Whats happened to Brass?

Personally, I don't like brass, and I don't really like nickel silver. However, my favorite maker, Robbin Hudson, uses brass and does so perfectly.

I do like to use bronze though, right off the grinder it looks an awful lot like brass :), it looks better after a few days though ;).

Isn't nickel silver brass with tin and some nickel?

Matt
 
NickWheeler said:
Patryn, isn't that gold anodized Ti?
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Nope. They solid brass for the handles. The weight on the knife is a good deal more than the regular 710 series.
 
just an aside about rusting steels vs. the use of tarnishing brass

the steel used is the core of the knife, where functionality should be the basis for what steel is used. higher carbon steels that rust much more then stainless, or low carbon, often have much higher levels of performance in edge holding and strength, hence are a better choice for many applications. an example of wich is d2 (semi stainless :rolleyes:), while it may rust more then 440c, you can get unbeleivable edge holding out of it, and strength that was yet not thought possible (swamp rat), but it does indeed rust.

its like creating a performance vehicle, the last thing you think about is apulstry, the first thing is the engine. and one of the first engines your likely to want is the one that polutes the most, but has the most power.

there are better handle materials then brass (performance wise), that are redily available, but steal choices from carbon to stainless have a lot more drawbacks to consider

just my forum observations
 
I use mostly nickle silver, with a little stainless, but on a lot of knives I wish I could use brass, because to me a working knife with brass furiture just seems "right" on a lot of designs. I do have to say that I seldom will use brass or nickle silver with stainless, or use stainless with a carbon steel blade, to me they should age and patina together or not at all.
 
mete said:
There are many types of bronze each with different color and different tarnishing. I came across a new one for me - silver bronze ,copper with a few percent of silver , used for electrical contacts.
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Hey, ain't Shibuichi about the same thing? And Shakudo would be the traditional Japanese "bronze" made of copper with a few percent gold instead of silver. It can take some really neat patinas.

I do like the idea of using brass in some cases to add color to a knife. However, lately on my minis I just use gold if I want more color. :)
 
i still really like brass and use it just as much as any other fitting material. there are certain handle materials that just demand it's use rather than nickel or s.s. .
 
I really like brass but, I was told a couple years ago that brass was passe so I steared clear and stuck with NS. I use 420 stainless as well but, don't enjoy soldering it. Brass, N-S, copper are a joy to silver solder, no fuss/no muss but, stainless is a pain in the butt. I'll usually use the stainless on a damascus blade with JB Weld...usually.
 
Jay Fisher,

I sure am glad I came back to this thread for another look. That knife set you posted - all I can say is WOW and Magnificent. I do like the top and middle ones a big bunch. I am sorely tempted to ask if I may try to emulate that top one, but I won't.

RL
 
I must have been born in the wrong century, I love Brass more than anything on a knife including Ti :D

I have a little Case Canoe in NS with Brass and Amber bone, I must spend the best part of the day rubbing it on my pants leg to see how shiny I can get it :rolleyes: LOL
 
I'm really impressed that someone brought up shibuichi and shakudo. Shibuichi, however, has 75% silver, 25% copper for the traditional alloy. The name means something like "three quarters silver" or something. More recently, shibuichi has come to mean any alloy that has silver and copper in high quantities. Something as low as "a few percent" silver wouldn't be called shibuichi. Shakudo traditionally has 4% gold and 96% copper. And, while we're at it, kuromido is 99% copper and 1% arsenic, and kuroshibuichi is shibuichi made with 25% shakudo instead of copper. There will be a test on tuesday...
But seriously, I'm glad you mentioned shibuichi because I'd love to see someone do shibuichi bolsters. I've been doing some pins using it by itself or in a jewelers mosaic but you don't really get to appreciate it for what it is. I'd do bolsters, myself, but I'm just now getting into hidden tang blades.

- Chris
 
I look at it this way, If you are making a period knife then you need to pay attention to what was used in the period. And then what are we building, in my opinion brass and N.S, are right at home on Bowie's and a maybe on others. Brass complements a lot of handle materials, Ironwood for one. Gib
 
Hesparus-
Thanks for the clarification on Shibuichi, and for mentioning those arsenic alloys- I had never heard of them. Do you know what Sentoku is? Always wondered about that one.
I've seen Shakudo and Shibuichi used in modern knives, but mostly only by those working in the Japanese tradition, or inspired by the Japanese style. Sounds like you're already set up with your own, but for anyone else interested in the stuff, it's available online at Reactive Metals Studios. Those of you who don't like the look of "tarnished" metal may not be interested in intentionally creating a patina, but all kinds of neat colors are possible. Deep purple to black, grays, green, olive green, sky blue, etc.

edit: I should have Googled before asking. I found a really neat site on Naginata that gave the compositions of several more types of "bronze".-

"By the 18th century, metals such as gold, silver, and the copper alloys of shakudo (30% - 70% gold), shibuichi (25% silver), sambo gin (33% silver), rogin (50% - 70% silver), karakane (a Chinese metal consisting of approximately 20% tin and lead), and sentoku (10% tin and zinc) were also used, primarily as decorative inlays in the tsuba. The application of various proprietary chemical compounds to these precious metals gave them a wide variety of colors."
 
There was another grand old knifemaker who used brass. Bill Scagel never, as far as we know, used nickle silver or 'german silver'. If you see what looks like silver on one of his knives, it is silver, real silver! He did on occasion use aluminum for spacers, but they are rather rare. He used brass, red bronze and coin or real silver.

I personally chose brass because I feel it is honest and I like it. Many years ago (1950's) I purchased some 'German Silver' for much more than it was worth, the man who sold it to me claimed that it was valuable due to its silver content. I soon found out differently. You would be suprised how many believe nickle silver has real silver in it.

I also like copper, red bronz and coin silver. Copper was one of the first metals used on this contenent and I have always liked it.

Many claim that Brass has no class, they can speak as they wish, to me it is simply a mindless statement made by those who fail to understand the herritage that comes through craftsmen who chose to think for themselves. It matters little what materials they chose but how they develop them in their work.
 
Ed Fowler said:
Many claim that Brass has no class, they can speak as they wish, to me it is simply a mindless statement made by those who fail to understand the herritage that comes through craftsmen who chose to think for themselves. It matters little what materials they chose but how they develop them in their work.
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Well said Ed....

It has always amazed me how some well placed "rear end of a horse" can make a generalized statement about what is "in" or not, merely based on their own personal preference....and then it becomes law.
 
Ed, You said it all, well done. Gib

Ed Fowler said:
There was another grand old knifemaker who used brass. Bill Scagel never, as far as we know, used nickle silver or 'german silver'. If you see what looks like silver on one of his knives, it is silver, real silver! He did on occasion use aluminum for spacers, but they are rather rare. He used brass, red bronze and coin or real silver.

I personally chose brass because I feel it is honest and I like it. Many years ago (1950's) I purchased some 'German Silver' for much more than it was worth, the man who sold it to me claimed that it was valuable due to its silver content. I soon found out differently. You would be suprised how many believe nickle silver has real silver in it.

I also like copper, red bronz and coin silver. Copper was one of the first metals used on this contenent and I have always liked it.

Many claim that Brass has no class, they can speak as they wish, to me it is simply a mindless statement made by those who fail to understand the herritage that comes through craftsmen who chose to think for themselves. It matters little what materials they chose but how they develop them in their work.
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Greg: Their statements become law, but they become law to the sheep who seem to have difficulty making decisions for themselves and chose to avoid challenging the proclamations issued by the chosen few. I am amazed that so few ask - WHY?
The most important thing a knife maker can do is to reach out and touch perfecton in that which they most love to do. This is only possible when we are able to do so free from the chains of tradition that come to pass from those who have the extrreme ability to ignore knowledge, yet are heard widely in our haven, the world of knives.
 
Amen Ed!!!

I believe the word is "Dogma" and there seems to be an aweful lot of it floating around the world these days. There also seems to be far less dreamers and far too many followers anymore.

"Imagination is more important than knowledge" Albert Einstein

Dallas
 
Will52100 said:
I do have to say that I seldom will use brass or nickle silver with stainless, or use stainless with a carbon steel blade, to me they should age and patina together or not at all.
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Very good point indeed, especially for blades that will be used.

Brass also needs natural handle materials. Micartas, G-10 and CF all look best with stainless.
 
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