What's The Most Detailed & Precise Counterfeit You've Seen So Far?

[Mistwalker]

(1) Whenever possible, the best options are authorized sellers (2) or buying directly, if the company sells on their website. Be knowledgeable of map pricing and what one knife usually goes for also helps detect a fake if the sale seems 'too good', it might be. If the suspected fake is also mirroring the price of the genuine item, then refer back to points 1 and 2

I agree with some of this to the extent possible. But some of the cases I have seen my friends are old men just trying to supplement their fixed income in a world of insane gas, grocery, and rent prices, by reselling merchandise the got at a price point good enough they can flip for a profit, but grew up in a world where precision CNC counterfeiting wasn't a thing. So telling them to only buy new from dealers at MSRP seems a bit extreme to me, when a lot of us here take advantage of the depreciated prices in the secondary market here on the exchange on a daily basis. I'd rather learn more about what's happening so I can teach them what to watch for in the new and somewhat messed up world we have today.

I got suckered into buying a counterfeit Kershaw Leek at a knife show. Box looked legit, knife looked legit, flipped it open and played with it some and I couldn't tell at all. I have owned Leeks before and there was nothing that stood out to me about the knife or packaging. After I got home I realized that the etch on the blade was raised and a little fuzzy. Started researching online and found out it was a counterfeit out of China. I put it back in the box and threw it on top of my bookshelf, wrote "counterfeit" on the box with a sharpy so no one will mistake it for a genuine. I haven't touched it since, just makes me mad to think about it.

I save them too. I've etched counterfeit on some, just so I can use them as a teaching tool for my friends.

Copies, well marked arising in China trade. Buck, Benchmade, Pro-Tech and Kershaw are what one sees often. A Paradigm with everything one will find. Correct box and inserts, all markings correct. Stuff like magic bolsters, Magna-Cut, so on. A Stimulus with only a safety difference. Launch models.

It will be interesting to see how US dealers of autos will stay in business.

Exactly, where I've seen the most cloning so far is in the OTF market. Makes me glad I don't care for knives whose blades have no static physical connection to the handle. It took me years to be okay with leaving the house with just a stout made folder sometimes instead of a small fixed blade.

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[Mistwalker]

I just saw a news story about how the first import ships from China bearing goods with the145% tariffs are arriving to the USA half
empty. I have also heard reports that shipping is nearing a standstill from China. If true thats one way of stopping fakes.

I would have zero problems with us becoming less dependent on China and go back to producing more of our own goods.

 

[RPZIP]

I bought a new "Gerber Strongarm" from a seller in Poland. Although it was a rather cheap price I figured Poland was an unlikely place where anyone would be peddling Chinese Gerber fakes.

Well, wrong. What clued me in was the paperwork inside the box was like a Xerox copy, and some misaligned webbing on the back of the sheath belt loop and the character of the hardware. So I did a quick search on YouTube and sure enough someone had detailed how to spot fake Gerber Strongarms.

However, the quality of the knife fabrication is very high indeed. Overall except for my observations above the sheath is executed very well also.

So lesson learned, and I have a "Gerber Strongarm" beater.

 

[TSR2]

I have some anomalous knives that if they are counterfeits they are exceptionally well made counterfeits. So I'm curious what the most precise and detailed counterfeits other people have encountered have been.

A newbie friend with resources bought me 2 'Shiro' and a "Hinderer", all of which are superbly executed. The blade steels are something of a concern despite markings. (He now is vehemently against clones, etc.)

 

[Planterz]

I got suckered into buying a counterfeit Kershaw Leek at a knife show. Box looked legit, knife looked legit, flipped it open and played with it some and I couldn't tell at all. I have owned Leeks before and there was nothing that stood out to me about the knife or packaging. After I got home I realized that the etch on the blade was raised and a little fuzzy. Started researching online and found out it was a counterfeit out of China. I put it back in the box and threw it on top of my bookshelf, wrote "counterfeit" on the box with a sharpy so no one will mistake it for a genuine. I haven't touched it since, just makes me mad to think about it.

Keep the torsion bar as a spare and maybe the screws, and chuck the rest.

 

[Mistwalker]

A newbie friend with resources bought me 2 'Shiro' and a "Hinderer", all of which are superbly executed. The blade steels are something of a concern despite markings. (He now is vehemently against clones, etc.)

The Shiros are one company I would have zero experience with, and knowing what I know now about the high end knife counterfeiting, I would only buy one from someone I trusted to know the difference...which unfortunately is no-one in my circle of friends so I've never even tried to buy one on the secondary market.

 

[CyberRacer]

I bought a fake Benchmade 940 a while back. Size of the blade font was the only real giveaway. Pretty true to the real thing. Was able to get my money back since I bought off of Ebay. Also don't understand the term "clone". It's a fake, phony, or counterfeit Clone implies there is some connection to the real thing which doesn't exist. The term sets my teeth on edge.

 

[ShaiHulud]

I use to buy from a seller on ebay with a good rating, because my own seller rating is 100% i expect the same from whoever I buy from, however to keep them unamed they had to leave ebay because they were victim to too many return frauds (people buying a legitimate item then returning a clone, to both steal from the seller and get rid of the fake)
And it has taught me to be extremely picky from who I buy from. I want to say I havnt bought a fake yet, but I guess it can eventually happen to anyone--- especially if sellers don't know they are selling fakes. Thats why if you buy from authorized sellers, you know they are buying from the manufacturer directly.

 

[Dagoth_Blur]

Some of the 940 Osbornes are really convincing. Shame they sell them as counterfeits and not clones, pretty scummy. I shutter thinking about how many people have one and don't even know it.

 

[Mistwalker]

I use to buy from a seller......

You should edit the name of the auction site out of your post or just say that deep water place or whatever.... It's against the rules here to name any vendor or auction site who isn't a member of Blade Forums.

That said, I find the information itself very helpful thank you, I will warn my friends who sell here and on multiple selling sites about this practice. I hadn't thought of that. I've only seen where the swaps were happening in person. But man, how would you prove what was in the box you shipped without doing an unedited video of the entire process. That's nuts.

 

[soundless]

Due to my real-world job I can tell you China is ruthless when it comes to faked goods and they get better every year, take luxury watches as another example. A few years back you could spot a faux Rolex from a few feet away, nowadays you have semi-custom sub 1000$ options where even I, although I'm pretty versed in the subject, would have a hard time telling one apart from a real one without using a loupe or opening up the watch.

Same goes for knives sadly, a lot of small makers are affected pretty badly, winterblades comes to mind or several other shops on the smaller end of the spectrum.
The big ones like Spyderco and Benchmade are pretty easy to tell for most Models however fakes for Balisongs as well as some Automatic Knives like Microtech are getting incredibly hard to tell apart if you go above the 50$ pricetag. Tariffs won't change anything, China is already triangle shipping to mitigate the costs.
It sucks and I've seen it ruin smaller brands in other hobbies but I don't have a solution in hand, as long as there is money to be made, someone somewhere is surely going to throw his morals overboard in order to make said money...

 

[Arathol]

You should edit the name of the auction site out of your post or just say that deep water place or whatever.... It's against the rules here to name any vendor or auction site who isn't a member of Blade Forums.

Well...no.....Its against the rules to post links to said vendors or anything related to or that might be construed as advertising for said vendors.....Otherwise the only knives that we would be allowed to discuss are the ones made or sold by a member here.

 

[Mistwalker]

Well...no.....Its against the rules to post links to said vendors or anything related to or that might be construed as advertising for said vendors.....Otherwise the only knives that we would be allowed to discuss are the ones made or sold by a member here.

Okay, I didn't think about it that way. I just remember the answers always being something along the lines of "the big water place" or "the big river place" when people were asked where they got something. And I just got it in my head to never name the places as a habit I guess.

 

[Alberta Ed]

I only buy knives that I am sure are genuine, usually direct from the manufacturer or from an established knife retailer.

 

[Quiet]

I bought a fake Benchmade 940 a while back. Size of the blade font was the only real giveaway. Pretty true to the real thing. Was able to get my money back since I bought off of Ebay. Also don't understand the term "clone". It's a fake, phony, or counterfeit Clone implies there is some connection to the real thing which doesn't exist. The term sets my teeth on edge.

Agreed. Some folks on this board have talked about how clones aren't that bad since "Well, eventually the person who loves that clone will want the real thing and buy it", which I am pretty certain hardly ever happens. I have found a couple of knife subs (including one specifically for clones) where there are a ton of posts all talking about the same thing: "Why would I pay hundreds of dollars to buy a real (insert one of several commonly discussed makers/companies here) when this $38 knife from Temu looks exactly like the real thing? It still cuts!!" There are a ton of people out there who will have zero issue buying the cheap copy, don't care, and won't ever care about an American company getting their designs ripped off. They just want the knife, and they want it cheap.

This is why I am glad that talk about clones or trying to portray the companies to crap them out, in a positive light is frowned upon here.

 

[madcap_magician]

I bought a fake Benchmade 940 a while back. Size of the blade font was the only real giveaway. Pretty true to the real thing. Was able to get my money back since I bought off of Ebay. Also don't understand the term "clone". It's a fake, phony, or counterfeit Clone implies there is some connection to the real thing which doesn't exist. The term sets my teeth on edge.

I think it's all equally bad, but I would say a counterfeit is one where the knife is copied down to the branding and marking of the actual manufacturer, and a clone is where the design is copied but either re-branded and marked by the copying manufacturer or is sold sterile.

 

[Synov]

Best I've ever seen

 

[Arathol]

I think it's all equally bad, but I would say a counterfeit is one where the knife is copied down to the branding and marking of the actual manufacturer, and a clone is where the design is copied but either re-branded and marked by the copying manufacturer or is sold sterile.

OK, so what if the "clone" was available before the "real thing" was even on the market ? Is that still a clone?

 

[stiletto13]

Brands I have seen faked are cold steel,kershaw. Spyderco, crkt ,microtech,protech Boker, Buck, benchmade, various Italian autos and Chris Reeve plus Strider. Some years ago the fakes were crudely made jokes,easily seen for what they were. However recently I've seen and been fooled by some really well made ones ,cold steel especially. It's not enough to check the blade markings anymore or look for sloppy details. The mafket is flooded with fakes of every thing.. I wonder if we knife collectors are getting a little taste of what art collectors or rare book collectors have had to deal with though at another level. What a sad pain in the ass to triple check every purchase, to trust nothing and no one then still get burned.

 

[Mistwalker]

OK, so what if the "clone" was available before the "real thing" was even on the market ? Is that still a clone?

I don't know if clone is the right word in this case, but I would say no. I'm acquainted with an incident that happened some years back, where the owner of one company sent a cease and desist letter to the owner of another company, over a knife that had a similar functioning (but very different looking) opening feature to the opening feature of their knives. And the the second company, which is a much older company than the first, sent a reply with a photo copy of an old paper invoice listing that specific model of knife being sold several years before the first company was a company. Then told them if they wanted to sue them, go right ahead. They did sue them and they lost. And the the owner of the first company has hated everything about, and everyone affiliated with, the second company ever since.