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What has changed...
- Thread starter jeffsaul
- Start date
I'm a dad. Here are some of the things I see that have changed.
Kids don't roam any more. We used to come home when the street lamps came on. Today, kids don't go out on their own.
When I was a kid, there were 1 or 2 known "creeps" and you knew to stay away. Today, I get the sense that there are more creeps fueled by very creepy internet porn. Now we have sex offender registries, know where they live and the severity of the offense. This has a bearing on knives. It's a real reason why kids aren't allowed to walk to the park on their own to play baseball or cut sticks with their knives.
When I was a kid there weren't mass killings. I used to ride my bike with a Crosman air gun on the handlebars and a BSA knife in my pocket. Today (and very understandably) there is a strong anti-weapon backlash. And as a gun owner and hunter, I get it. People are scared and no getting around it, knives are weapons.
Some other things have changed. When I was a kid, there were no "modern" knives. I ride and collect traditional bikes and am something of a retrogrouch when it comes to skiing and backpacking gear. While I get the collector appeal of traditional things, I also believe that function trumps aesthetics, including traditional designs (whether we're talking knives or bikes or camp stoves). If a design can't compete in terms of function, it looses it's place. Modern "flippers" have earned their spot on the job site. As fans of traditions, we can stamp our feet in disgust, but we're just avoiding the reality.
On the more optimistic side, we now have teh internet so those of us who love traditional things can find vendors who make them and they, us. Same thing is and has been happening in traditional bikes too.
Also, if you consider full tanged fixed blades traditional (I do), then there is a huge revival and interest in traditional knives currently in the tactical/bushcraft/survival forums. This forum sees less of it with its focus more on pocket knives. Bark River, ESEE, Ka-BAR... good stuff.
Kids don't roam any more. We used to come home when the street lamps came on. Today, kids don't go out on their own.
When I was a kid, there were 1 or 2 known "creeps" and you knew to stay away. Today, I get the sense that there are more creeps fueled by very creepy internet porn. Now we have sex offender registries, know where they live and the severity of the offense. This has a bearing on knives. It's a real reason why kids aren't allowed to walk to the park on their own to play baseball or cut sticks with their knives.
When I was a kid there weren't mass killings. I used to ride my bike with a Crosman air gun on the handlebars and a BSA knife in my pocket. Today (and very understandably) there is a strong anti-weapon backlash. And as a gun owner and hunter, I get it. People are scared and no getting around it, knives are weapons.
Some other things have changed. When I was a kid, there were no "modern" knives. I ride and collect traditional bikes and am something of a retrogrouch when it comes to skiing and backpacking gear. While I get the collector appeal of traditional things, I also believe that function trumps aesthetics, including traditional designs (whether we're talking knives or bikes or camp stoves). If a design can't compete in terms of function, it looses it's place. Modern "flippers" have earned their spot on the job site. As fans of traditions, we can stamp our feet in disgust, but we're just avoiding the reality.
On the more optimistic side, we now have teh internet so those of us who love traditional things can find vendors who make them and they, us. Same thing is and has been happening in traditional bikes too.
Also, if you consider full tanged fixed blades traditional (I do), then there is a huge revival and interest in traditional knives currently in the tactical/bushcraft/survival forums. This forum sees less of it with its focus more on pocket knives. Bark River, ESEE, Ka-BAR... good stuff.
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2012
- Messages
- 3,983
Very true LEOGREG. This is not earthshaking news by any means. If you've ever been to any knife show, nearly every dealer there would be telling you the very same information LEOGREG and myself have just shared. Every dealer except for the Case dealers of course.
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2009
- Messages
- 3,198
These are strange times for me. Having a pocket knife in my pocket for over 50 years including when in my school years, I don't understand how one gets by without at least a butterbean, peanut or small jack in the pocket. To me, that is like leaving home without my pants.
I still work in the trades and have to say only one or two of the "old school dogs" (as we have been dubbed by the under 30 set) out of dozens I work with carry a pocket knife on a regular basis on the job. I don't get it. They don't even carry those once popular razor knives that folded and locked. They just don't carry a knife. Most guys I know don't carry even a small utility type knife unless it is a SAK.
And while you hear of such things, you never think it will happen to you. Last year for Christmas I bought my nephew a slick little folder and his dad (a really great guy!) a Mora 2000 after some good guidance from another sub forum on BF. Both of them use their knives. But only a little.
On his way to Life Scout, my nephew used his knife to get his "toten chip" badge for knife safety and safe use. He occasionally takes it camping. Occasionally...
His Dad loves that Mora. Lightweight, no maintenance, and holds and edge very well. As a senior scoutmaster in his son's troop, the leads the camping efforts once a month. He takes that knife most of the time, but not always.
When NOT camping or doing activities that might require a knife, neither carry a knife. My BIL's reasoning for my nephew is that he will get in much more trouble with the knife in his pocket then without it. His point was that my nephew might forget and take it to school (he is 12 after all...) or to some function where he might scare other people and in the end just get himself in trouble. The prevailing logic at the BSA council of Houston TX they have adopted is that a knife is a specific use tool, and when you need it, you carry it.
How awful. I remember specifically needing a pocket knife ever since I can remember.
So I don't really know how many knives are being sold to the public. Certainly GEC is a out of the park, grand slam home run for their offerings here withing the BF community, but outside this venue only a couple of my friends have heard of GEC (none have heard of Tidioute, Canal Street, Northwoods, Tuna Valley, Champlin, etc.) and none of them own one.
So while the boutique brands grow and serve their clients, what about the MILLIONS of knives that used to be sold 35 years ago to a smaller population? Think about how few knives are made today compared to when Colonial, Keen Kutter, Hammer Brand, Imperial, Schrade, and the giant behemoth Camillus (with all its contracting work) were cranking at capacity. Surely between them they sold millions a year. Then add in all the great German brands that sold at least that many traditionals every year as Owl Brand, Indian Head, etc., that no longer with us. In fact, none of those mentioned by me are still in business here in the USA or Germany. Their names as well as countless others have been sold off for good will and are now stamped on off shore offerings.
Had those companies been doing well (read: strong, healthy sales), I doubt they would have filed for bankruptcy or sold off their assets a piece at a time to hang on.
I think the boutique stores and brands will continue to sell their wares to a well heeled, nostalgic audience, but the new generations of traditional users just aren't coming along.
Robert
I still work in the trades and have to say only one or two of the "old school dogs" (as we have been dubbed by the under 30 set) out of dozens I work with carry a pocket knife on a regular basis on the job. I don't get it. They don't even carry those once popular razor knives that folded and locked. They just don't carry a knife. Most guys I know don't carry even a small utility type knife unless it is a SAK.
And while you hear of such things, you never think it will happen to you. Last year for Christmas I bought my nephew a slick little folder and his dad (a really great guy!) a Mora 2000 after some good guidance from another sub forum on BF. Both of them use their knives. But only a little.
On his way to Life Scout, my nephew used his knife to get his "toten chip" badge for knife safety and safe use. He occasionally takes it camping. Occasionally...
His Dad loves that Mora. Lightweight, no maintenance, and holds and edge very well. As a senior scoutmaster in his son's troop, the leads the camping efforts once a month. He takes that knife most of the time, but not always.
When NOT camping or doing activities that might require a knife, neither carry a knife. My BIL's reasoning for my nephew is that he will get in much more trouble with the knife in his pocket then without it. His point was that my nephew might forget and take it to school (he is 12 after all...) or to some function where he might scare other people and in the end just get himself in trouble. The prevailing logic at the BSA council of Houston TX they have adopted is that a knife is a specific use tool, and when you need it, you carry it.
How awful. I remember specifically needing a pocket knife ever since I can remember.
So I don't really know how many knives are being sold to the public. Certainly GEC is a out of the park, grand slam home run for their offerings here withing the BF community, but outside this venue only a couple of my friends have heard of GEC (none have heard of Tidioute, Canal Street, Northwoods, Tuna Valley, Champlin, etc.) and none of them own one.
So while the boutique brands grow and serve their clients, what about the MILLIONS of knives that used to be sold 35 years ago to a smaller population? Think about how few knives are made today compared to when Colonial, Keen Kutter, Hammer Brand, Imperial, Schrade, and the giant behemoth Camillus (with all its contracting work) were cranking at capacity. Surely between them they sold millions a year. Then add in all the great German brands that sold at least that many traditionals every year as Owl Brand, Indian Head, etc., that no longer with us. In fact, none of those mentioned by me are still in business here in the USA or Germany. Their names as well as countless others have been sold off for good will and are now stamped on off shore offerings.
Had those companies been doing well (read: strong, healthy sales), I doubt they would have filed for bankruptcy or sold off their assets a piece at a time to hang on.
I think the boutique stores and brands will continue to sell their wares to a well heeled, nostalgic audience, but the new generations of traditional users just aren't coming along.
Robert
- Joined
- Mar 13, 2012
- Messages
- 634
I have no experience at all in the traditional realm of knives. Having said that, I decided to go into a pawn shop I hadn't been in for years. The last time I was in there they had a nice collection of all kinds of different types of knives. Sadly that wasn't the "case" anymore. All they had IMO were Rambo knives and loads and loads of NIB Case knives.
Seeing how I had not handled(I don't think) a NIB Case knife - I asked to look at them. I looked at one of those Russ locks? I think I'm saying it correct and one that had three blades. Maybe when I learn more, I don't know, but they seemed like junk to me...lots of blade play and generally I couldn't believe I was holding a NIB Case knife. Not for me. At least on that day.
Although I'm not married I see your point, but still like to have 1 or 3 quality moderns in my arsenal.
I sold of MOST of my tactical folders,not all. I still have love for the few I have kept. It is handy while working to have a one hand folder,it is even handier to have a small fixed blade on your belt. I just kind of fell out of love with tactical designs when I spread my collection out on the kitchen table one night and my little girl walked by and asked why I have so many of the same knife. It was true,without being a knife nut,the average person is hard pressed to tell the difference between many modern designs. I laid out my traditional knives for her and she immediately began to pick them up and tell me what she liked about the color or shape of each one. The lay out of traditionals was just more pleasing to the eye,and brought back memories of the first time I bought or held each pattern. Memories of camping trips and scouting weekends when I was a kid and we would pull out or latest find from a yard sale or flea market and wonder about the life of those old blades.
I kept a my Emerson's as my nice tacticals and my Kershaw Hinderer designs(thermite and cryo) as my tactical beaters,but the rest went to new owners. Ususally at work I will carry the thermite,but there is a traditional close by. When I am on my own time there can be upwards of three traditionals on me. My most recent additions are GEC fixed blades,which have quickly become my favorite knives when backed up with a small traditional folder in my pocket. Not much that combo can't handle,and all without scaring the natives.
- Joined
- Jun 26, 2005
- Messages
- 1,835
The custom market is strong as ever.