What materials can't a "tough" folder cut?

Brennanscott said:
I have a hard time trying to cut meteorites with my BM710.
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I sliced right through one but the guy at the pawn shop told me it was a Boeing Bomb - a frozen chunk of sh*t :D

Gator97 said:
My non-knife coworker was arguing with me 2 days ago, why do I need a knives on me at all. I said: to cut packaging, open letters, occasional small wire, food, etc, that besides the fact that I like knives.
His counter argument was similar to yours :) Most of the things he can tear, break, pry open with screwdriver or pen, or use scissors, teeth, etc... That's "good enough" for him.

My point of view is, if I am to use a tool, ideally I want the tool that does the job the best/easiest/fast/precisely. And thick folders by definition can't cut as well as thin ones.

As far as hard use goes, those thick folders hardly make good choice for batonning, short blade after all. Prying is another heavy duty task often cited and I've seen quite a few broken tips on BF too. Besides, chances are the handle will fail, or pivot. It is not a job for a folder...


So, if a folding knife isn't optimized for cutting, what else it should be optimized for?
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Why all of the above of course. Don't non-knifenuts aggravate you? My "I'll bite it open with my teeth" buddy had his tooth slip off a baggie he was trying to cut open with his teeth. Price = 1 trip to the dentist, root canal and a crown! He could have bought a gold class Benchmade 710 for that dumbass stunt!! :D
 
all hood allen said:
haha. tell me you dont use your BM to try and cut sheet rock...
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You're kidding right? I did try and it failed, so I used a thinner blade without a lock to do what the "tough" folder couldn't. I couldn't even get the tip of the BM all the way through.
 
me2 said:
You're kidding right? I did try and it failed, so I used a thinner blade without a lock to do what the "tough" folder couldn't. I couldn't even get the tip of the BM all the way through.
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haha. at least you use your BM.:thumbup:
some people are scared to use their knives.



right tool for the right job...:)
81oy4y1.jpg
 
all hood allen said:
haha. at least you use your BM.:thumbup:
some people are scared to use their knives.



right tool for the right job...:)
81oy4y1.jpg
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That wouldn't have worked either. The blade is not rigid enough to make the cut the way I had to do it. Besides, its not the right tool if there isn't one around.
 
Someone should make a mult-bladed folder with not just different blade shapes, but different thickness and grinds.
 
I just watched "How is it made" on science channel. I DVR everything related to knives and cutting tools.
Anyway, the episode was about making drill bits. At some point they showed close up of the cutter blade, which cuts completed drill bits form the steel bars.
Obviously, it's not a knife blade, but what it was - about 5mm thick rectangular bar, that's it. That was enough to cut through the metal.

Given enough force 90deg. inclusive angle is sufficient to cut through the metal ;) That's one tough use folder. No worries about tip breakage or edge chipping.
 
Gator97 said:
I just watched "How is it made" on science channel. I DVR everything related to knives and cutting tools.
Anyway, the episode was about making drill bits. At some point they showed close up of the cutter blade, which cuts completed drill bits form the steel bars.
Obviously, it's not a knife blade, but what it was - about 5mm thick rectangular bar, that's it. That was enough to cut through the metal.

Given enough force 90deg. inclusive angle is sufficient to cut through the metal ;) That's one tough use folder. No worries about tip breakage or edge chipping.
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haha. it would be a brick in the pocket.
 
5.56 said:
I carry a razor sharp SnG with a flat grind and I have no problem cutting anything. My knife sees everything from light duty letter opening to heavy cutting with thick ply cardboard, all types of plastic strapping, and even some wood carving.
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Maybe if you were using a nice thin bladed knife you wouldn't consider it "heavy cutting" :D
 
I think there is a misguided impression that if a folder is overbuilt then it must suck at cutting.
The second misguided notion is about blade profiles: too often I read people describing thick blades as "sharpened pry-bars", regardless of the grind, the edge profile or the overall width of the blade.
Case in point, the SNG/SMF: why does the hard core Spyderco crowd dismisses it as a good slicer when most of them praise the large Manix? Look carefully and you will notice that both knives have virtually the same blade shape and grind. And they are made of the same steel. The difference is that the large Manix has a ridiculously small pivot (and washers), although it weighs close to double a CC SMF. Both slice equally well, but one is overweight and the other is overbuilt. Those that know me also know that I am quite the opposite of a Strider fan.

Now, those same people point to the Caly as the perfect slicer. Anyone tried to slice a tomato with a 3" blade lately (grape tomatoes do not count)? The reason why someone would use a folder in the kitchen totally eludes me: folders accumulate dirt (and given the warranties that most major brands carry nowadays, they cannot be taken apart for cleaning) and are not dishwasher-safe. Ironically, those defending the use of extra-thin "slicers" for kitchen purposes are very often the same ones arguing that one should use the best tool for the job at hand.

My point is that there is more to a blade's cutting ability than just its overall thickness.
Also, some makers offer compound grinds that have reinforced tips for piercing or prying while preserving a relatively thin edge.

I like debating ideas but I saw how this same discussion degenerated on the Spyderco forum and I think some there are trying to convince themselves that if you need a good slicer then you have to accept the fact that it might fail more easily. Funnily, this coincides with the Manix 2 fiasco courtesy of Jim Ankerson.
 
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LorenzoL said:
I think there is a misguided impression that if a folder is overbuilt then it must suck at cutting.
The second misguided notion is about blade profiles: too often I read people describing thick blades as "sharpened pry-bars", regardless of the grind, the edge profile or the overall width of the blade.
Case in point, the SNG/SMF: why does the hard core Spyderco crowd dismisses it as a good slicer when most of them praise the large Manix? Look carefully and you will notice that both knives have virtually the same blade shape and grind. And they are made of the same steel. The difference is that the large Manix has a ridiculously small pivot (and washers), although it weighs close to double a CC SMF. Both slice equally well, but one is overweight and the other is overbuilt. Those that know me also know that I am quite the opposite of a Strider fan.

Now, those same people point to the Caly as the perfect slicer. Anyone tried to slice a tomato with a 3" blade lately (grape tomatoes do not count)? The reason why someone would use a folder in the kitchen totally eludes me: folders accumulate dirt (and given the warranties that most major brands carry nowadays, they cannot be taken apart for cleaning) and are not dishwasher-safe. Ironically, those defending the use of extra-thin "slicers" for kitchen purposes are very often the same ones arguing that one should use the best tool for the job at hand.

My point is that there is more to a blade's cutting ability than just its overall thickness.
Also, some makers offer compound grinds that have reinforced tips for piercing or prying while preserving a relatively thin edge.

I like debating ideas but I saw how this same discussion degenerated on the Spyderco forum and I think some there are trying to convince themselves that if you need a good slicer then you have to accept the fact that it might fail more easily. Funnily, this coincides with the Manix 2 fiasco courtesy of Jim Ankerson.
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The sharpened Pry Bar thing carried over from the FB people who like thin FB's.

There are some who think that every folder must have 1/8" thick blades with dismal Taper, needle sharp points or it's a Sharpened Pry Bar.

I would like to see people slice tomatoes with their 3" folders too.

The common misconception is that thicker bladed folders don't cut, not sure were that came from, but it's just not fact period.
 
Ankerson said:
The common misconception is that thicker bladed folders don't cut, not sure were that came from
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Actually, I am not sure where that comes from, this particular thread had an argument that thin blades cut better, and not that thick blades "don't cut"...
Like I said in earlier post, 90deg angle on rectangular bar was sufficient to cut the steel drill bits.
It's not the matter of can't or don't cut, it's just the effort and speed, efficiency in other words.

For certain cutting tasks blade thickness won't matter that much, I have a few yanagibas 4-5 mm thick each, that is also dictated by their length 12-14", but still, they're the best slicers for fish at least. Obviously, chisel grind edge at 15 or lower angle makes all the difference.

For other works, thickness matters, when the blade has to cut something harder than proteins and it has to sink into cutting object or ingredient completely. E.g. cardboard, large fruits or vegetables, whatever else. And there, I am not sure where or why do we have an argument :)
 
Gator97 said:
Actually, I am not sure where that comes from, this particular thread had an argument that thin blades cut better, and not that thick blades "don't cut"...
Like I said in earlier post, 90deg angle on rectangular bar was sufficient to cut the steel drill bits.
It's not the matter of can't or don't cut, it's just the effort and speed, efficiency in other words.

For certain cutting tasks blade thickness won't matter that much, I have a few yanagibas 4-5 mm thick each, that is also dictated by their length 12-14", but still, they're the best slicers for fish at least. Obviously, chisel grind edge at 15 or lower angle makes all the difference.

For other works, thickness matters, when the blade has to cut something harder than proteins and it has to sink into cutting object or ingredient completely. E.g. cardboard, large fruits or vegetables, whatever else. And there, I am not sure where or why do we have an argument :)
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There is a lot more to it than than just Spine Thickness.

Edge and Blade geometry play a huge part in cutting ease as does the thickness of the edge, things some tend to overlook or they just don't know any better.

So just because some knife doesn't have a 1/8" spine doesn't mean it won't cut or slice well.

Like in my Cardboard cutting series, people would be suprised if they watched the videos. ;)
 
Ankerson said:
There is a lot more to it than than just Spine Thickness.

Edge and Blade geometry play a huge part in cutting ease as does the thickness of the edge, things some tend to overlook or they just don't know any better.

So just because some knife doesn't have a 1/8" spine doesn't mean it won't cut or slice well.

Like in my Cardboard cutting series, people would be suprised if they watched the videos. ;)
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Right on. Watch those Busses and the Demko folder slicle paper and cardboard.:thumbup:
 
Those that know me know that I own many Spyderco's, including thin bladed slicers like the UKPK.

That being said, I primarily carry an SnG.

Why? Because with it's full flat grind and a nice sharp edge, it will do 99% of the slicing that I need it to do and still perform the "hard use" tasks that it has earned it's reputation from.
 
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