What is a big knife for?

[North61]

North61, I wouldn't know any other way to skin a caribou.

Truth to tell last year we had six down in mild weather, was wore out, and I would have loved to gut them and make a run for home to do the processing.

I have become so comfortable with the Inuit method that I just went ahead and skinned and disassembled all of them. I was a bit foggy on simple gutting as I haven't done it for 22 years. Took over two hours so I am no Inuk but the work got done.

I also had "help" from a rookie which always slows things down some.

Just so you know that I am not a complete fanatic...I didn't use the Mora for my boo.... Spyderco Wegner baby.....that's the one true hunting knife!

Kochanski's children

vs the Mighty Wegners..(The hollow ground members are pure hunters)

I have to admit though that lately I am strongly in the I just discovered the 10.00 Mora Mafia. They do amaze me...part of it is that at the price I am not afarid to court abuse and stretch the knife and my own skills. I find it hard to push an expensive and beautiful knife as hard as the Mora.

 

[meangreen]

A big knife may have several uses, or it may be just a "toy" that someone likes...whats wrong with that?

 

[Jim Craig]

Meangreen,

Nope, nuthin wrong with that at all in my books. Spice of life and all that rot.

North61,

I hunted with a teacher named Vince in FGH afew times. He is from the Rock, and by far the fastest I've seen skinning caribou. He uses that itty bitty Grohmann skinner and a Bird and Trout that is about 2/3 normal size, 'cuz he sharpens it with a (gasp!) file. Quite a sight watching a large man on the verge of passing out, sweating, huffing and puffing at -20C....

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Thousand + years of design and heritage means that these designs are very evolved. This is unlike North America where the desire for newness and innovation has resulted in lots of designs that look cool but it's hard to figure out what they are for.

The bowie pattern is fairly new, but long knives for use on woods and brush are very old, parangs, goloks, bolos, etc.. Valiant has literally hundreds of different designs. The khukri is newer (but still far older than the bowie) the stamped machete is also fiarly new, but both are use based designs, the machete is basically just a long Mora.

To my way of thinking they are almost universally too thick and too expensive.

There are lots of very thin long blades, the really thin ones, 1/16" are mainly for grasses. The thicker ones have the stock to keep them fluid in chopping, otherwise they would bind more readily, it is also needed for the weight necessary to get power on the swing. The cost depends on what you are buying exactly, the Village khukuris from HI can be very inexpensive, Valiant also offers basic models for very low prices, you can also find piles of traditional parangs and such on ebay for very low prices.

With the Mora I can quickly bend and cut the 1-2" saplings for shelter building, cut a set of wooden wedges off a 10" Spruce firelog and then start a crack. 5 minutes of baton work and I have 6 chunks of usable and dry fire wood. The Camp Tramp will do the above about 10% faster. It will also rough and shape wood a bit faster.

The Camp Tramp will do all of that a lot more than 10% faster, it is many to one, you don't need to bend and slice the saplings you just chop them off, you don't need to cut or shape wedges, you just drive the knife right through the wood, the chopping ability to shape is also way faster than carving off stock, it is *many* to one, not just a small percentage.

On one of Mear's videos a native takes a very long blade and quickly roughs out a paddle and then finish shapes it, usually done by using the blades as draw knives. Mear's also chops his paddle to shape and just finishes with a small hook knife. Few wood working shops would do any rough shaping with a small knife, it is almost always a small chopping tool followed by a drawknife.

Generally for carpentry you would use a small axe over a parang because you have no need for the length so it just gets in the way, outside though the length has its advantage trimming brush. Carpentry axes are also fairly niche shaped, generally with extreme curvatures, not something you would actually take to fell a tree or cut through a stick.

However it would be very poor at the fine work which the Mora excells...like filliting a fish, making hanging sicks for the fire or trap parts or carving a spoon.

There is nothing stopping you from applying the same edge angle to the Camp Tramp that exists on the Mora, it will then have a thinner edge at the same angle due to the primary grind and actually out cut the Mora on a lot of materials. Just consider how far up on the grind you need to go on blades with full primary grinds before you actually hit the edge thickness on the Mora's.

Longer blades have issues with woodworking, they are generally too wide for making curves and trying to carve a hollow is very difficult because working with the point is so far infront of the handle. I have been lately moving towards a hook knife and a large chopping tool for outside as I generally don't tend to take out the smaller blades aside from comparison work, but a hook knife would be preferred in a lot of shaping and carving.

I have heard it said that a small knife can't do the task of a big knife where a big knife can do the job of a little one.

You can do anything with any knife, or without one, some tasks are just easier with different knives. Note there are lots of knives vastly thinner and more acute than single grind scandinavian blades. I have many which by comparison Mora's are extremely thick in comparison, far more so than the Camp Tramp is over a Mora.

They can do all the work you noted with the Mora and they will radically out cut it, sharpen far faster and stay sharp for far much longer. The advantage of a thicker blade like a Mora is that it can take more lateral or twisting forces around the blade and edge which makes it a more efficient cutting tool in some situations. This is the same arguement of course for any increased thickness.

-Cliff

 

[Jim Craig]

Thanks PB. All good things....

 

[Thomas Linton]

. . .
That BRK&T with the orange handle looks THICK. How is it for slicing meat and cheese, or shaving wood?

Jim

If it's the Highland, it's .150" (3.8 mm) at the thickest part of the spine.

 

[North61]

Cliff I can't spend a lot of time on this but I don't buy the many to one advantage of a big thick knife in the Boreal Forest except on very few tasks...all these tasks for me are served better by a small axe and not as well by a big long and thick knife.

I have seen Mors Kochanski take his 12.00 Mora and quickly split two wood wedges off of a 12" Spruce log. Started a crack with his mora and a baton and 1 minutes later we had 6 peices of fire wood. I am not that slick but that's the kind of effortless skill I aspire to. the saplings are bent and cut at a 30 degree to 45 degree angle and in less time than it takes to write about there they are in my hand. Safer for me in a thicket than swinging a heavy deflectable and sharp object.

I could make a very thin bevel on the Camp Tramp but I'd still have a big thick heavy blade with a somewhat silly edge. I'll be interested to say what a Leuku design can do. Most other big thin blades were designed for a different environment.

Still I'll take some big knives out and give em a go. Don't mind learning something new.

 

[DirkDiggler]

-Cliff

North61,, what did I tell you. Want an icepack for those big lumps Cliff just put on your head with the edge of his favorite knife.

Do not use facts or logic when arguing with Cliff or you will end up like this gent.

-DD

 

[tarmix101]

North61,, what did I tell you. Want an icepack for those big lumps Cliff just put on your head with the edge of his favorite knife.

Do not use facts or logic when arguing with Cliff or you will end up like this gent.

-DD

You kill me!!!!!!

 

[skammer]

Truth be told I really like my Camp Tramp but I never take it anywhere... It seems too big to have precision and not in the same league as a small axe if you need real power. I love that resiprene handle and maybe I'll take it out more and see what it can do for me. Seems a shame to leave it in the bag but I am a bit skeptical about it's real utility.

The utility of your camp tramp leaves the mora in the dust. YOu just have to learn to appreciate it with practice.

Once one realizes the utility of not having to carry and axe or a small fixed blade the light bulb will go on.

I can split a minimum of 10 times faster with a large blade with little effort and no wedge making, not to mention the prying ability, chopping power. The list goes on....

What can the mora do the tramp can't? Nothing I have ever found out.

Skam

 

[Myakka]

I can split a minimum of 10 times faster with a large blade with little effort and no wedge making, not to mention the prying ability, chopping power. The list goes on....
Skam

That part I have to agree with you skammer. The mora and hatchet/axe is more precise, but the large blade can do want you say, and do it well.

Ron

 

[Greg45]

I'm a big-blade fan. I've used them for many years and feel comfortable with them. I've also used tiny blades, small blades, medium blades and axes of all sizes.

For me, they are all tools in the tool box, and all useful in their own right. :thumbup:

 

[David Schott]

I like little knives, but theres something about taking huge 3" hunks out of wood with a knife that just feels SOO good, haha!

 

[Thomas Linton]

I find it curious that advocacy of a "big" knife for survival purposes gets (crudely) panned as irational by some when a "big" knife is advocated by Ray Mears, John "Lofty" Wiseman, and Ron Hood. But, then, the persons doing the panning probably have no idea who these persons are, being simply overcome by the urge to join what they think is a "dog pile."

Contrast that with those like N61 who just have a strong point of view -- and actual reasons for it -- but are open to alternatives.

Not that its black or white. Is a full-tang Bark River that's 3/16" thick with a 4" blade "big" or "little"? I submit that it's neither. It won't chop like a 9" Rat, Ranger, or Busse, but it's up to being hammered on and prying that I wouldn't try with one of my MORA's -- or even most of my puukkos. Neither does a Badger Attack seem "little" (wish it would cut like the Fox River, North Star or Gameskeeper).

 

[North61]

Not that its black or white. Is a full-tang Bark River that's 3/16" thick with a 4" blade "big" or "little"? I submit that it's neither. It won't chop like a 9" Rat, Ranger, or Busse, but it's up to being hammered on and prying that I wouldn't try with one of my MORA's -- or even most of my puukkos. Neither does a Badger Attack seem "little" (wish it would cut like the Fox River, North Star or Gameskeeper).

Thomas that might be part of the issue for me. I'd hesitate to push an expensive Bark River by hammering and prying to the limit. they look like beautiful gear and wrecking good gear leaves me with a sick feeling deeply planted by my depression era dad. The 10.00 Mora I can abuse...and it's surprisingly tough. For practicing bushcraft it is an ideal tool.

Also to be truthful what I am doing at present is playing around in the woods...I likely will upgrade my scandi knife to a tougher model than the 10 buck hardware version for real back-country trips. I am still skeptical that the big thick knife will ever worm it's way into my affections though.

 

[Ebbtide]

I want to get a Mora, but they look kind of flimzy, like a rapala fillet knife. Of course I've never seen one in person, just in photos. How thick are the blades???

3rd from left is a SWedish Army Knife
Next is a IJ1244
6th is a Helle Jegermester.
On the extreme right is a Marbles Woodcraft.

 

[Jim Craig]

Ebb,

What is the second last to the right??? I really like the look and feel of sheep horn for knife handles....

 

[crawfordew]

15-20 years ago I ordered a Benchmade Bushmaster (10" blade) it was delivered while I was at work. When I got home my wife asked me why we needed it. I told her that you never can tell when you're going to need to clear an LZ in a hurry or hack your way out the side of a helicopter! She just said "Silly me! Why didn't I think of that?"
Gene

 

[skammer]

I find it curious that advocacy of a "big" knife for survival purposes gets (crudely) panned as irational by some when a "big" knife is advocated by Ray Mears, John "Lofty" Wiseman, and Ron Hood. But, then, the persons doing the panning probably have no idea who these persons are, being simply overcome by the urge to join what they think is a "dog pile."

Contrast that with those like N61 who just have a strong point of view -- and actual reasons for it -- but are open to alternatives.

.

Well put Thomas. Maybe N61 does not need a large bade up that far as trees are both smaller and fewer depending on where he lives. Once above the tree line I would think a skinning blade and snow saw would be the tools of choice.

One thing is for sure there is public perception and fear of large blades. Its ingrained in us from childhood by people and the media that blades are wrong. So it makes sense that the larger the wrong the more negative attention it gets.

Essentially it is a tool nothing more but again big sledge hammers vs regular sized hammers dont get the same bad media compared to big blades.

SKam

 

[sodak]

Neither does a Badger Attack seem "little" (wish it would cut like the Fox River, North Star or Gameskeeper).

Put the right bevel on it and it can.... If I can get a picture of mine, I'll send it to you.