Wharncliffe vs. Quasi-Sheepsfoot

Chronovore

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... I open a lot of boxes/clamshell packages ...

Clamshell packages fall into the precision, utility, or craft cutting spectrum where this kind of knife excels. While I like a Wharncliffe in this role, I find the sheep or lamb foot blades most comfortable to use on clamshell packaging.
 
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Top one here pictured is the Cold Steel "Frenzy" . Not my favorite name for a knife , but still an excellent design for SD and also useful for utility . :cool::thumbsup::thumbsup:

I'm confused that anyone could handle either of these knives ( or other similar models ) and still doubt that a folder can serve adequately for SD . :confused:

 

Chronovore

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Top one here pictured is the Cold Steel "Frenzy" . Not my favorite name for a knife , but still an excellent design for SD and also useful for utility . :cool::thumbsup::thumbsup:

I'm confused that anyone could handle either of these knives ( or other similar models ) and still doubt that a folder can serve adequately for SD . :confused:

The biggest issue isn't lock failure, strength, length, etc.

It's time and steps to effective deployment. Real defensive encounters can be quick and chaotic. We often see debates in the gun community over different holster types, speed of draw, manual safeties, etc.; and that's already at the top of the curve for defense. With knives, fixed blades in good sheaths that allow for a full grip on the draw are best. The problem with folders (aside from already starting with a lower-tier defensive tool) is that you are automatically adding a bunch of time, steps, failure points, and even possibilities for self-injury in the process between noticing a threat and having a defensive tool ready for use.

Those steps include getting a sufficient grip to remove it from the pocket, opening it successfully and sufficiently to engage the lock, and then getting a good grip for effective use--plus any hand repositioning that has to take place in between all those steps--all while something crazy might be happening, the adrenaline could be flowing, you might have someone or something on top of you and aggressively trying to harm you, and you might already be hurt or in a compromised position. Good grief, you could be in the middle of dinner and have butter fingers. The point is that nobody knows exactly what kind of defensive encounter will occur until it does so anything we can do to streamline the process for safety and effectiveness is a good thing.
 
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The biggest issue isn't lock failure, strength, length, etc.

It's time and steps to effective deployment. Real defensive encounters can be quick and chaotic. We often see debates in the gun community over different holster types, speed of draw, manual safeties, etc.; and that's already at the top of the curve for defense. With knives, fixed blades in good sheaths that allow for a full grip on the draw are best. The problem with folders (aside from already starting with a lower-tier defensive tool) is that you are automatically adding a bunch of time, steps, failure points, and even possibilities for self-injury in the process between noticing a threat and having a defensive tool ready for use.

Those steps include getting a sufficient grip to remove it from the pocket, opening it successfully and sufficiently to engage the lock, and then getting a good grip for effective use--plus any hand repositioning that has to take place in between all those steps--all while something crazy might be happening, the adrenaline could be flowing, you might have someone or something on top of you and aggressively trying to harm you, and you might already be hurt or in a compromised position. Good grief, you could be in the middle of dinner and have butter fingers. The point is that nobody knows exactly what kind of defensive encounter will occur until it does so anything we can do to streamline the process for safety and effectiveness is a good thing.
:) I think this all depends on how you train and practice .

I carry front pocket , wave openers .

I can have the knife out and open as fast as I can raise my hand from my pocket .

I don't have to think about it . It's pure reflex by now .

Nothing is faster ...for ME . (Except maybe a cane or walking stick which is already in hand and up front .)

YMMV . You should use whatever method and gear works for YOU best . :cool::thumbsup:

A major factor for me personally , is that I just don't want to carry a fixed blade and sheath large enough to equal my larger folders . Personal preference for comfort , convenience , and ease of concealment .

I can front pocket carry even an XL Espada with no problem vs an equivalent OAL fixed with sheath . :p:thumbsup:

 

Chronovore

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:) I think this all depends on how you train and practice .

I carry front pocket , wave openers .

I can have the knife out and open as fast as I can raise my hand from my pocket .

I don't have to think about it . It's pure reflex by now .

Nothing is faster ...for ME . (Except maybe a cane or walking stick which is already in hand and up front .)

YMMV . You should use whatever method and gear works for YOU best . :cool::thumbsup:

A major factor for me personally , is that I just don't want to carry a fixed blade and sheath large enough to equal my larger folders . Personal preference for comfort , convenience , and ease of concealment .

I can front pocket carry even an XL Espada with no problem vs an equivalent OAL fixed with sheath . :p:thumbsup:

The wave might be better and you might be good with it, but is it really faster or more reliable than a fixed blade in a good sheath? There might be less steps than a knife that opens with thumb studs, a flipper tab, etc. but there are still more steps, and more chances at either failure or self-injury, than with a fixed blade in the right sheath. After a lot of assessment, there is a subsection of defensive encounters in which a folder could be very helpful but there are also several where relying on it could have the opposite effect. I've come to the point on this issue that I'd rather see people work on their empty-handed skills than choose a folder for self defense.

One difficulty here is that real hands-on training can be a challenge. For instance, you'd need a dummy version of your wave knife or something comparable enough for testing. You can buy trainer models with a wave function but getting your exact knife could be tough. (You could always make one by grinding the point and edge off of a suitable sacrifice.) Then get a comparable fixed blade trainer in a good sheath and mount it properly. Then practice by having a competent friend, sparring partner, trainer, etc. accost and try to forcibly manhandle you in different ways from different starting positions. See if you run into any difficulties getting the tool out and successfully into action, especially compared with the fixed blade. Be mindful of missing edge contact to either of you while in a scuffle. Obviously, you can only be so surprised or taken off guard in a controlled training environment but it should shed some light on the principle I'm trying to explain here.
 

Blues

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As this thread has moved way beyond the parameters intended in the OP...I'm going to say thanks to those who bothered to keep to the subject matter, and put it to rest.
 

Blues

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Let's try reopening this. I have received a few PM's from members requesting an opportunity to contribute to the topic.
 
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