What has changed...

jeffsaul said:
When I started this thread, although not stated, my thrust was custom knives. I find these items to be the truest expression of not only the customer, but the craftsperson as well.
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I buy custom knives occasionally, fifteen or twenty so far, but I find that custom "traditional" folders are beyond my financial comfort level.
 
I can personally attest that there is a new generation of men that is rediscovering the joys of pocket knife ownership due in part to Art of Manliness, specifically this article: Every Man should Carry a Pocket Knife. They even have a logo'd Boker trapper for sale in their store (not a sponsor, so no link).
 
I'm not sure, as I'm fairly new to this hobby, but I do see less and less "average guy" carry of pocket knives. I primarily hang around Scouters, so every single one of them carries some type of folder, more often than not a traditional style Case, Buck or Schrade. However, they don't really buy many knives, the ones they carry were purchased or received as gifts some time ago. I'm the only one in our Troop who has an obsessive collection of knives and am regularly kidded by our friends who want to know how many I have on me at any one time, usually 3 or 4 depending on situation and the number of pockets I have :D. Most days in jeans it's one clipped folder, one larger traditional in a pocket and one smaller in the coin pocket, with a SAK in a belt pouch.

Since I don't know what it was like in the past here I can't speculate, though I certainly have found quite the variety available and have purchased more than a few.
 
What has changed for me is the number of knives I have been accumulating. Probably 30 in the last year.:o
No sign of slowing down. :D

Best regards

Robin
 
I don't know. From what I see, I can only think that the Traditional market is as strong as it has been in a long time. Though it's a small company, nobody can deny the popularity of GEC. Queen is under new ownership that promises to change the issues we've been complaining about (butterknife edges, etc). Case is popular as always. When I look in the "What knife or knives are you carrying today" thread in General, I see more and more traditional knives. Way more than I saw a few years back.

The custom market seems to be going strong too, judging by quoted wait times, and how quickly knives by certain makers sell in the Exchange.
 
Blues said:
Some words of wisdom...(I've posted them in this forum previously but it bears repeating for the new generation and those in need of a reminder).

From "On Your Own In The Wilderness" by Colonel Townsend Whelen and Bradford Angier (1958):

"The most indispensable tool for a hunter or fisherman or camper, and in fact for any outdoor man and boy anywhere, is the knife-a businesslike knife, sharp and keen. Mrs. Whelen's aunt, who taught high school Latin for thirty years in Nebraska, had the right idea. She asked every class, "Which boys have a jackknife in their pocket?" The ones who had none did not rate very high with her.

Her philosophy was that if a boy did not have a knife and know how to use it, he was not likely to grow up able to do many things for himself...I have had a knife like this in my back pants pocket ever since I was knee-high to a chopping block."
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I like that.

Sadly like many things in modern life, that thinking has changed...
Nowadays if a kid is caught with a knife, he is a trouble maker. Most have never been taught how to use one. A lot of kids never get the experience of camping, fishing, or hunting either. That is sad, because they are missing out on some of life's great pleasures, and the next generation is not exposed to those things either.
The High School my son goes to is big. They are big on sports, and have taken State championships, and are rated as one of the best academically in the U.S... That said, Travis told me one day, "Dad. There are only two other kids in the school that he knows of, that hunt". The area the school is in, is not a working class area, and the kids that go there come from affluent families. Many drive SUV's, BMW's etc. No, we don't live in that area, and Trav doesn't drive either of those :D
But my point is, out of a school with 5,000 kids, most of those will never experience hunting, and because of the way they are raised, probably have no desire.

Kids and a lot of adults today don't want to be able to fend for themselves. Whether it is a simple task of cutting something for a small project, or being able to survive in the woods, if needed. No, I'm not talking a Prac-Tac survival situation :D

Like others, I have been known to change the style of knife I carry. Sometimes it is out of a perceived need, but usually it's just for change. I have only bought a few new Traditionals in the last year or so. Those were both GEC 72'S. It wasn't a matter of need, it was want, because I like the pattern, and they don't produce many that have a clip style blade. That and I just enjoy lookin at them. Well that and I enjoy hearing them click when they lock open.
I never have, and still don't think a knife has to lock, to be used safely, so I can't use that excuse...

As of late, I have pulled a Benchmade Mini Grip out, and it has been in pocket. Most of us here do actually own and enjoy both modern, and traditional knives, and there is nothing wrong with that. Variety is a good thing.

My son Travis is 16 1/2 years old. When he was born, I already had a game plan mapped out for him. I was going to teach him about guns at a very young age. First and most critical was safety. Handling, and shooting. Then we moved on to understanding the various types of guns, so he do handle and shoot all of the guns he would come into contact with safely. Then we moved on to care and cleaning.....

I also wanted to teach him how to hunt and fish, and basics like starting a fire, and how to properly use a knife as well as take care of it...

I wanted to make sure he learned these things correctly, at a young age, just in case something were to happen to me.
As he grew up I made sure he undertsood that I just wanted to make sure he knew and understood these things. I wasn't trying to force him into doing these things. It was entirely up to him. He also learned that it was ok to like things that were different from what I like.

Fortunately he has grown up to be a great kid, and he has a lot of th ebasics to help carry him through life. He figured out on his own, that he can have a variety of stuff.
He loves traditional knives, but also likes modern style folders, and really likes sheath knives.
His favorite pistols are my old single shot 22's. The ones he learned to shot with. He also likes Glocks, and really loves 1911's. There is no doubt he is my son :D

Back to the original topic, I don't think there are fewer Traditional knives being made today. Actually, if anything, I thought the numbers may have actually increased. No scientific data to support it, just a feeling.
For a company like GEC to start up, and achieve the success they have in such a short time, there is definitely a market. Even Case knives have branched out. There have been many here over the years wish that Case would offer more knives in CV. Guess what ? They listened. If there wasn't a market for them, they wouldn't have made the changes, cuz change costs money.

I would bet that if you checked with most of the custom makers, you would find a somewhat lengthy wait time, to get your knife. If they are even taking new orders.
There are so many great makers, but lets use the great Tony Bose for this example. Unfortunately I don't own one of Tony's knives, and probably never will.
I know the wait time for one of his knives is lengthy, and the price, well, it is way up there. No shortage of folks waiting for one of his knives though.
Even with his success, he is still involved with Case. Bringing new designs, and offering upgraded versions of their knives. So while he has achieved great success, and certainly doesn't need the extra work, he is still involved with a company that many of us can afford to buy from.
This helps further the interest in Traditional knives, and can even possibly bring in people who may not have had as much interest in this style of knives.

Sorry for the lengthy ramblin. It was a simple question that I somehow managed to really drag out an answer to :o
 
jeffsaul said:
I've noticed over the past year or so that the numbers of new traditional folders has diminished, at least from my perspective.

Jeff
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I haven't noticed this at all. I see thread after thread about the new offerings from GEC, Canal Street, Queen, Schatt & Morgan, etc.

-- Mark
 
Blues said:
Some words of wisdom...(I've posted them in this forum previously but it bears repeating for the new generation and those in need of a reminder).

From "On Your Own In The Wilderness" by Colonel Townsend Whelen and Bradford Angier (1958):

"The most indispensable tool for a hunter or fisherman or camper, and in fact for any outdoor man and boy anywhere, is the knife-a businesslike knife, sharp and keen. Mrs. Whelen's aunt, who taught high school Latin for thirty years in Nebraska, had the right idea. She asked every class, "Which boys have a jackknife in their pocket?" The ones who had none did not rate very high with her.

Her philosophy was that if a boy did not have a knife and know how to use it, he was not likely to grow up able to do many things for himself...I have had a knife like this in my back pants pocket ever since I was knee-high to a chopping block."
Click to expand...

Love that post Blues, that was cool. I copied and pasted that. Words to live by huh? Thanks again.:thumbup:
 
From a collecting standpoint, I’ve been told by a former curator at a national knife museum, as well as a well-respected knife dealer, that the market for traditional, vintage pocketknives has been dwindling, mainly due to aging.

With that said, there’s a large group of people who love knives that don’t post on Internet forums or buy their knives off of eBay, so who’s to say for sure. They go to local and regional shows and buy and sell amongst themselves.

On the other side of the spectrum, some high-end traditional knives aren’t sold on eBay or forums, but among a group of collectors. One person, such as the recent sale of a large collection of toenails, can impact the market.

I’ve also cut back on buying custom knives, and my taste for traditional, vintage pocketknives continues to evolve.

But I agree that Case, GEC, etc. wouldn’t be making all of these new pocketknives in different patterns, handle materials, and blade configurations if people weren’t buying them.

As for this sub-forum, I joined BF before we had an area for “traditionals.” I enjoyed the early days since they were much more freewheeling than what we have today, but also because “my” group of friends posted more back then. I guess it’s like an early mining town, eventually law and order replace the wild times.

When people ask me “You carry a pocketknife?” my response is “You don’t?” That’s usually when I’m cutting something for them.
 
There's much less of a middle class than there was. There's fewer blue collar workers. Kids don't take knives to school, nor even carry them. Kids hardly play outside anymore. Heck, go to Home Depot, and the employees aren't even allowed to carry a knife; good luck getting a piece of drywall trimmed. Importantly, the romance of a traditional isn't like it was, not for the younger generation.

I think knife collectors, especially those that collect traditionals, are like guys that collect toy trains. There are fewer and fewer of them (us) because the younger generation didn't grow up with the real things. I teach at a university, and very few kids carry knives, and if they do, they're the modern variety.
 
I see various sectors in the "collecting/appreciating" scene very vibrant. I think the urban edc scene is steadily declining, along with all things "outdoors." Yes, there is plenty of action to sustain a market, but decline of knife carrying amongst the sheeple is a strong trend.
 
bvik said:
I can personally attest that there is a new generation of men that is rediscovering the joys of pocket knife ownership due in part to Art of Manliness, specifically this article: Every Man should Carry a Pocket Knife. They even have a logo'd Boker trapper for sale in their store (not a sponsor, so no link).
Click to expand...

I used to read art of manliness. Although I moved away from the tone/style, I do appreciate that they are promoting such things.

As a newcomer to traditional knives, to me there is a while undiscovered world. There are already a few custom makers which I hope to someday be a frequent customer of.
 
I think region or geography has something to do with knife culture. Here case is king; I'll bet anything 9 out of 10 people are carrying a case knife. I see more younger people carrying traditional knives. Every hardware, feed, sporting good, or department store always has a great selection of case knives. Plus, we have at least 12 local knife dealers in town who sell nothing but traditional knives. Our local sporting good store sells every type of knife possible. They said they sold over a 100 cases during the holidays and not one modern knife. Everyone here is either blue collar or in agriculture that hunts and fishes so that may have something to do with why everybody carries traditional.
 
Pipeman said:
What has changed for me is the number of knives I have been accumulating. Probably 30 in the last year.:o
No sign of slowing down. :D

Best regards

Robin
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I'm right there with you Robin :D
As a watch collector, I've found that I can get more than a few knives for the same price as an "affordable" watch*

*Seiko, Citizen, Orient, Hamilton, many micro-brands, all watches that are usually north of $100 but less than $1K, sort of a rule of thumb we use in the forum I moderate.

Griff
 
Speaking from the "younger generation"(I consider my 31 years younger), no one I know carries a traditional. I've tried to get friends and co workers my age interested to no avail. A few carry cheap modern folders and have appreciation for the knives I've shown them but when it comes down to it they like the one hand deal and liner locks. I don't understand. I didn't have more than a few for 90% of the time and two of those were fixed blades used mostly for camping. That was until I found this dang site. Now I'm passing up buying modern accoutrements(such as a real digital camera, thus my often less than par pictures, sorry) in order to purchase and support the companies that are making these terrific knives.
On the custom end of things, with so many affordable options out there in the hundred dollar range, I can't bring myself to blow five hundred bucks on something that wouldn't bring me any more joy. Some day it'll happen, just not while it takes a week's pay to do it... also my girlfriend would murder me dead.

Sorry, lotta words without saying much. In the end it comes down to at one time or another every single one of my non knife carrying younger friends has, at one point or another, asked "hey, can you cut this?" or "can I see your knife a second?"
 
I have not noticed a drop in the offerings. I have seen quite a few that I would like to have added, but the money just isn't there these days. I have had to pass on the last two forum knives.
I have been most excited about GEC and their ongoing development. A lot of great knives leaving that shop!
 
I have 2 nephews that only always carry a Spyderco each in their pockets for over 2 years now and don't even own any traditional folders. When I have asked them at Christmas about the possibility of carrying a traditional slip joint they said that they will never be without their Spydercos. They're in their early 20s and I'm approaching middle age. That should tell ya something.
 
I'll say this much,I just sold off most of my tacticals and am moving back to traditionals. I am 42 and grew up with traditionals. My friends and co-workers are doing the same. For myself,I am tired of every knife looking the same. I find myself longing for the personality of wood and bone and stag on my knives,not the bland sameness of g10 or micarta or titanium. Cost is a big hit for me too. I can pick up 4 or more very nice traditional knives for the cost of one good made in the USA tactical knife these days. Plus the traditionals are more "public friendly" Nobody likes the Dad who whips out a big assisted opening or flipper tactical at the Girl Scout meeting,or just about anywhere else in public these days,to handle some minor cutting task. When I pull out an nice traditional,regardless of blade length,I often get compliments on my "pretty knife" instead of gasps and exclamations of "what the hell!!" I guess it's all in getting a little older. Many of the guys I hang out with want to relive the days of youth when Dad or Grandpa or Uncle handed them a great traditional pocket knife. Now that we are the Dads and Uncles and Grandpas we want to share that with the kids in our lives. It is hard to responsibly hand an 8 year old a modern tactical folder,but a Case peanut or GEC bareheaded boy's knife fits just right and it's a memory we create,hoping that someday they will share that memory with the kids in their lives,and maybe,remember us in the process.
 
Well said Rick! I am in the same boat with ya, my grandfather who fought in WW1 gave me my first pocket knife, I think it was an Imperial fishing style toothpick. Yellow handles ya know the knife, anyway he was the first to introduce me to patterns like barlows, stockman's and sowbellies.
 
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