What makes an expensive knife expensive?

I have been carrying knives (from one manufacturer or another) for some 15 years now. I use them everyday for various tasks at work and play. I've never spent much more than $200 for a knife, and every one of them has fallen apart within 5 years. That's not a euphemism; every single knife I've carried has failed in one way or another. I am intimately aware of the limitations of a folding knife, and what type of action or inaction constitutes abuse. I have never abused my knives, and they have all, without exception failed miserably. I've carried Benchmade, Leatherman, Gerber, Emmerson, Masters of Defense and many, many more. I've seen steel break, liner locks fail, handle inlays fall out and many other catastrophic failures. I do not work in a profession (or have hobbies) where I am abnormally hard on my knives, yet every knife I have carried has revealed itself to be a total piece of trash. The only solution I see: spend more.
 
There are some knife companies selling a name or a gimmick at a premium, and a lot of people are sold and willing to pay for an idea or brand, as with any product.

However, there are companies charging a premium because their products are, in fact, premium.

If you have genuinely gone through the different levels of manufacturing and actually tried multiple models from the leading brands, it is not hard to see who is full of it and who delivers.
 
Pricing is based on many factors. A knife is a product, so it follows standard pricing strategies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pricing

If you can convince people that the value of your knife is $300, then people will buy it for $300, plain and simple. While for most people the value of a knife is that it cuts, some people care about additional things like quality of material, quality of workmanship, design, aesthetics, and brand/maker prestige.
 
Sep said:
Pricing is based on many factors. A knife is a product, so it follows standard pricing strategies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pricing

If you can convince people that the value of your knife is $300, then people will buy it for $300, plain and simple. While for most people the value of a knife is that it cuts, some people care about additional things like quality of material, quality of workmanship, design, aesthetics, and brand/maker prestige.
Click to expand...

Yeah, for some of the same reasons that some people Drive a Geo Metro and others drive a BMW. :)
 
Like some people have mentioned, the price of a knife is sometimes based on what people are willing to pay for it.

It's a touchy subject for some people that will have some of the loyalist fanboys get a little upset, but it's true.
 
I don't know about that, The Buck 119 and 110 are pretty good quality knives Walmart here has those.
 
one911emergency said:
I have been carrying knives (from one manufacturer or another) for some 15 years now. I use them everyday for various tasks at work and play. I've never spent much more than $200 for a knife, and every one of them has fallen apart within 5 years. That's not a euphemism; every single knife I've carried has failed in one way or another. I am intimately aware of the limitations of a folding knife, and what type of action or inaction constitutes abuse. I have never abused my knives, and they have all, without exception failed miserably. I've carried Benchmade, Leatherman, Gerber, Emmerson, Masters of Defense and many, many more. I've seen steel break, liner locks fail, handle inlays fall out and many other catastrophic failures. I do not work in a profession (or have hobbies) where I am abnormally hard on my knives, yet every knife I have carried has revealed itself to be a total piece of trash. The only solution I see: spend more.
Click to expand...

Welcome to BF. Try a Spyderco Manix.
 
It's all relative.

Some folks drive Yugo's, some drive Corvette's. Both will get you to the store.

Some folks only buy tools made in China, Some buy Snapon or Craftsman. Both work to some degree.

I personally will pay more for quality, USA made products. I get enjoyment out of using good tools, knifes included.

Life is too short to waste time with cheap stuff that only works so-so.
 
my $0.02

various costs that go into manufacturing have to be taken into account along with basic materials costs.

let's take the Mora Clipper 860 as our "baseline" model. it costs ~US$15 retail. it's mass produced, has an injected rubber handle (very inexpensive once you get your dies set up), comes with an injection moulded plastic sheath and is largly automated in it's manufacture. the steel used for the blade is perfectly serviceable stuff, and actually of a significantly higher grade than one would find in other knives in this price range.

now, the 860 is a very simple, very basic blade. it doesn't have funky grind patterns and suchlike to add to it's manufacturing costs.

anything over and above these basic principles adds to cost. using thicker steel adds to the cost. using a higher grade steel or laminate steel, putting sexy grind lines on the knife, fancy pommels and guards or providing a nice leather or Kydex sheath all adds to the manufacturing costs.

now, even automated manufacture can't dismiss these extra costs. they can reduce them, but not remove them from the equation.

now, when we get up into the realm of handcrafted knives made by master smiths from top-end materials, we're paying a master craftsman for his time and the time it took them to develop their skills and build up their workshop. we're also paying for the top notch materials. if you make a knife from, say 3mm steel and it costs $X for the materials, the same knife in 6mm steel will probably costs more than 2x$X for the materials, not withstanding the extra time working the thicker steel will take the craftsman and all the extra labour costs that are starting to mount up.

after these basic principles, we also have a bunch of other factors.

rareity is one. let's look at the Chris Reeve Sebenza, the not the Chris Scott but the Scott Cook Lochsa and a basic, soldier issue Victorinox SAK.

the SAK is mass-manufactured and mass-marketed worldwide, so it shifts a lot of units and bulk manufacture keeps costs down.

Chris Reeve and his crew of craftspeople make and assemble each Sebenza.

not Chris Scott but Scott Cook has a long waiting list of eager Lochsa purchasers. each one is made by hand and takes time to produce.

hence, the Lochsa market is a lot smaller than either the Sebenza or SAK market, simply because of the exclusivity of the knife and the associated costs.

now: what can you do with a Lochsa that you can't do with a Clipper 860? you can fold it up and put it in your pocket. THAT'S ABOUT IT. they both cut things equally well, although the Lochsa blade is (hopefully) stronger than an 860's.

when i think of all the myriad ways there are of parting me from my money, spending a little extra on a high quality knife doesn't strike me as odd at all.

there will always be people prepared to pay extra. it might be because they enjoy owning a handcrafted, custom object safe in the knowledge that no-one else has exactly the same thing that they do.

if people didn't care about such things, the Clipper 860 would be about the only knife on the marketm and how boring would life be then. sure, we'd have a pretty damn good knife that we can all afford, but c'mon, zzzzZZZzzZZZzzz.
 
Last edited:
Jim, you're right on about diminishing returns, I just felt like I was ranting enough about economics.

I haven't bought a new folder in a while, because the same 80 to 120 bucks gets a much nicer fixed blade, and colorado is fixed blade friendly.
 
Col. Cornelius said:
It's all relative.

Some folks drive Yugo's, some drive Corvette's. Both will get you to the store.

Some folks only buy tools made in China, Some buy Snapon or Craftsman. Both work to some degree.

I personally will pay more for quality, USA made products. I get enjoyment out of using good tools, knifes included.

Life is too short to waste time with cheap stuff that only works so-so.
Click to expand...

Sounds to me like the nail's been hit on the head.

If you don't understand why someone would buy higher quality or more expensive goods, you probably never will.
 
Let's face it: If you don't enjoy slicing with a Lochsa more than slicing with a Mora Clipper 860, than you should just stick with the 860. There is a pleasure to be gleaned from using (or just owning) the Lochsa that the 860 just can't provide. That pleasure is linked to the untangible, artistic quality of the knife as well as the superior quality of the materials and craftsmanship. Some people have the appreciation and the means to buy the Lochsa. Others either don't have the means, or just don't see the value in what the Lochsa offers. Both people can cut a bologna sandwich in two. The Lochsa owner just enjoys the process more IMHO ; )
 
Lets face it, there are people out there who will never really get it no matter how you explain it or how many times you explain it.

Call it what they are, cheap, frugal whatever, it all amounts to the same thing. They will never appreciate real quality...... NEVER.

As soon as you hear the words:

Just as good as


Don't even bother after that because it's like talking to a brick wall and there is nothing you can say that will ever change that and it's not worth the effort.
 
Last edited:
Bolt-action bultema said:
Simple free market economic principles are at work here. Supply and demand interact in such a way that there will be some individual willing to purchase a product at every price level. There will be an equilibrium between the price an number of buyers, where the most knives will be sold. It seems to me that about $50 is the average maximum price the general population is willing to pay for a knife. For some people it is much lower. I know people who will never spend more than $5 on low end Kitchen knife, I always use my own blade when cooking for friends (unless they too have skills).
Click to expand...
Leftoverdj said:
People willing to pay that much.
Click to expand...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subjective_Theory_of_Value


Bolt-action bultema said:
I am with you SteelSnob, the cost of the materials do play a large part. Fit and finish, while they do not increase the cost of materials, add time to production. Time is very valuable.
Click to expand...
udtjim said:
More expensive Materials are often the reason. With custom and some production knives, there is more time involved, more attention to detail and
Click to expand...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_theory_of_value

Take your pick;)
As to which theory of value a maker uses to price their knives
You have to ask them each individually I guess

Maker A===>
Takes his total costs (fixed costs plus variable costs) and adds 10%

Maker B===>
Looks on EBAY to see what people are willing to pay for similar knives
Then uses marketing/adverstising techniques to make his knife different than his competitors

Rarely do you pay for the "name". That's a bull**** sales pitch made up by the ignorant claiming to offer the same for less
Click to expand...
I have to disagree with Mr. Glasser on the above statement
There are four key elements to creating iconic brands (Holt 2004):
  1. "Necessary conditions" - The performance of the product must at least be ok preferably with a reputation of having good quality.
  2. "Myth-making" - A meaningful story-telling fabricated by cultural "insiders". These must be seen as legitimate and respected by consumers for stories to be accepted.
  3. "Cultural contradictions" - Some kind of mismatch between prevailing ideology and emergent undercurrents in society. In other words a difference with the way consumers are and how they some times wish they were.
  4. "The cultural brand management process" - Actively engaging in the myth-making process making sure the brand maintains its position as an icon.
Click to expand...
Brand marketing is alive and strong in 2010..imho
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand

I think Busse uses what is called price skimming:
designed to capture high margins at the expense of of high sales volume...consequently, this strategy is viable only when the profit from selling to a price-insensitive segment exceeds that from selling to a larger market at a lower price
I believe that Busse knife buyers ARE price insensitive..:D;)
Just look in the Busse for sale forum:eek:

BTW...the wikipedia entry for price skimming is actually for sequential price skimming
Price skimming is a pricing strategy in which a marketer sets a relatively high price for a product or service at first, then lowers the price over time.
Click to expand...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_skimming
 
I don't feel that expensive knives ARE expensive. It is rather fact that most thing we buy are CHEAP(not inexpensive but cheap).
Most cars we buy are cheap, houses are cheap, most tools are cheap(damn, I had problem recenty when I found out that I can buy hand power drill cheaper than a single drilling bit for it...).

And most expensive knives aren't cheap - they are made with quality in mind. And quality requires money.
 
Skytorn said:
I am by no means bashing the companies, knives, etc. I'm sure you know that. I do genuinely wonder however what makes a Busse a $300 knife, and a Buck 119 Special a $50 knife. This post probably reads like ignorant flamebait, with most likely no shortage of uninformed BS to be had. It would be deeply appreciated however if you could talk about what makes a knife worth its price tag, especially if you are an owner of top brand knives.
Click to expand...

If you are talking about 300 dollars to 400 dollars for a hand made knife then that seems expensive. But if 10 hours of a skilled craftsman's time went into making that knife then you are talking about $30 to $40 per hour of time, but that wasn't taking into account the cost of materials. Let's say that a $300 knife only cost $50 for materials and took the maker 10 hours - that is $25 per hour.

So then, are hand made knives expensive?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top