What do you think about doing away with the brass tip on the scabbard?

Bill Martino

Bill Martino

Joined
Mar 5, 1999
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That's the question. Rather than brass we would put put a protective leather tip on the scabbard. Wouldn't ding, fall off, or stick your leg when you're climbing thru a barbed wire fence. I'm guessing it would hold up about as good as the brass. Not quite as traditional, tho.

How do you vote? Ideas and suggestions welcome.
 
This could work if it is done right. Would the tip be a softer leather like what is used on the frog? Let's try it and see what happens!
 
How about putting a leather edging around the edges and tip of the brass part of the scabbard, allowing the brass to show through on the sides ?


Foxy
 
I vote for keeping the brass-tip as is, but then I'm a traditionalist ;). B.
 
A hard leather, like that used in the liners of the JKM-1 and Kumar Karda sheathes, can be cut and wet-molded to fit the scabbard tip, and when dried and "laha'd on", should offer adequate tip protection. With a little ingenuity, patterns and possibly some tooling could make them very decorative as well. They might stay on better than the metal chape, and would be easier to replace if the laha did become loose. They might even come up with some color contrasts, as well - white or grey frog/chape on the black scabbards - dark brown on a tan scabbard - many possibilities.
 
While the brass tip looks good on a khukuri, I will not miss it. I would rather have more tip wear than punch marks in my leg.

Will
 
It should either be redesigned to make it more rounded, or removed. I would rather we go upscale and do a better job on the the traditional tip.

n2s
 
We'll keep track. I'm not sure if they will even do it but if enough like the idea I may be able to get them to change if I bark for 3 or 4 years.
 
Although I like the traditional design, I think practicality in this case would be better. For hanging on a wall the brass is fine but for use the rounded sounds like a lot less hassle.
 
The chape cannot be left off, due to the scabbard construction. The wooden halves are "shrink wrapped" in not-quite-cured leather, back-stitched while the leather is wet, and left to dry. This leaves the scabbard tip open (possibly with the wood exposed on some) and must be covered. A leather piece, shaped like a fan with four broad blades, could be pressed into a mold while wet to give it a primary shape, and then wet-molded to the scabbard tip when ready, glued, and left to dry. This is nearly as "labor intensive" as making and fitting the brass chape, and will require sarki skills and leather knowledge, therefore it shouldn't cause them to balk at the change as a cost saving measure. Some cost savings may come with the difference in use of leather vs. brass, but not if the grade of leather necessary is costly or difficult to obtain. Tooling is another thing. The grade of leather on the villager I received is far and above that on my other scabbards. Uncle says it is hard to tool, but the trade-off, IMO, is worth it. I have also wondered if what we perceive as "traditional" scabbard styles may not be more along the line of "business as usual" - ie: give them what they are used to seeing. I'm stymied by the picture of all these blade styles, from widely varying tribes, cultures and regions, all winding up in one scabbard design. The metal chape is all you see on everything from villagers to kothimodas, but there must be other styles out there. What we need is a "Sanu-Sarki" who can push the envelope just a little bit :rolleyes: One of the problems of making changes is in making a change that they are able to do. We tend to take for granted things that can only be done with a stamp press, while they are still stuck with home-made hand tools for the brass portion of their metal forming. While they may or may not balk at a change from what they are used to doing, the difference in pay rates between kamis and sarkis is a rub (it is a rub between machinists and tool & die makers in our shops, or any stepped-rate shop). If a change puts more work on the sarkis for the same pay, we have lost rather than gained. If there is time saved on their part, and they can make one or two more scabbards a day, everybody gains.
 
I am looking at two scabbards right now. One is the traditional HI with the brass tip, the other is one Terry made for me. Hard leather and no pointy brass tip. I like the idea Walosi came up with. A contrasting hard leather tip would look right sporty and wouldn't stab you. That gets my vote.
 
Keep the brass, but move it to the throat of the scabbard under the leather*, and replace the tip with tough leather molded.

*you know where - where every newbie and a ot of oldtimers who should know better grabs the scabbard with his left hand, fingers over the edge that sometimes gets cut through, to pull it out.
 
I vote to retain the brass but round it over. Then we'd have a chape that doesn't chafe!! While we're at it Uncle, how about a horn handle that doesn't crack, leather that doesn't check, and a sheath that won't swell and hold the blade captive. Oh yeah, and round the edges on the butt of the handle also. Oh, the blasphemy!!!!
 
I think I'm picking up some sarcasm in Mr. Satchell's post. I agree with the spirit that too much change isn't a good thing.. but a working knife that doesn't work isn't a good thing either.

Is it a feasable option to carry both brass and leather tipped scabbard?
 
Get rid of the chape or change the design!As a matter of fact I've removed the chape from most of my scabbards and I didnt put one on the ones that I've covered.
The hard leather cap seems to be a nice solution but I feel that it would be easier to change the actual design to a rounded one. My two cents.
Ciao
Fausto
 
Originally posted by fausto nasafiaschi
The hard leather cap seems to be a nice solution but I feel that it would be easier to change the actual design to a rounded one.

Ciao
Fausto
Click to expand...

I can/could live with that too, but I do believe that would be more labor intensive as well as using a bit more material.
Not very cost effective.
 
The scabbards Terry has been making for me have nicely rounded leather tips. I like this much better than the cheap looking brass points. I'll send Uncle Bill a pic and ask him to please post.:) :)
 
It's my impression that the brass chape is "traditional" only in the sense that it dates from the early 20th century, and was adapted from the military scabbards of WWI. Other than kothimoras, most of the 19th century scabbards I have seen, and many of the newer village models as well, are completely devoid of chapes, like the ones Terry makes. I think the frog (as opposed to sash style) and chape were military adaptations which have become standard for modern khukuris intended primarily for the export market. Like the thicker blades on the newer knives, they represent the kamis' perceptions of the needs/desires of their intended customers, rather than a traditional design, so the elimination of the brass chape shouldn't encounter too much resistance. Creation of a new and previously unknown leather chape, on the other hand, may get the same passive/aggressive resistance as other novel ideas have in the past.
 
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