What makes an expensive knife expensive?

S

Skytorn

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Jan 22, 2010
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As I am by no means an expert or even someone who's poured time and money into knives, I've always been fascinated by how much money companies like Kershaw and smaller designers like Busse or Chris Reeve get away with charging for a knife.

Things like clothing, cologne, or cars, I can understand why items of scientifically identical quality might sell for vastly different prices--people are vain and things like the above are a showcase of your ability, whether to earn money or to spend it. But it seems a little weird that something meant to be a tool for use & abuse would cost so far beyond reasonable expectations, particularly when it comes to knives supposedly marketed at military or law enforcement personnel like the ZT line. Is the real answer then, depressingly enough, just brand names and what people are willing to pay for them? Are these high-end knives more vanity than quality?

I am by no means bashing the companies, knives, etc. I'm sure you know that. I do genuinely wonder however what makes a Busse a $300 knife, and a Buck 119 Special a $50 knife. This post probably reads like ignorant flamebait, with most likely no shortage of uninformed BS to be had. It would be deeply appreciated however if you could talk about what makes a knife worth its price tag, especially if you are an owner of top brand knives.


Thanks.
 
Moved to more appropriate venue for discussion.
 
Branding/marketing.

Ego/vanity.

Do you think some buyers may be compensating, in some way?

I personally don't think that one knife that cuts no better than another that has equal materials and an equally good design is actually worth more. But some people just gotta have 'em.

I, personally, wouldn't buy a Busse over a Becker, but that's just me. They're both tough knives and they cut stuff, and that's the bottom line for me.
 
the virgin blood used to quench the steel after forging.
 
I thought what made knives expensive was that they were stropped on the the thighs of a virgin. I guess that video I bought was a lie.
 
din said:
the virgin blood used to quench the steel after forging.
Click to expand...

I think it was that and the Bourbon and Atomic HT. :D

Something about shooting a rocket around the sun filled with the steel I think. LOL
 
Sometimes higher costs are justified. Certain fixed and variable costs for custom makers or small companies are higher per unit than for large manufacturers than can spread out such costs over a large number of units. Higher quality materials costs more, but that's only a small portion of the total cost. There is also the labor/time of the maker to consider.

If people were unwilling to spend $300 for a Busse then the company might be able to lower the price some, but it might also be forced to use lesser quality/cheaper materials or be forced to expend less time on fit & finish. Also many of these high end makers and companies offer outstanding customer service which couldn't be supported at cut-rate pricing.

Honda and Toyota make very good, serviceable automobiles. Does that mean that someone who buys a Mercedes isn't getting anything additional for their money?

The knife market is huge. There's plenty of room for knives of all price and quality levels.
 
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Fit, finish, warranties, materials, and the cost of all the souls used to heat up the hellforge.
 
People willing to pay that much.

We recently had a thread about a "maker" selling completed inexpensive kit knives for several hundred dollars each. Granted, he did a beautiful job, but the finished knife was no better as a tool than the kit he started with.
 
As a man that IMO KNOWS the business said:

Sal Glesser on the Seb:

Quote...

More profit is usually associated with higher price. That's normal. Profit is usually a percentage of sales price. To think that a high priced auto should garner the same proft as a low priced auto is not in accord with business. It might be the same percentage, but being more expensive, it will be more profit.

Unless you are a manufacturer, familiar with close tolerance manufacturing of heat treated steel & Titanium parts, you are not likely to be able to see all of the differences between one of Chris' knives and others. For example; CRK keeps 0.0005 tolerance on surface grinding. That's one sixth the thickness of a hair. Do you have the knowledge and equipment to discover that tolerance?

In the end, it's all about trust. CRK took many years to build and maintain their repuation. Built with consistent focus. Even those trying to make a "cheaper" version must "leave out processes" or "soften their tolerance", or they will cost as much.

Rarely do you pay for the "name". That's a bull**** sales pitch made up by the ignorant claiming to offer the same for less. Money valuation between countries might offer a "deal" for a while until the money value balances, but all in all, you will get what you pay for.

End quote.


Thats good enough for me and since INFI is just a great steel and it costs that much to manufacture it thats why its that expensive.
 
Sounds like you consider them all to be of identical quality, due to your example using cars (which shows you don't understand cars either). They are not.

You pay more for lots of things. Different materials, origins of materials (some pay more for USA or Japanese steels, for example), quality of materials, type of craftsmanship, quality of craftsmanship, style of craftsmanship, location of assembly (American made) customer service, warranty, and so on.

And yes, there is also hype, exclusivity, name-recognition, and marketing.

Combine all of those things, and you'll see why a Busse (for example) costs so much more than the chinese made no-name hunting knife you can find in the checkout isle of Menard's. You get an American-made knife made from higher quality materials, with better construction that will last ten times as long yet carries a lifetime no-questions-asked warranty. And you also get the exclusivity of owning a knife not many of the average public own, which is appealing to some. All of which adds up to a knife that maintains its value well enough that in a couple of years if you decide you don't want it anymore, you can sell it for nearly as much (and sometimes more) than you paid for it. Even if you've used it.

Buck has a few of those things (American-made and name recognition), but the quality of material and craftsmanship really can't be compared, and the exclusivity certainly isn't there.
 
Some of it, in regard to customs, is as simple as contact hours. What's a living wage for a skilled hourly worker?

Multiply that times the number of hours to hand make a quality knife and add the cost of materials. You'll come up with a bigger number than if you are comparing it to a Mora made by a robot.

Is the Mora an inferior knife? Not at all--but it wasn't made by hand by to your exact specifications either.
 
I am with you SteelSnob, the cost of the materials do play a large part. Fit and finish, while they do not increase the cost of materials, add time to production. Time is very valuable.

Busses are made by hand in a custom shop in very limited production numbers, Beckers are made mass in a factory. While both have the ability to cut stuff, the Busse has had more human energy put into it, combine that with the added value of rarity (which does have real market value) and you have a higher price.

As a side note, I understand the HT on INFI takes days, not hours, thus increasing the cost of fuel to heat the kiln. (Although I am fairly ignorant n the ways of alchemy :))

I own several customs. Some have superb F&F, some do not. The price usually reflects this. I still have not sprung for a Busse, but time will tell.

While I have not yet forged my own blades, I have put handles on at least 30 blanks. To achieve a great F&F, especially with hand tools, it takes a great deal of time (I have spent as much as 100 hours on a single handle, hand shaping different density materials to fir seamlessly. To get a roughly adequate pair of scales shaped and riveted onto a blade, it takes maybe two.)

Also, we must not belittle the value of being skilled at one's craft. Since there are only a handful of people with both the skills and desire to produce the highest end blades, and far more capable of lesser works (which may be of an incredibly high quality in their own right). It all comes down to a matter of my last point: economics.

Simple free market economic principles are at work here. Supply and demand interact in such a way that there will be some individual willing to purchase a product at every price level. There will be an equilibrium between the price an number of buyers, where the most knives will be sold. It seems to me that about $50 is the average maximum price the general population is willing to pay for a knife. For some people it is much lower. I know people who will never spend more than $5 on low end Kitchen knife, I always use my own blade when cooking for friends (unless they too have skills).

There will, however, be individuals at both extremes, but fewer than the average. So Should there be knives that cost more than my truck? Should they really cost that much?

... Yes, but only as long as there is someone willing to buy them at that price point.

In short, the only necessary factor for one knife to be worth more than another, is that someone, somewhere, is willing to pay more for it.
 
More expensive Materials are often the reason. With custom and some production knives, there is more time involved, more attention to detail and make no Mistake, in some cases, YOU are paying more for the NAME which is OK if the reputation makes the Name worth it. And as someone else wisely said, " Because some people will pay there price.

To me, there is a point of diminishing return, especially in folders.
 
Bottom line is there is a huge difference between a knife you will find in a store checkout line and say a CRK etc.

You really won't find any real high quality knives at Wal-Mart either.
 
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