides how much of the insurance claim is paid back. In other words they only pay you back for what they think the item is worth.

I got a little flustered and told her that the knife was a collectible and the price is subjective for different people. Ive seen the same knife sale for anywhere to $200 all the way up to $600 before.

Then she said that they would have to investigate the item and see what the retail price is. I said to her that the retail price is no where near the value of the knife now because, wait for it, It Is A Collectible!

By this time me and the girl were both a little frustrated. I was almost pissed off because the USPS is basically lying to people about their insurance coverage. The $800 insurance I put on the package will not be payed in full.
The Post Office gets to make up whatever price they feel is necessary is cover the claim.

So, long story short, if you ever sale something that a has a subjective value, you might get screwed if the package gets lost or damaged, insurance or not... :mad:
 
o. For collectible items, a sales receipt, paid invoice or bill of sale, or statement of value from a reputable dealer(i.e., a licensed business owner who is qualified to estimate value or cost of repairs for the item) must be provided as described in 3.2a

3.2
Proof of Value
Either the mailer or the addressee must submit acceptable proof to establish the cost or value of the article at the time it was mailed. Proof of value should be submitted electronically or attached to the claim form under 1.5; otherwise, the claim cannot be processed. Other proof may be requested to help determine an accurate value. Examples are:

a. A sales receipt, paid invoice or bill of sale, or statement of value from a reputable dealer.
b. Paid repair bills; if the claim is for partial damage, estimates of repair costs or appraisals from a reputable dealer. Repair costs may not exceed the original purchase price.
c. Receipt or invoice for the costs incurred to buy a surety bond required to reissue a lost item.
d. Receipt or invoice of costs incurred for the reconstruction of nonnegotiable documents.
e. A copy of a credit card statement or other documentation indicating the amount paid.
f. For Internet transactions conducted through a Web-based payment network that offers payment services through a stored value account, provide a computer printout of the online transaction identifying the purchaser and seller, price paid, date of transaction, description of item purchased, and assurance that the transaction status is completed. The printout must clearly identify the Web-based payment network provider through which the Internet transaction was conducted.


That clerk needs to read her manual........
 
Thankyou.

So, they still would only pay back what the item was sold for. Not what the insurance claim was said to pay.

In the end, somebody would still get screwed, right?
 
heefageLA said:
Ok guys. I have a bit of a rant here.

Not sure if this even belongs here, but yall need to be informed in case a similar situation occurs.

I just sold an Ontario Bagwell Bowie 'Hell's Belle' on ebay. It sold for $480. That price is not what I paid for the knife, but it is a collectible so the price is purely subjective.
I put $800 worth of insurance on the knife so both parties would be covered if a claim was filed. I explained the reason behind the $800 worth of insurance to the cashier in case she thought I was trying to make a profit from the lost or damaged package.

She proceeded to inform me that USPS decides how much of the insurance claim is paid back. In other words they only pay you back for what they think the item is worth.

I got a little flustered and told her that the knife was a collectible and the price is subjective for different people. Ive seen the same knife sale for anywhere to $200 all the way up to $600 before.

Then she said that they would have to investigate the item and see what the retail price is. I said to her that the retail price is no where near the value of the knife now because, wait for it, It Is A Collectible!

By this time me and the girl were both a little frustrated. I was almost pissed off because the USPS is basically lying to people about their insurance coverage. The $800 insurance I put on the package will not be payed in full.
The Post Office gets to make up whatever price they feel is necessary is cover the claim.

So, long story short, if you ever sale something that a has a subjective value, you might get screwed if the package gets lost or damaged, insurance or not... :mad:
Click to expand...

I've got to say I don't really see a problem here. An item is only worth what it is sold for. That is its monetary value. That is what you should pay to cover. You said it yourself, that you over insured to cover double what the item was sold for. When the USPS investigate they will ask for the proof of value which will be the transaction paper trail (receipt usually). This is how you prove how much the item is worth. Trying to claim double might be fraudulent. Hopefully Esav or Monofletch will chime in to explain this better.
 
craytab said:
I've got to say I don't really see a problem here. An item is only worth what it is sold for. That is its monetary value. That is what you should pay to cover. You said it yourself, that you over insured to cover double what the item was sold for. When the USPS investigate they will ask for the proof of value which will be the transaction paper trail (receipt usually). This is how you prove how much the item is worth. Trying to claim double might be fraudulent. Hopefully Esav or Monofletch will chime in to explain this better.
Click to expand...


Im not trying to make a profit from an insurance claim. Just trying to cover both parties in case something happens. I don't want to be stuck with a loss any more than the buyer does.
 
Monofletch said:
o. For collectible items, a sales receipt, paid invoice or bill of sale, or statement of value from a reputable dealer(i.e., a licensed business owner who is qualified to estimate value or cost of repairs for the item) must be provided as described in 3.2a

3.2
Proof of Value
Either the mailer or the addressee must submit acceptable proof to establish the cost or value of the article at the time it was mailed. Proof of value should be submitted electronically or attached to the claim form under 1.5; otherwise, the claim cannot be processed. Other proof may be requested to help determine an accurate value. Examples are:

a. A sales receipt, paid invoice or bill of sale, or statement of value from a reputable dealer.
b. Paid repair bills; if the claim is for partial damage, estimates of repair costs or appraisals from a reputable dealer. Repair costs may not exceed the original purchase price.
c. Receipt or invoice for the costs incurred to buy a surety bond required to reissue a lost item.
d. Receipt or invoice of costs incurred for the reconstruction of nonnegotiable documents.
e. A copy of a credit card statement or other documentation indicating the amount paid.
f. For Internet transactions conducted through a Web-based payment network that offers payment services through a stored value account, provide a computer printout of the online transaction identifying the purchaser and seller, price paid, date of transaction, description of item purchased, and assurance that the transaction status is completed. The printout must clearly identify the Web-based payment network provider through which the Internet transaction was conducted.


That clerk needs to read her manual........
Click to expand...

And there you go. Just like a lot of things, if you read the fine print you rarely get screwed.
 
heefageLA said:
Im not trying to make a profit from an insurance claim. Just trying to cover both parties in case something happens. I don't want to be stuck with a loss any more than the buyer does.
Click to expand...

But if the item disapers you refund the buyers money and then claim the insurance. The buyer has his/her money back and you have the money from the insurance that the buyer would have originally paid. That is what insurance is for, no?
 
If I buy a Pm2 s30v from you for $100. You ship it and insure it for $1,000,000 and it gets lost during transit. Even though you insured it for $1,000,000 You will only get what you can prove.
Collecables would be a little diffetent.
 
craytab said:
No, you refund the buyers money. Then you collect on the insurance.
Click to expand...

Who in their right mind would think you could recover an insurance payment that's double the value of the item lost?
 
Last edited:
If it sold for $480 it should be insured for $480. That will cover both parties. If lost or stolen the buyer will get their $480 back that they paid through PP and the seller gets the $480 from the insurance. You both break even. None of the carriers will just pay you what you insure for. They pay the value of the item and will require proof of the value. Even the $480 will have to have proof.
 
Thankyou all for clarifying.

I feel about as dense as a rock right now.


In my defense, the cashier wasn't helping the confusion any... :o
 
Last edited:
Wait I actually am confused! In the event of a lost item, does PayPal refund the buyer?

My mind is all in knots now.

Example.
I buy a knife for 100 dollars.
It is worth 100 dollars.
It gets lost in the mail.
100 dollars is collected from insurance.
If I'm refunded, the seller has no knife and no money.
If I'm not refunded, the seller has the value of the knife back but I don't have a knife.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
VermontEdge said:
Wait I actually am confused! In the event of a lost item, does PayPal refund the buyer?

My mind is all in knots now.

Example.
I buy a knife for 100 dollars.
It is worth 100 dollars.
It gets lost in the mail.
100 dollars is collected from insurance.
If I'm refunded, the seller has no knife and no money.
If I'm not refunded, the seller has the value of the knife back but I don't have a knife.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...


This was my thinking as well.

If I sell a knife for $100. I receive the money, then ship the knife. I have the $100.

If the knife gets lost, I still have the $100, I refund the original $100, then I file a claim for the other $100.

In the end you would still be out of a knife, but both parties would be payed their part.
 
VermontEdge said:
Wait I actually am confused! In the event of a lost item, does PayPal refund the buyer?

My mind is all in knots now.

Example.
I buy a knife for 100 dollars.
It is worth 100 dollars.
It gets lost in the mail.
100 dollars is collected from insurance.
If I'm refunded, the seller has no knife and no money.
If I'm not refunded, the seller has the value of the knife back but I don't have a knife.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

If you don't refund it voluntarily, paypal will do it for you and take the funds from you or your backup funding source or break you knee caps. If you are a good seller there is no need for paypal to do any of those things. You refund the money to the buyer and either eat the loss because you didn't pay for insurance or you get your money back from the insurance.
 
heefageLA said:
Me either! And I was pretty much arguing with the postal lady...
Click to expand...

Lol I'm glad you got it figured out, I thought I was gonna read through all that and find you down here still refusing to accept the facts. But as craytab said, we all have those moments once in a while.

For the record though, I bought a knife a while back for $450, the original retail price on it was $350-$375, something like that, well it got lost in the mail and the insurance did pay the $450 since that it what it was sold for. I'm sure there are scams out there that USPS has to watch for in some cases of "collector value" though.
 
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